Be there for S. Solid dependable strong. Make time to connect allow him to know you are there when and how he wants to talk. Let him know you are proud of him.
An affair is just a symptom, a band-aid. Regarding S14 (and you), be accurate and re-frame this.
I have concern for S14 with wife's A going on his Mom’s absence and outward appearance of apathy towards her relationship with him.
Having a clear picture helps find clear paths forward.
Originally Posted by Sunflyer
I know S14 notices her lack of presence. He has asked me where she is and I simply reply that I don't know. We have to handle meals for ourselves, as she rarely prepares anything for either of us anymore. The last time she cooked something was about a week ago. Before that I don't remember.
Is there anything I can do to handle this better when he asks? Her animosity toward me is one thing, and I don't care whether she cooks for me or not, but to me this shows tremendous disrespect for S14.
At 14, son likely knows more than your realize, and he likely suspects what’s going on. He obviously notices Mom is not around much, and it’s just you and he eating super together.
Lots of spouses whilst caught up in the limerence and infatuation of an illicit affair become terrible parents. Ensure son knows you love him and are there for him. Be his rock!
Son will have many questions. Be open, honest, and age appropriate when answering his questions. Encourage his queries. Kids need and will find answers. If not from you, it will be their friends, the internet, or they’ll make up a reason or answer. And kids are pretty darn egocentric, so they usually circle towards self blame for their parents behaviour. Tell son, directly, the troubles between Dad and Mom has nothing to do with him. You love him! And give him a big hug!
If you do not know the answer, or how to say it, be honest and tell him: I don’t know, let me think about it and we’ll talk about it tomorrow evening. And do it. Keep your word. Have that conversation the next evening.
Break the ice with son. I know it’s a difficult subject to broach. Ensure you open the door, and son knows that the door is always open.
When son asks Mom’s whereabouts during super, add to your statement of not knowing. Just stating the obvious facts usually gets kids talking to get to what they really want to ask. Something like: I don’t know where Mom is. She certainly has missed a lot of meals lately.
Also just come out and ask son: You’ve noticed Mom has missed a lot of meals and family time, do you have any questions?
The likelihood of son just immediately opening up is pretty low. The first go around is breaking the ice. Don’t fret, son will talk, just be sincere.
Some tips:
Do not demonize Mom/W. Son is half her. He knows half of his genetic make up is from her. If you attack Mom, you attack him.
Son will be concerned about repeating Mom’s behaviour. Like above, half of his code is from her. Of course, that means half is from you. Ensure son knows and realizes that his fate is not hardwired, rather it’s fostered by nurturing. After all, the grass is greenest where one waters it.
Lead by example. You are son’s living example. He will look to you on how to act and react in this and many of life’s events.
Gently steer son. He is 14. He has his own mind and heart. Listen to what he has to say. And be gentle and firm with guidance.
Be his parent. Son has friends, he needs a Dad. Lots of times parents try being their kid’s best friend instead of being their parent. Do not be a Disneyland parent. Be Dad.
Son will lash out at you. More than you deserve. Realize, son cannot yet risk losing his Mom. As such, his frustrations, anger, sadness, and so on, will be directed at you - son’s strong and safe and stable parent. Roll with it. Much better he lashes out than keeping things bottled up.
Have those difficult conversations with son. Especially if son brings up the topic.
The troubles between you and W have nothing to do with son. This is a topic that will be on son’s mind. Ensure you demonstrate most clearly that son is not the cause.
When my W blew up, she tossed the kids aside. She actually blamed my second eldest son for going to university. Saying that the kids are leaving and it feels horrible. So she is preempting it by her leaving first. (Yeah, it doesn’t make sense.) Days later son confided/asked “so, if I hadn’t gone to university Mom would still be here?”.
My situation was wide open, a bomb drop at super time in front of everyone, blasted open the doors on many difficult conversations. Regarding the above conversation, son and I discussed Mom’s sudden and displayed emotional instability. How she is taking actions and saying things based upon her feelings. (MLC is horrible. I’d not wish it upon my worst enemy.)
My XW completely destroyed her previous life and relationships with her kids. A loving Mom. A gal who operated a daycare from our house. Kaboom! She went right off the rails.
Lots of collateral damage. Lots of conversations with the kids. Lots of lashing out from the kids. And some of that lashing out I did well deserved. (See below)
Do not force son to see his Mom. I did push my son to go see Mom/W on the first Christmas. And he did not want to go. When he got back, wow! was he mad. And boy did I get blasted when he got home. Lesson learned.
It’s not your job to facilitate their relationship. It’s your job to not destroy it.
Lots of troubled spouses chooses a favourite child. A child who perhaps is less upfront or confrontational about their parent’s behaviour and morality. This also leads to the parent choosing a least favourite child too. My third son was that least favourite. Mom treated him worse than the other three, and that is saying something.
Speak with son. Both your sons. They’ve got questions.
You got this SF.
D
Feelings are fleeting. Be better, not bitter. Love the person, forgive the sin.
Had a pretty good day. Beautiful weather here on the east coast; very much like summer. Was gone most of the day. I got the impression that W might have been a bit annoyed since I left her with S14. Not sure why that should bother her since she leaves me with him regularly so she can see OM.
Took my car in for inspection early this morning. They weren't able to finish the inspection since some sensors needed to be reset; they told me I'd have to drive at least 60 miles to reset them and then I could come back to the shop. I hadn't eaten anything at home, so I typed "diners' into my phone. Normally I would not consider driving 20+ miles to a diner, but since I needed to put miles on the car I did.
Took the opportunity to interact with the waitstaff and made a conscious effort to be pleasant. After this, I headed back in the direction of home and stopped at the park for a while. Then drove down to the waterfront to enjoy the summerlike weather. Then it was back to the shop and got the car inspection finished.
Finally went to visit my sister, who offered me dinner. We talked until it was nearly dark and then I went home.
Just in time for W to disappear, likely for the entire night.
Me 59 W 47 T 26 M 23 S18, S14 BD May 2023 D filed June 2023 OM1 confirmed: December 2023 OM2 confirmed: October 2023
When my WW got involved with OM she was living with me and the kids. Gradually she spent less and less time with them. She used to cook meals and this slowly stopped to the point where she barely made anything. She even told me "Our kids are not neglected because I don't cook. I provide for them financially and emotionally."
Several weeks after she started seeing OM my eldest daughter was having abandonment issues. WW acknowledged this and said "so imagine when I'm not there."
He behavior changed completely. She spent less and less time with them. She would come home at midnight like a rebellious teenager. She lied to the kids and told them she was seeing friends.
We were supposed to have 50/50 custody but because OM lived several miles away and she had to work at the office she couldn't take them to school or pick them up afterwards so she asked me if I could have them during the week which I happily agreed to.
What happened is she moved to a neighboring state and ended up only getting long weekends with the kids. My oldest daughter didn't want to stay for an entire weekend so she'd go for one day a week. Sometimes her mother would pick her up and drop her off the same day.
She insists that she left me and not the kids but nothing could be further from the truth. She abandoned her family and now takes care of another man's kids.
Break the ice with son. I know it’s a difficult subject to broach. Ensure you open the door, and son knows that the door is always open.
When son asks Mom’s whereabouts during super, add to your statement of not knowing. Just stating the obvious facts usually gets kids talking to get to what they really want to ask. Something like: I don’t know where Mom is. She certainly has missed a lot of meals lately.
Also just come out and ask son: You’ve noticed Mom has missed a lot of meals and family time, do you have any questions?
The likelihood of son just immediately opening up is pretty low. The first go around is breaking the ice. Don’t fret, son will talk, just be sincere.
Yes, I am going to do this and let him know he can come to me.
Originally Posted by DnJ
Do not demonize Mom/W. Son is half her. He knows half of his genetic make up is from her. If you attack Mom, you attack him.
Son will be concerned about repeating Mom’s behaviour. Like above, half of his code is from her. Of course, that means half is from you. Ensure son knows and realizes that his fate is not hardwired, rather it’s fostered by nurturing. After all, the grass is greenest where one waters it.
Lead by example. You are son’s living example. He will look to you on how to act and react in this and many of life’s events.
I would not go down this road. W has been promoting herself as the "GOAT" to him possibly to portray me as inferior by contrast. That is not something I would do either.
Originally Posted by DnJ
The troubles between you and W have nothing to do with son. This is a topic that will be on son’s mind. Ensure you demonstrate most clearly that son is not the cause.
Of course. I know this is very important.
Originally Posted by DnJ
My XW completely destroyed her previous life and relationships with her kids. A loving Mom. A gal who operated a daycare from our house. Kaboom! She went right off the rails.
Lots of collateral damage. Lots of conversations with the kids. Lots of lashing out from the kids. And some of that lashing out I did well deserved. (See below)
Do not force son to see his Mom. I did push my son to go see Mom/W on the first Christmas. And he did not want to go. When he got back, wow! was he mad. And boy did I get blasted when he got home. Lesson learned.
It’s not your job to facilitate their relationship. It’s your job to not destroy it.
I've read your story several times. Horrific. As bad as my situation feels, yours seems almost beyond comprehension.
I certainly don't want to destroy any relationships with my sons, whether involving myself or W.
Me 59 W 47 T 26 M 23 S18, S14 BD May 2023 D filed June 2023 OM1 confirmed: December 2023 OM2 confirmed: October 2023
He behavior changed completely. She spent less and less time with them. She would come home at midnight like a rebellious teenager. She lied to the kids and told them she was seeing friends.
We were supposed to have 50/50 custody but because OM lived several miles away and she had to work at the office she couldn't take them to school or pick them up afterwards so she asked me if I could have them during the week which I happily agreed to.
What happened is she moved to a neighboring state and ended up only getting long weekends with the kids. My oldest daughter didn't want to stay for an entire weekend so she'd go for one day a week. Sometimes her mother would pick her up and drop her off the same day.
She insists that she left me and not the kids but nothing could be further from the truth. She abandoned her family and now takes care of another man's kids.
I'm not sure if my W has told our son anything about where she goes when she goes out, even if false. I don't know if he asks her. He has asked me, that is for certain.
Your story indicates perfectly the radical changes in mindset that these wayward spouses undergo. They will spin things to avoid guilt (telling you she left you not the kids). I have been reading the collection of sandi2 threads on WWs, which has been very enlightening.
Me 59 W 47 T 26 M 23 S18, S14 BD May 2023 D filed June 2023 OM1 confirmed: December 2023 OM2 confirmed: October 2023
W had second round of cosmetic surgery. Unlike the first, which had at least some additional benefits, I see this one as purely for vanity reasons. Had her "flabby" arms liposuctioned as well as a breast reduction and lift. Except for today, she has been out of her office for going on four weeks. The incisions on both arms have become infected, and she is now being treated for that. I am so glad that I am not a vain person.
Any self-esteem issues I may have had in the past pale before what she must have. Cosmetic surgery + OM = band aids over what appears to be a troubled soul. Since being off from work, she sleeps on the couch, is glued to her phone, or spends time with OM. That's basically her life.
Meanwhile, I continue working and moving ahead with my life and plans for my future. When I am out doing things, it is often for hours at a time. I say nothing about where I am going, and she typically doesn't challenge me (nor does she have any right to, as I see it).
I have already made plans to spend Thanksgiving at my sister's. I haven't informed W of this and won't until she brings up the holiday. And when she does bring it up, I won't tell her where I'm going (although she will probably figure it out). Because of her surgery, I doubt Thanksgiving will be at our house as usual. Her brother will probably host it, and since she has completely poisoned my relationship with her family (they want nothing to do with me anymore), neither I nor they will miss being together.
As I believe I mentioned earlier, I suspect her family not only knows about OM but approves of the relationship. And I now suspect our sons know about it too. None of this falls under my definition of setting a good role model for them. I'd say the odds are better than 50-50 that he will be at the Thanksgiving table that I'll be missing from.
I have minimal interactions with her. Today she discussed her doctor visit and S14's school progress. Total discussion time about ten minutes, which qualifies as unusually chatty.
I have some more financial info to submit to my L. I have no idea if she's moved forward on any of hers. I will be honest: at this point, I am looking forward to a separation agreement and being under a different roof from her. Her actions tell me that she has no respect for me at all. I feel more hopeful about my future by the day. And I know I am worth a better future than what I am living now.
Me 59 W 47 T 26 M 23 S18, S14 BD May 2023 D filed June 2023 OM1 confirmed: December 2023 OM2 confirmed: October 2023
The holidays are practically upon us, so I knew this discussion would come up at some point.
I made plans for Thanksgiving with another family member. I seem to remember W suggesting that her brother might host Thanksgiving because she is still recovering from surgery.
This morning she informs me that she will indeed be cooking, and it will be a small gathering, just her, me, the boys, and her parents.
I inform her that I will not be present. She looks like a bomb hit her.
She asks me when I was planning to tell her. I inform her that I didn't even know she was making a dinner.
She asks me if I am going to my sister's.
My response: "I will be with someone." This annoys her; she says that she asked me a question, and she wanted an answer. I told her I gave her one.
She can't possibly be disappointed by this. She and her family have no desire to be around me, and frankly I have no desire to sit at a table with someone who cheated and whose parents, at the same table, apparently know about it and approve of it.
Of course, her family will probably spin this as vaildating her criticism of me. "See? He's rude and cold. He doesn't want to be around us." It's a no-win situation, so I'd prefer to take the option that preserves my sanity.
I suspect the only reason she would relent on having me at dinner is because of our boys. She wondered how this would be explained to them. I do feel bad that I won't eat with them one last time, but this is the way things will be going forward anyway.
Me 59 W 47 T 26 M 23 S18, S14 BD May 2023 D filed June 2023 OM1 confirmed: December 2023 OM2 confirmed: October 2023
