Grok, my dogs think you're missing out on the liver!
I joke with my mom (and myself) that I make hearty treats for the boys and really should try them out. To date, mom is not interested. (me neither!)
Originally Posted by Grok
And one of the shocking things to me is the simultaneous void, crushing weight, of loss. The incongruent simultaneity. Both exist at the same time in seeming mutually exclusive existence.
Quite profound and a true representation of me, often! I know that I'm blessed with children, family, pets, home, friends, work, health. Still, the weight of sadness (feelings) can and does exist in the background and from time to time, on the forefront.
Knowledge versus feelings. Or is it knowledge AND feelings? They do coexist. Knowing to let knowledge lead. Feeling the weight and getting sucked back in...until knowledge brings me back. Deliberate thoughts to bring me back in those weaker moments.
So, how do I apply...I'm accepting your decisions and behaving accordingly...in this situation?
Nephew dropped off the ticket to his graduation. I accept the ticket and come back inside for a bit to eat. A couple hours later, it dawns on me.
AP's son is also a member of the graduating class and will be at graduation on Thursday. How did I totally forget this critical detail? I'm now not sure that I can attend. What would I do if I crossed paths with her? Her mom?
I suspect H and AP won't be sitting together as their relationship is still a secret. But even that is a possible interaction that I'll encounter.
I'm in a bind. Do I attend graduation?
If I don't, my D will be so uncomfortable going alone.
What is the recommendation? Do I attend? If I do attend, what do I do when I run into her? Cross paths with her?
“I'm accepting your decisions and behaving accordingly.”
How to apply.
Break it into components.
So, “I'm accepting your decisions”. Do that. Not try. Do. Accept H’s decisions. Well, more accept his right to choose to make decisions. You need not condone or agree with said decisions, just his right to do so.
Then the second part: “behaving accordingly”. Do, behave as you would. Or would’ve, if that helps. Meaning, if when you accept H’s right to choose, you let go of some oddly binding threads. It’s: H is going to do what he is going to do, YOU do what you should do. You control you. Letting go, removes H’s (and AP’s) power over you. Btw, it’s power over you that you are allowing. You are reinforcing it. Let go.
Originally Posted by MamaG
AP's son is also a member of the graduating class and will be at graduation on Thursday. How did I totally forget this critical detail? I'm now not sure that I can attend.
Big Red Stop Sign!
What do you mean, not sure you can attend. Stop giving them power over you!
You choose your path. You decide your path. Not them!
Your life, your direction is not to be based upon their actions.
Originally Posted by MamaG
What would I do if I crossed paths with her? Her mom?
I suspect H and AP won't be sitting together as their relationship is still a secret. But even that is a possible interaction that I'll encounter.
I'm in a bind. Do I attend graduation?
If I don't, my D will be so uncomfortable going alone.
What is the recommendation? Do I attend? If I do attend, what do I do when I run into her? Cross paths with her?
Attend your nephew’s graduation. Nephew dropped off a ticket, and asked you, wants you, to be there. So go.
If you cross paths with AP’s son, congratulate him by name for his hard work and graduating.
If you cross paths with AP. Be cordial. Short conversation, if it is even becomes necessary. Treat her like anyone else. Everyone else. She is nothing special. Meaning, graduation is not the forum for any discussion or morality, or cheating, or all that. Stick to the high road!
It’s nephew’s graduation. He is the star of this. Your reason for even being there. Stick to that. Make the day about him. Not H, AP, or any of their shenanigans.
Behave accordingly. What would you do, if all the BS H has done, didn’t happen? Just regarding this specific graduation ceremony of nephew. You’d go. You’d behave in a certain manner. Speak to people. Congratulate people. Etc. So, do that.
I’ve had graduations, music recitals, socials, and now weddings. XW and OM are involved. In my face. Yes, at the beginning it was difficult. It hurt. Now, weddings and the receptions are a blast. I dance with everyone. Talk to everyone. While XW and OM skulk around.
Truth will out. You need not force it. Everything comes out eventually. Live and love your life - accordingly. Responsibility. Properly. With accountability. Respectfully (to self and others). Genuinely. Sincerely.
Live those tenets.
So, with those convictions in mind:
Originally Posted by MamaG
Do I attend? If I do attend, what do I do when I run into her? Cross paths with her?
It’s not about her. Remember who this day is for.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
And one of the shocking things to me is the simultaneous void, crushing weight, of loss. The incongruent simultaneity. Both exist at the same time in seeming mutually exclusive existence.
Quite profound and a true representation of me, often! I know that I'm blessed with children, family, pets, home, friends, work, health. Still, the weight of sadness (feelings) can and does exist in the background and from time to time, on the forefront.
It’s the journey through the stage of depression.
Depression follows bargaining. Once bargaining - the last ditch effort to try to feel the old normal - has finally failed one enters depression. This stage is brooding, feeling sad, lost, dark, empty, and such. There is a void. A loss of wanting. A missing of fulfillment, or reasons for.
It’s perfectly normal. It’s grief.
And temporary.
Still, one has to walk through it. Walk their path. There are no shortcuts. Grief will be over, acceptance will come, when it does. And not one second earlier.
Most of one’s “figuring it out” occurs subconsciously. Ah, the subconscious. The true workhouse and seat/power of one’s self. Our conscious self is that tip of iceberg sticking out. Our subconscious the huge bulk beneath the waves. The ocean’s surface the boundary between conscious and subconscious.
The power of one’s subconscious is truly amazing when realized.
The subconscious mind is incredible. Consider what you are doing right now. Reading my words. Black scrawls against a white background your subconscious identifies as letters. It stitches those together into words. Further appending the words to sentences, then paragraphs, and so on.
Each step along the way, your mind assigns meaning to those words, sentences, paragraphs. Furthering the meaning and intent of the author as you read more and more. All in real time!
Several paragraphs in and a conclusion or new point instantaneously changes your entire interpretation. Jokes are an excellent example of that.
A real life conversation, face to face, is even more astonishing from a computational perspective. Again, in real time, we listen, consider, formulate, respond, almost immediately to the other person’s words. Words and meaning that literally you had no idea of what they would say. Yet, one’s subconscious mind is such a powerhouse/workhorse of computation it is all happens seamlessly.
The conscious mind pales in comparison. Consider this experience. Actually, please do this experiment. And really focus on it. Full conscious effort:
Sit like you’re driving. (For simplification I will consider left side driving. In truth it matters not, just saves me writing left and right differently.)
So, sit like you’re driving. Close your eyes. Imagine the road before you. Two driving lanes in each direction with a boulevard of green grass between them.
You are in the leftmost lane. There is no traffic. Just you.
I want you to change lanes from the left one to the right one. Really focus on the steering. Like I said, no traffic. No need for signalling, or shoulder checking, or checking the mirrors, etc. I just want you to pay attention to your imagined steering wheel and where the car goes.
So, sitting with hands at 9 and 3. Eyes closed. Count down 3, 2, 1. Make a lane change.
Reset yourself and do it a few more times to get the feel.
Now open your eyes and do it again. Paid attention to what your hands doing. (If I was there, I’d could just tell when your eye we’re closed.)
So, where did your hands go? A simple lane change to the right. You likely steered to the right. Duh. Did you anyone steer to the left?
Most likely something like hands from 9 and 3, to 12 and 6, and back to 9 and 3.
Congratulations. You drove over the curb, across the sidewalk, and crashed into a house!
A lane change requires steering the car back to straight. There is a steering input of equal amplitude and duration in the opposite direction to return the car to straight in the new lane. 9 and 3, to 12 and 6, then 180 degrees left to 6 and 12, and then back to 9 and 3.
Do the imaginary lane change again. Eyes open. Even with this new information you likely still won’t consciously steer like that. It feels wrong when you pay attention.
Of course we obviously do steer left, as we do successful lane changes all the time. If you remember, watch yourself next time you do a lane change. It’s wild to see! You do it, yet your conscious mind thinks it’s wrong. I’ve done this experiment with people for over thirty years now, and I do not consciously steer properly. lol. And I know the answer. Yet it is wrong to me.
So why?
The true powerhouse is our subconscious. It knows and it does.
The conscious mind is for new stuff. It programs our subconscious.
In all the times I’ve performed this experiment with people, the only people to ever get it right, that it felt right to - sixteen year olds that were learning to drive. They had all the steps in their conscious mind. After all, they were learning how to drive. Of course, as inexperienced drivers their skills were poor. Like anything, we learn by rout. By repetition.
Expertise comes with programming one’s subconscious with proper good methods. Unfortunately, most folks program themselves with poor methods. No turn signal, not staying in their lane, and so on. If one’s subconscious workhorse were programmed correctly the “bad habits” are not even performed.
You see, the conscious mind just sets our direction. Makes a decision. In this case a lane change. It starts the action and then turns over the completion of that action to our subconscious. That’s why, when you learn something right the first time is it so much easier. No habit to break.
This is applicable to all facets of life. Especially here and now.
The water’s surface between tip and bulk of iceberg, that boundary between conscious and subconscious: communication is easiest when the water is calm. When the surface is frothy and turbulent, our conscious mind cannot peer inward, nor hear what our deep self is saying.
When one is calm and at peace, one can see a little into that subconscious realm. Our light can illuminate some of what is a few feet below the surface. Likewise our subconscious can be more easily heard.
When learning a new skill, frustration impedes. It’s why we take breaks. Why classes are only so long. We are bit by bit programming, learning, to steer to the left when actually shifting to the right. Even though we won’t, and don’t realize it.
Focus on self, let go, gal, etc. Purposeful conscious controlled actions to alter your programmed default responses.
Originally Posted by MamaG
Knowledge versus feelings. Or is it knowledge AND feelings? They do coexist. Knowing to let knowledge lead. Feeling the weight and getting sucked back in...until knowledge brings me back. Deliberate thoughts to bring me back in those weaker moments.
It’s knowledge and feelings and beliefs and physical action. All four are intertwined.
However, beliefs. Convictions. Values. This is the big one. Those tenets and principles of your life. We are thrown into the fray. A journey and situation we didn’t ask for. Everything gets mixed up. Our beliefs get turned upset down as the one we trust(ed) the most betrays us.
Takes time for us to right ourselves. To find our direction. To (re)program our subconscious. Which requires first controlling our conscious actions and thoughts. Which influence our feelings. Which all influence/alter our convictions. Which influences our thoughts and consciousness.
Strengthen that which serves. Craft that which you aspire to. Discard/alter that which does not, or no longer, serves.
Deep stuff. Especially while within depression. Yet, that is the crux of depression, IMHO. Finding those answers. Reprogramming yourself.
Counterintuitively, the best and fastest way, is to not focus on it. Recall the lane change. You have a lifetime of experiences, and tenets that have served you. Yes, some tweaking is likely. However, you have a good soul. It’s just hurt. Trust yourself.
Do focus your conscious mind on other stuff. Allow your subconscious to churn away. Believe me, it churns best when we don’t bother it. lol. You’ve done lots of inner work already. This is why. This is the time when all that inner work, beliefs, values, and so on, gets reconciled and accepted. Have faith.
Do utilize your conscious mind, as it’s meant to. Decide. Start the action. Then let your workhorse takeover.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
Attend your nephew’s graduation. Nephew dropped off a ticket, and asked you, wants you, to be there. So go.
Yes, this is all true. Makes sense. I decide that I'll go.
D and I drove up. On our ride, SIL sent us both a text of where there were seats for us. We walked in and I was a bit uncomfortable. Perhaps more uncomfortable than I was willing to admit.
Originally Posted by DnJ
Behave accordingly. What would you do, if all the BS H has done, didn’t happen? Just regarding this specific graduation ceremony of nephew. You’d go. You’d behave in a certain manner. Speak to people. Congratulate people. Etc. So, do that.
As we approached the row, SIL has her arms out wide for an embrace. Ok, I'll respond to that. I'll dance with SIL differently than I did at D's graduation. It wasn't the plan but it is what I would've done had H not gotten into his shenanigans. Walked by nephew's GF and niece - embraced them both with a hello. Walked by H with no greeting as I hear him trying to still dance to the old music. H says, "hello" with a hope in his tone. I couldn't even look at him never mind muster a greeting. I kept inching past him and to my seat. I know the family in the row in front of us was all listening and watching. None of them have seen us together since last year.
D sat between H and I. She was uncomfortable but her behavior was not obvious to all. H's legs shook and he needed 2 tobacco chews through the 90 minutes. Never needed any before. Other than the leg shaking, outwardly, H behaved like life is grand. Faking it till he makes it.
Well, if I'm being honest, I faked it till I made it. I was uncomfortable in my own skin and remained visibly controlled. Well, this is graduation #3 that both of us attending with inspirational speeches we can't avoid. They all focus on being authentic, living without fear, face challenges, relationships are what matter most when you look back, don't hide from your feelings, and on and on. Other than laughing with D and a couple family members in front of me, I remained quiet and reserved.
Minutes into sitting: H: D do you want to get something to eat with me? D: No thank you. I ate before I came.
H did all he could to ignore D for the rest of the 90 minutes and engaged with niece's BF, as BF was on the other side of H. I know H was listening to speeches and everything going on around him. Hypervigilant. H often paused and I could see his mask come off when I looked in D's direction in conversation (I could see H on the other side of D when I looked her way). H even got excited that I may have been looking at him once and turned to look at me. NOPE.
Not having H in my life is hard. Not engaging with H on a part-time basis has become easier. It still requires deliberate thought and decisioning.
We meet up for pictures outside and await the nephew. In that 10 minutes, I greeted many (all are form our small town) and enjoyed some conversations. H pushed further and further back from the flow of traffic. Not sure why but he wasn't around me and no one asked for him.
Family of 5 in front of us took a pic with graduate, SIL/BIL took pic with graduate, I took pic with graduate, D took pic with graduate and H took pic with graduate. We needed 3 for our family. I felt it. Sister texts to share photos on social media. Yup, 3 pictures posted for our family. SMH - this isn't how I'd want to write this chapter.
D and I head out and run into AP's XH. He's super happy to see us. My face had already fallen in relief as I was bolting to the car. Stop in my tracks to greet him and off I go. Was AP in his circle awaiting their son?? Not sure. Doesn't matter. I kept walking and get on the road.
Originally Posted by DnJ
Truth will out. You need not force it. Everything comes out eventually. Live and love your life - accordingly. Responsibility. Properly. With accountability. Respectfully (to self and others). Genuinely. Sincerely.
Isn't that the truth!?!
D: Why do you hate dad so much? M: I'm not sure where that comes from. I don't hate dad at all. D: Mom! Something has changed and it's obvious that you hate him. M: Again, D. I don't hate dad and I'd like to believe that you don't either. D: What happened? What's changed? M: I kept driving. STFU smoothie D: I need you to tell me. You don't talk to him at all anymore. M: Tears rolling down my face. STFU smoothie D: Please don't cry. You're driving. I just need you to tell me. Did he cross the boundary? M: I nod in affirmation as tears pour out. I let out an exhale and grunt as I release pain. D: I knew it. This is why brother and I had a bad week last week. We've suspected. We knew something was up. Please don't cry. M: STFU smoothie D: This is why dad was so depressed and suicidal. It was guilt. Wasn't it? M: I'm sorry D. I didn't want you to know, but seeing as you asked, I won't lie to you. D: How do you know? When did you find out. M: It fell in my lap and I sent him the evidence a couple months back. D: What did he say? Have you talked? M: Nope. He ghosted me at which point, I got some bills in order as well as the car ownership aligned. D: Ahh. That's why you did it. You'd known that long? UGH M: STFU smoothie D: You need to tell brother. He's disappointed that you don't tell him things. Or I can tell him if you'd rather. M: This isn't info for you to share with your brother. I'll get around to telling him. D: We need to tell him soon. Brother and I have plans to do X on Tuesday. M: I don't know if I'll tell him before Tuesday. D: How sure are you? If you're 100% sure, I'm done with dad. I'll cut him right out. M: Then, I'm 99% sure, not 100%. D: Mom, I'm so angry with him for what he's taken from me. What he's done to me. And now what he's doing to you and our family. M: I'm sorry D. STFU smoothie D: Mom, you are so pretty. So much prettier than her, both inside and out. What kind of person does this to a family? Such an ugly person. M: Thank you, D. I appreciate your comments. D: We're getting you on a dating site. That's it.
We both laugh as I drop her off to her car. She then throws in. D: Don't worry about telling brother. He's had enough of dad too. M: What do you mean? You know he doesn't share with me. D: He's called and texted dad many times over the last couple months and dad doesn't respond. M: Wow, I didn't know. D: Ya, brother's last text to dad wasn't a good one. D: Brother texted, "Dad do I have the wrong number? I've been reaching out but am not hearing back from you." M: I'm sorry D. I'll talk to S.
I finish my ride home with what seemed like never ending tears. I feel a surge of emotions. Life felt bittersweet in that 20 minutes - mostly bitter. Sad. Angry. Relieved. Validated. Disheartened. Oh those feelings! Can't seem to get away from them. It's been a weekend.
D had a destination wedding to go to so I haven't talked with her. I called S to chat yesterday and he was driving with GF. Nope, not today. S should be in person. If not in person, S should definitely not be driving. I'll muster up some words to tell S in the next week.
Not sure I can make it to nephew's graduation party next weekend. I think I've taken all I can as this year's Mar-May was extended into June by graduations.
If you've been praying for me. This isn't the time to stop. Please and thank you. MG
I’m glad you decided to attend Nephew’s graduation. At the moment, he is still family. And there are less regrets this way.
Originally Posted by MamaG
I was uncomfortable in my own skin and remained visibly controlled. Well, this is graduation #3 that both of us attending with inspirational speeches we can't avoid. They all focus on being authentic, living without fear, face challenges, relationships are what matter most when you look back, don't hide from your feelings, and on and on. Other than laughing with D and a couple family members in front of me, I remained quiet and reserved.
I hear you. I was uncomfortable for a while as well.
I’ve had five graduations now, and in a week will be the second wedding. The speeches don’t bother me anymore; for a I live them.
I didn’t choose this path, XW did. However, I can, and I did, choose how I responded to it.
Originally Posted by MamaG
Originally Posted by DnJ
Truth will out. You need not force it. Everything comes out eventually. Live and love your life - accordingly. Responsibility. Properly. With accountability. Respectfully (to self and others). Genuinely. Sincerely.
Isn't that the truth!?!
As father of the groom I’ve been asked to make one of those speeches. It’s also expected for the parents to say a few words. XW has opted out, both times. Sincerity. How do you give a few words at a wedding regarding love, honour, respect, commitment, etc. when you are living the opposite.
Anyhow, I’ve accepted. And like last wedding, I’ll go it solo. The speech, and attending. lol. I’m pretty comfortable in my skin.
Originally Posted by MamaG
D: You need to tell brother. He's disappointed that you don't tell him things.
Pay attention. The door has been opened. Adult kids are looking for the truth.
Originally Posted by MamaG
D: Mom, I'm so angry with him for what he's taken from me. What he's done to me. And now what he's doing to you and our family.
You don’t feed this fire. You also don’t try to extinguish it. It’s not your job to facilitate or repair the relationship between Dad and kid; it’s your job not to destroy it (by your hand).
Acknowledge D’s feelings, her anger, and such. And help her walk her path, her journey. How she responds to a situation she didn’t choose.
Originally Posted by MamaG
D: Don't worry about telling brother. He's had enough of dad too. M: What do you mean? You know he doesn't share with me. D: He's called and texted dad many times over the last couple months and dad doesn't respond. M: Wow, I didn't know. D: Ya, brother's last text to dad wasn't a good one. D: Brother texted, "Dad do I have the wrong number? I've been reaching out but am not hearing back from you." M: I'm sorry D. I'll talk to S.
MLCer’s become terrible parents. They ghost their own kids. Especially those who hold them accountable.
We LBS are the strong stable parent. Reach out to son.
Now, at times, your kids are going to lash out at you. Lash out undeservingly even. You see they cannot risk loosing Dad yet, so they vent at the strong stable parent.
That be said, I suspect daughter is about ready, or really close to being able to blast/talk/say her piece to Dad and let the chips fall where they will. Son will follow suit shortly.
Don’t fret. It’s perfectly healthy and healing for them.
Originally Posted by MamaG
I finish my ride home with what seemed like never ending tears. I feel a surge of emotions. Life felt bittersweet in that 20 minutes - mostly bitter. Sad. Angry. Relieved. Validated. Disheartened. Oh those feelings! Can't seem to get away from them. It's been a weekend.
(((Hugs)))
I suspect those feelings have now subsided. Mostly.
I too have moments like that. Still. After eight years. Though, it passes rather quickly. Acceptance doesn’t erase your past or feelings; you just don’t fight them. In acceptance, I find I’m almost never angry about the situation. Sometimes, sad, melancholy, nostalgic. Vastly, living my life. Fulfilled. Meaningful. Happy. Hopeful.
It’s fine to have such feelings as you experienced. Calm the waters. Let your subconscious churn away, while you do some yard work. Or go for a walk. Or bbq a steak. Oh yes, bbq a steak. Yum. With baked potatoes. Mushrooms. Smoothed in butter. OMG! (I shouldn’t post when I’m hungry. lol)
Have a great day MG.
D
Let’s see, mmmm, yes that will do fine. <Me: Thawing a steak for dinner.>
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
We LBS are the strong stable parent. Reach out to son.
S and I talked - he now knows. Hard convo but I made it happen before S and D had plans. They've been talking. Both are processing. Processing without me. I often would talk with each of them 4 or 5 times a week. Haven't heard from them much. I'm giving space.
Nephew's graduation party was last Saturday at SIL's house. I wasn't sure if I'd attend. S came in to attend and spent the night since the commute is long and the following day was Father's Day. Shortly after S pulled in, D pulls in with BF. I was surprised to see her as I hadn't heard from her. The 3 of them are planning to go. I asked if I could join them.
D: Go get dressed. We'll go for an hour and leave. M: Sounds good. Give me a minute so I can prepare a greeting card and gift.
The 3 of them played basketball in the driveway like old times while I got ready. My heart was singing.
We head over. Walking up the driveway, we are greeted by SIL who has some confusion on her face. She didn't expect me to show is all I could think. I notice teenagers and H who are playing yard games (no greeting/acknowledgement in either direction) on our left, as we make our way over to the adults who are sitting at long stretches of tables. Most had eaten. We greet several friends and hug/kiss uncle 1, uncle 2, BIL, FIL and GF.
Grabbing our plates, we sit at a table where there are 4 seats - happens to be a ways from H's family. We eat, laugh and enjoy each other. Over comes SIL who is her usual self - negative spewing, complaining that she can't wait for the party to be over, it's so cold and on and on. [I don't miss this.]
Several family friends stopped over to say hello and catch up. SIL's best friend was one of them. She asked how I was doing with a concerned demeanor. In response, I tilted my head, curled my eyebrows and proudly let her know, "We're doing great. Things are great." Caught off guard, she adjusted and we talked about other things and comfort - for her - returned. Not sure what SIL is feeding her but that may have changed the narrative.
There were lots of looks our way. I was comfortable unlike at the commencement, but could certainly feel the eyes. Many of sorrow, concern, confusion. The 4 of us, unrehearsed just simply behaved as we always had and laughed often. Genuine enjoyment. My heart was so full in that moment. D kept saying, "Why does dad keep looking over here?" I told her I didn't know.
We hadn't even finished our last bites when uncle 3 and aunt came and sat with us. We talked about the family wedding later this year and they told me that they were glad that I decided to go. SIL said in return, "I don't know why she has to go all the way over there to get married. We're not going." I could see D drinking STFU smoothies (Yes, I've introduced both kids to these nutritious treats.)
A few minutes later, the rest of the family at the other table flocked over to us one by one and sat with us at our table - all uncles, aunts, FIL, etc. We were always the center gatherings. Full of life and excitement. Now I see it.
Meanwhile, H kept looking over and listening to our laughs and interactions. Genuine. Joyous. Comfortable. A family life he once was a part of. Here we are on his turf and they're all moving towards us. I was glowing. Family and friends are even more confused now. They're wondering how actions (our engagement) and words (SIL and H) aren't matching up.
We left after an hour and the kids were happy they went and that dad stayed clear. And mostly, that H didn't approach us.
It's confusing. I'm reminded that Divorce Busting is counterintuitive. At the party, I was comfortable with H doing what he wanted. I was doing what I wanted. I didn't have an urge to bring him in or otherwise. Choices. Actions. Consequences. Afterwards, as I reflect, I felt like I was snubbing him. Rude. I question if I should've been the bigger person and waived from afar as I walked up the driveway? Isn't ignoring toxic? Avoiding isn't healthy. Was I avoiding? Accepting his wishes and behaving accordingly?
I ask because being a better human is in my cards. His return isn't mine to control. Kids are watching. Kids followed and didn't engage either.
An hour later, we picked ourselves up and walked out together in laughter and with a skip in our step. Walked down the driveway, past H and teenagers and into the car....
S and I booked flights for the wedding that night. D got a big-girl job now that she graduated and is waiting to hear if she can attend the wedding with us. It's a big trip and quite a bit to book. H's family wants me to go. I want to go. Kids want to go. We're going.
The next day was Father's Day. No messages, no breakfast, no Happy Father's Day to H. None of us reached out. I'm sure he felt it. Maybe he'll wake up some day and realize all he's left behind. Maybe not.
Father's day was beautiful. We celebrated my dad in our typical warm style. Surrounded by food and family. Some games and lots of love.
As for me, I've done more reflecting on how I contributed to the fallout of my marriage. This has helped me. I enabled his descent. I'm not condoning his coping techniques nor anything he's made decisions to do. Still, I'm able to see that doing more isn't the answer. Carrying his weight isn't the answer. Excusing what he lacks isn't the answer. Fixing everything is control and not helpful. Still learning. Still healing. Still hurting. Beginning to thrive.
Power washed the back patio for a few hours. Took some time to start up the washer, but with some cuts, bruises, words, I made it happen. Have another couple hours ahead of me today for the front walk before I head over to niece's dance recital.
Cancer check-up on Monday. D is coming along with me and has plans for ride. Yesterday, D listed out the calls she needs to make. Decisions to ponder. Timing to consider. She's a bit overwhelmed with needing to move out of college apartment in the next week and all she needs to do to find housing near the new job. She'll be home for a month or so and then will move towards S, being only 10 minutes down the road from him. It comforts me that they'll have each other. They want to be together. D said to me, "Mom, just move near us. Why not? You love the ocean so it could work." While it sounds appealing, my career is here and I certainly know that they may move again in a blink of an eye. I need stability.
Much like when they were born, parenting adult children doesn't come with a manual. I'm doing what I can to be the stable parent. Provide space as they think through their life's changes. Not fixing as I know that's not what they need. Listening. Offering advice when requested. Loving them always.
Last edited by DnJ; 06/25/2502:55 PM. Reason: Corrected typo.
MG, Overall I think this was a very positive experience. What I love the most was that you weren't even trying to DB. You were present in the moment with you and your kids... and that's when life gets beautiful.
How people feel about us... is really none of our business. However they look at you, whatever they think of you... let them. Your focus is where it should be. Sharing memories with people you love and that love you.
Originally Posted by MamaG
It's confusing. I'm reminded that Divorce Busting is counterintuitive. At the party, I was comfortable with H doing what he wanted. I was doing what I wanted. I didn't have an urge to bring him in or otherwise. Choices. Actions. Consequences. Afterwards, as I reflect, I felt like I was snubbing him. Rude. I question if I should've been the bigger person and waived from a afar as I walked up the driveway? Isn't ignoring toxic? Avoiding isn't healthy. Was I avoiding? Accepting his wishes and behaving accordingly?
I ask because being a better human is in my cards. His return isn't mine to control. Kids are watching. Kids followed and didn't engage either. .
Detachment is hard ain't it?
Here you are about to pick up the rope here in your post
.... AND YET.... you check yourself.. and decide not to.
Originally Posted by MamaG
As for me, I've done more reflecting on how I contributed to the fallout of my marriage. This has helped me. I enabled him descent. I'm not condoning his coping techniques nor anything he's made decisions to do. Still, I'm able to see that doing more isn't the answer. Carrying his weight isn't the answer. Excusing what he lacks isn't the answer. Fixing everything is control and not helpful. Still learning. Still healing. Still hurting. Beginning to thrive.
Really well done. THIS ^^^^ is the work. It's not about ignoring our feelings or our love for our SO. It's knowing the part we played in the story our marriage. It's about re-discovering the part we need to play in our own personal story.
This is a conversation and debate you will have many times with yourself. It's part of the healing process. You are exactly where you need to be.
M(f): 40 D'ed: 8/12
Show empathy when there's pain. Show grace when warranted. Kindness in the midst of anger. Faith in the face of fear.
I can never tell whether I’m snubbing or ignoring or just doing my thing. I feel like I need to be the better person sometimes. Treat H like I’d like to be treated. Right now I just try to keep things short and sweet.
I am grateful for insight from my virtual friends on this site. Somehow you validate me, remind me of what's important and give direction. And here I am for more.
Yesterday, H text the kids - first outreach from him since Pii day in March. H sent a very cold and unemotional text to inform the kids that his father (my FIL) was in the hospital because he had a stroke. While the kids didn't respond to him via text, they jumped in the car and straight to the hospital they went. I then get a call from them.
Kids: Mom, dad is here. He didn't visit papa last time at the hospital so we were hoping he wouldn't be here. His truck is here. What do we do? M: Ok. So now you know. Have you thought about what you'll do? say? Kids: We've been thinking about that for the last couple hours but we didn't think he'd be here.
We ran through some options and then I suggested they sit in the car for a few minutes until they knew what would make them comfortable.
M: You don't have to greet him. You can greet him. You can nod. Or you can just be there for papa. Hold papa's hand. Comfort papa. Love on him. That's why you're there - for papa. Kids: Ya, we'll sit and think it through before going in.
Three hours later, with so much relief, they called on their way out.
Kids: You're never going to believe what dad's new thing is now. M: What do you mean? Kids: Tattoos, piercings, Duck Dynasty...and guess what now? M: He's polishing his toe nails. In black polish! Kids: Ok. Sounds like he's still looking for himself. Hope he enjoyed his first pedicure.
We laughed. Then they told me that they didn't talk to dad nor make any eye contact with him. They sounded proud. I just uttered, "OK, sounds like you had a nice visit with papa though." They confirmed.
Kids: Mom, dad is so selfish. He sat in a chair the whole time while we stood for hours. He never asked anything about us. He just doesn't have any interest in us at all. M: You know dad is in crisis. He's only thinking of himself right now. Dad loves you both very much but he doesn't know how to get through the shame and guilt. D: He doesn't even know I moved. He learned today though. M: He knew you moved. He can track your phone and I'm pretty sure he does. Men in crisis are very curious about their lives. D: I guess. Well, he learned a bit more about us and he didn't seem to care that he's missing out.
What else can I say to them? Should I give advice? I don't know what to ever say or not say. They continue to struggle. They're hurting so much.
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Over the last month, my kids have been processing the news. D was home more than usual with all the moving in and out so we were able to connect more. We periodically talked about H, as we always had. She isn't at peace but has accepted that dad is absent and is acting cowardly. She is also the one who has done more sharing of her feelings over the last 2 years. S is struggling and I find out tonight from D just how much he's struggling. Thankfully, he is open enough to talk with his sister. Love that for them.
S wants to talk to H. He wants to hear it from his dad. He wants confirmation that he strayed. D told S that dad will lie and won't confess. Wise. S agreed and is still feeling the need to talk to dad.
S also told D that he's not talking to me as much because I remind him of dad and he doesn't want to think about dad. Hmmm. Certainly I had noticed that S calls fewer times. S told her, I know I'm being avoidant and I don't want to be. I know it's unhealthy, but it's hard to talk with mom now.
Ok - this is good. S has awareness. Admitting to the problem is step 1.
What are your suggestions? S may never tell me he's struggling. What can I do? I can't let him know that D told me. Yet, I want to help him open up. You know I've been struggling here and I'm still here. I know I can't make S speak. Do I apply the same DB skills? Give space? Let him come to me? Listen when/if he does.
And, any idea why he's struggling to talk to me?
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D shares her own feelings and then asks to change the subject. Doesn't want to talk about it for long. Her approach is to say it out loud and drop it. I'm thinking I need to be a better listener....
D: Dad isn't dad. He doesn't show up like a dad. He's just not who I remember. Me: What do you mean? D: He's just not interested in us. Not curious about anything. Asks us no questions. Me: He's selfish right now. Remember? D: I know. It's just that I've moved and he didn't care to ask any questions. Auntie was asking and he was just listening intently. Me: Dad knows you moved. D: Well, ... I don't want to talk about it anymore.
And so the dance continues. Half conversations. Again, do I say too much? Is it me? Is it how she processes?
His fairies and unicorns are hurting my cubs and I feel helpless.
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