Rest

[Kind18]

W let me know she’s not doing well. I asked if she wanted to talk about it.

This is DBing 101.

Why on earth did you ask her to interact? She then says no and you feel crap. Again.

EVERY TIME YOU INTERACT YOU LOSE.

Try this:
Crazy ex: “I’m not doing well.”
Rockon: “That sounds tough. I’m leaving to get ready for dancing.” And leave.

The answer is staring you right in the face - Talking always makes you feel worse.

Also, I think you’re still getting validation wrong. Replace “validation” with “repeat what she said back to her and then immediately leave”.

[Rockon]

Had a good day in the mountains with friends. Good to take a break from everything else and simplify.

[Ready2Change]

Hi Rock,

Here are three GREAT choices:

Try this:
Crazy ex: “I’m not doing well.”
Rockon: “That sounds tough. I’m leaving to get ready for dancing.” And leave.

Also, I think you’re still getting validation wrong. Replace “validation” with “repeat what she said back to her and then immediately leave”.

When W laments her lot in life, self imposed lot I might add, simply respond “I’m sorry to hear that.” And go on with your day.

Can you identify the pattern? Can you come up with good way to interact using the same pattern?

[MrP]

I'll add a few suggestions of potential validating statements to use:

1. That must be hard to deal with.
2. It sounds like you're really discouraged.
3. What a frustrating situation to be in.
4. That sounds terrible.
5. I wish you didn't have to go through that.

Validating isn't an agreement or an extension of offers to "help" necessarily, at least in a DB situation IMO. You want to provide a brief response and be the first to exit the conversation because as Kind suggests, you're GALing in some way. Keep working, Rock.

[Rockon]

I will keep working at it. I am going to practice within some of my social circle as R2C has suggested. Thank you gentlemen this is really helpful and not commonly taught.

[Ready2Change]

I will keep working at it. I am going to practice within some of my social circle as R2C has suggested. Thank you gentlemen this is really helpful and not commonly taught.

Rock,

Go to a coffee shop. Sit where you can observe two women talking. One will be talking. The other is doing what is called "Active listening". At some point, they reverse roles. Active listening is the skill you need to learn. Most men suck at it. We all want to fix things. Women mostly want the listener to relate and understand how they felt emotionally. Apply it with your X, your children, the women you are dancing with.

1) That must have been frustrating.
2) I would have been angry.
3) I hate feeling like that.

Pretty easy to let the other person know that you are listening and understand how they are feeling emotionally once you realize your role in the conversation.

[Kind18]

R2C is the absolute master at this stuff, and attraction - so heed his advice!

Rather than TALKING about what you’re going to do, go to a coffee shop and actually DO what he recommends. The answer is not going to jump out of words on a page.

You need to go and engage. Practice. Observe.

My only slight amendment (acknowledging R2C is much better at this than me) is to be wary of validating using “I” statements.

I’d change these:

2) I would have been angry.
3) I hate feeling like that.

To this:

2) You must have felt so angry.
3) You must hate feeling like that.

Not always - but sometimes - people looking for validation feel less heard if you acknowledge and feel them through associating it with how you’ve felt before. It can come off as “I know how you feel because that happened to me once and I felt…” which makes them feel like you’re making it about you and your feelings, not theirs.

“I know how you feel” or “I’ve felt like that before” is less effective than “that must have made you feel like” or “if I were in your shoes, that would have made me feel hurt and angry”.

[Kind18]

Having said all that, I still don’t recommend you try and bust this divorce.

She’s a very toxic woman and you two have extreme co-dependency which is unhealthy.

But do take R2C’s advice and go to a coffee shop - to improve yourself as a new man and learn some new skills.

[SteveLW]

Rock, sounds like you are still struggling with all of this. Kind and R2C and others have been giving you a lot of good advice and things to think about. My fear is that a year from now you'll still be stuck.

So I ask you, where do you want to be by July 1st ,2024??

[Rockon]

July 1st, 2024:

Thriving fully back to work with a solid financial plan in place to be able to buy W out of the house.
Acceptance of my singleness and the gift of celibacy. Acceptance whether I am D by then (not my hope and plan), detached from W and the M, or possibly piecing.

I want to be a man of strength and integrity and attraction. I am realizing I don’t want to attract a replacement of W or give that impression but I want to be healthy and thriving and I want my close friends and kids to know that I am ok and I will be alright.

I want to be involved in healthy ways with my kids, grandkid, friends and community.

I’m planning to talk to my parents tomorrow and open up to them so that they have some accurate info.

I want them to know that W is staying at her moms and that I am taking time to make some decisions about what is best for me and our kids. I want to tell them that my hope is that our M is restored and I am trusting God no matter what the outcome is.

I want to use language and tone with my parents that gives them hope that I and their grandkids and great grandkid will be ok and there are good plans in place.