I’m back :(

[Card29]

Venting something about myself that goes back as long as I can remember. I didn't want anything to change. I didn't want my friends and family to move away. Of course it's normal for a kid to fear the death of a parent or grand parent when they realize that that is inevitable, but that was one of my earliest fears. I didn't want to move away after high school, I stayed and went to university in our city.

Seemingly every great friend I've made over the last 18 years has moved away. High school friends, to be expected. They go to school all over the country. College buddies got jobs elsewhere after school, I got it. I was tight with a young church in early 20's, and a lot of the men were here to go to a seminary. I became really good friends with 3 or 4 of them, and they all left when they got church jobs. Friends I've made at work have taken other jobs that have moved them all over.

I have more friends that live 5+ hours from me than I have in town. And I've felt a little trapped here ever since D#1. There was no moving anywhere for 16 years due to custody of D11 (D2 at the time).

I also know it was an aspect of buying my grandmother's house after she passed (2 doors from my mom). When I was growing up, she was a foster parent and babysitter of me, my sisters and a bunch of my cousins. We all got off different school buses at our house. Our parents came over after work every single day, and we had a huge dinner with 30 people 4-5 days a week. So to me, that house was the anchor point for our entire family. I was thrilled to buy it, to keep it in the family. But I have learned a harsh dose of reality that it wasn't the house that tied all of that together. A lot of those people have moved away, some have died. And they were there for their kids and and be with our grandmother. The house has lost its luster to me, and especially with the sourness of what's going on with my mom.

I miss the apartment W and I had before the house. I miss the house I was renting before that.
I know it was because of the happy times we were having as a couple and with my young daughter, not the dwellings, and we would probably still be here right now if we were still living in one of those places.

My favorite people, the ones that I wish I could hang out with regularly, are on opposite sides of the country from me. I'll likely not see them more than once a year. I know I need to foster more at-home friendships. I need to learn how to deal with people coming and going from my daily life, though. To be able to focus on what I have, not what I don't.

I'm just feeling a little lost this morning.

[Card29]

We have counseling today. I will be present and supportive but won't push anything on her. She is planning to tell her family today. Assuming they reach out, especially with a phone call, what should my game plan be? I am close with them, but I don't think I should tell them that I'm miserably in pain and this is the worst thing in the world, as that will likely get back to her.

I feel like i should say I'm giving her space that she has requested and I'm focusing on things at home with me and the kids. If they ask, I'll say I have a good support group. If not, I won't bring it up. Otherwise, I'll try to be positive.

Decent plan? Any other advice?

[DnJ]

Good Morning Card

I also know it was an aspect of buying my grandmother's house after she passed (2 doors from my mom). When I was growing up, she was a foster parent and babysitter of me, my sisters and a bunch of my cousins. We all got off different school buses at our house. Our parents came over after work every single day, and we had a huge dinner with 30 people 4-5 days a week. So to me, that house was the anchor point for our entire family. I was thrilled to buy it, to keep it in the family.

That sounds like a wonderful time. Such love and family togetherness.

But I have learned a harsh dose of reality that it wasn't the house that tied all of that together.

Yes, home and hearth is built not from bricks and mortar, rather with hugs and love. Grandma has a fantastic legacy by the sounds of it.

I’ve got two decades on you, and have been there too. Some considerations for you. Maybe they’ll resonate and spark something inside.

I remember my Grandma’s house and yard. All the love and fun and good times. She’s been gone now two decades, and I can still see the pull out couch where me and my sister would play under. The wooden doors with the clear glass handles. The large garden. The basement. The kitchen table where many a card game was played, and many a “effortless” delicious meal was eaten. (Grandmas and Moms can throw together a meal with such seemingly fluidity and efficiency. )

After my Grandma’s passing, my parents “home” became that family beacon. The same house I grew up in. Of course, it wasn’t the walls and roof at all, it was the folks within.

A few years later and my Dad contracted a bacterial inflection that grew and occluded the blood flow to his spinal cord at the C5 vertebrae. In three days, he was permanently paralyzed from waist down, and partial paralysis of arms and torso.

The next few years my parents tried to live at home. It was difficult, even with the modifications I did. They moved to an apartment with a better lay out with bigger doorways and such. Meanwhile, grandkids were growing up, and my family grew to four kids. The apartment just didn’t cut it for overnight stays, and was insufficient for such a large gathering around the kitchen table.

My parents also realized they were not happy living in the city, and given a choice where would they rather be? Living in a smaller town. So they moved to the same town as W and I. They bought a house and I gutted it and remodelled it for proper wheelchair access and all the features my Mom wanted. She is kind of short, so we designed the cupboards, countertops, light switches, everything, for her and Dad’s now height.

My parents are now both in their late seventies. Some time, years ago, my house and yard became that beacon, that glue, that family togetherness. I’m not precisely sure when that mantle shifted, yet it did shift. Firstly it was on to both W and I. After BD, well that honour became solely mine.

A ten acre yard and 5000 sqft house does tend to allow for such large family gatherings. Of course, my kids did grow up here, and they have many many wonderful memories of home and hearth.

Let me tell you, accepting such a mantle, such responsibility, I felt so out of my depth. For thirty years W and I were a team. And a darn good one! I’m a pretty good man, husband, and father. I’m a mediocre Mom.

I realize years ago, I can’t be Mom and Dad, I can just be Dad. Yet, I can sure effort to be a darn good one!

Present day, I have a legacy of “that” house. My kids gather, and have a great time. My parents come over. Friends and family have fun times. Heck, I can even appear to get food slung onto the table rather effortlessly. (In truth, I found it’s more just to not worry about the little things. And maybe, that’s exactly what wisdom the Grandma’s and Mom’s have/had. Don’t cry over the spilling of milk. Lol.)

Anyhow, your situation has a ringing of similarity to me. Over the last two decades, my family anchor point shifted. You have an opportunity to craft, to create, to inspire, strong family bonds. To make a legacy. Don’t fret or rush over the outcome, it’s more the foundation that matters. Build slow and strong. Use that gift of time.

[W] is planning to tell her family today. Assuming they reach out, especially with a phone call, what should my game plan be? I am close with them, but I don't think I should tell them that I'm miserably in pain and this is the worst thing in the world, as that will likely get back to her.

Yes, anything you tell them will likely make its way back to W. Blood is thicker than water, and they are her family first and foremost.

Still, your situation is just days passed BD, and there really is nothing concrete to inform them of. I wouldn’t share what you’re doing - the giving of time and space as W has requested, nor the focusing on you and the kids, and especially not DB or anything like that. Just tell them summary facts of the situation. W has been stay at her friends for a few days.

A good night sleep is something lost for a while during the first stage of all this. As Kind wisely pointed out, exercise helps. Go for a walk. A nice stroll to clear the mind. Focus on the present moment. See the trees, the leaves turning color, the animals scurrying about, and so on. Shift your focus, even for just a while, off your W and your worry.

Also, no caffeinated beverages after supper, and no alcohol either helps one find a more peaceful slumber.

Dreams, nightmares, those jolt me awake moments in the wee hours of the night, are expressions of one’s subconsciousness. It takes time to come to terms with those out of reach thoughts and feelings. It’s part of one’s journey to acceptance.

One cannot directly control their subconsciousness, only influence it. When one is calm one can better hear and speak to their inner self. Those moments of clarity and answer do present themselves, be patient.

An interesting thing: Whatever you are thinking about, focused upon, during those five minutes before falling asleep, is likely to be what you’ll mostly dream about. Yes, our nighttime mental wandering is our subconscious making sense of our day and its entirety, however, we can, and do, provide the initial seed for that trek.

Your 47 year old cousin does sound awesome and wise. Thank him for listening and offering his support and perspective. I’d ask him if he would be open to be one of your few trusted support people during this. Someone to help you stay on track. Lots of times folks do want to help, yet they do not know what to do. Having a known person just a phone call away is pure gold! You’ll likely not even “need” him that often. (Also part of that family foundation from above.)

And also thank you for the advice with boundaries. So far I have only said “I want to deal with this within the family right now”. This morning she had taken my trash cans around front for garbage day. When I went home on lunch, she had returned them (emptied) and even bleached one that had been smelly. I texted “I dont want a lot of help right now. I don’t want you to take the trash cans out for me.” She just said ok and I left it. I’m saving the bigger boundaries talk for another day after some counseling.

Yes, R2C is an awesome poster.

Do your research into attractive male behavior. Do not be supplicating. Do not be open with her about your emotional state. Project that life is amazing now. You can express your sadness or anger or whatever you are feeling here, and in private, when and where it is safe.

Wise words there.

“I want to deal with this within the family right now”, is not a boundary. (By the way, I don’t believe you think it is a boundary either.) It’s just a statement. You telling Mom that you aren’t ready to explain or share just yet. If Mom keeps pushing and/or digging then you might need to craft a boundary.

“I don't want a lot of help right now. I don’t want you to take the trash cans out for me.” This is interesting. Why? Why don’t you want help? Is it just her help you don’t want? I ask to prompt that inner realization. That subconscious self stuff.

Mom, likely cares, and wants to help. Folks do not want to feel useless in their support. Something small can also help to break the ice to that pending bigger elephant in the room discussion. Fighting begets fighting, and if you want to reach Mom, head on likely won’t get there.

Later, she texted:

W: Have you said anything to your mom?
W: sorry I guess that’s not my business
(I waited a while deciding what to say)
Me: Nothing out of the ordinary
Me: Thanks for cleaning out the fridge. That was next on my list.
(Is that anti-DB? It felt like I was just acknowledging something nice she did)
W: Least I could do for all your help with S1
W: I’m going to talk to my family tomorrow, I think
Me: Ok. I’m sure that is stressful to think about and anticipate

How did I do? Should I have left that last sentence out? It’s been obvious she’s stressed to tell them, but maybe this went from validating to pursuing and assuming her emotions?

This text exchange was like a follow up from the in-person conversation, and you did fine.

Your thanking her for cleaning the fridge, like I said flowing from the earlier conversation. If you had texted her out of the blue and said that, it would be very much pursuing and pressure. As it turned out, W thanked you and acknowledged your efforts too. Remember, less is more. So keep it mostly reined in.

Your last sentence, all eleven words (twelve if we expand the contraction), I remember how so few words can trigger such an avalanche of emotions and self doubts. Card, it’s ok. You can neither fix or break your situation in a single sentence.

Validating is difficult with text. A good portion of our emotional communication is stated with our mannerisms and those wee indicators: eye movement, hand placement, arms folded or open, and so on. As example if this was person to person: W, you sound stressed. Or, you appear calm.

Her statement of talking to her parents tomorrow sounds kind of robotic to me. The only indicator that she has some internal reservations or perhaps fret is her appending “I think”.

I think just answering with “Ok” would have been fine. There was no need to go further. And I think you are hoping, maybe even unintentionally trying, to instil some stress and anxiety into her stoney exterior. And that’s pretty common for us LBS, when seeing our spouse behave in such an unemotional manner.

D

[Ready2Change]

Also, no caffeinated beverages after supper

3pm is my cutoff now...2pm might be better. Also, no screen time after a certain time. No screen time in bedroom.

My Med doc gave me a prescription that let me sleep 8 hours straight. I was on them within a week of BD. Best sleep I have ever had in my life. I think I used them for about a month. This might be a good option as well.


Count down by 3's from 100. Repeat as required. Any thoughts come to mind, tell yourself you can deal with that tomorrow afternoon. Look into visualizing "the stop sign" technique.

At the same time you are counting, intentionally relax your face, then your chest, then arms and fingers all the way down to your toes.

Focus on slow deep breaths at the same time.

Validating is difficult with text. A good portion of our emotional communication is stated with our mannerisms and those wee indicators: eye movement, hand placement, arms folded or open, and so on. As example if this was person to person: W, you sound stressed. Or, you appear calm.

YUP, get your non-verbal communication into a great place. Body language, facial expressions, tone, inflections are very important skills to master. Smile with your eyes.


Keep text to business. Follow DBing rules. Only texts that need a response are questions. Answer with the fewest words needed to get your point across. Take your time to respond. 99% of messages are not urgent.


W: Do you know what time it is?
H: yes.


W:What time is it?
H:1:41pm

W:"I am going to the store and won't be home until late"
H:(Crickets)


W:Why didn't you respond to my text?
H:"I was busy."

[Card29]

I need to quickly journal our counseling session from today. It was a full hour. She basically said she’s out of love, couldn’t stand the stress of our house, of chores, “cooking dinner every night”, of driving to the house next to my mom. Said it started about a year ago. My mom does seem to be a big part, but not all. Overall, it is her buried with stress which was likely a factor her not having love feelings for me now. How can someone who is stressed 24 hrs a day really love someone long term?

She said she didnt feel like she was a priority. She asked about counseling almost a year ago, I agreed but never scheduled. This happened repeatedly. And she’s right, and that hurts to think about. I would just keep forgetting. I’ve had a terrible time focusing on tasks at work, everywhere. Is she using it to validate her leaving? Maybe, but it still hurts to think about.

I know that love can be built back, but she’s at that point that she doesnt even want to think about trying. So it’s a non-starter atm. She says “she thinks she’s done”. I think in her mind today, D is the only answer.

The counselor was surprised to hear the news. We probably came off as in an okay place but with a nagging MIL 3 weeks ago. He encouraged her to take time to think of the pressure cooker we’re both in, that you can still love the person you always did if you can remove or alleviate the stresses. Some of what he said was definitely anti-DB if it was coming from me.

I tried to stick to validation her pains and stress. I said MIL invalidated her as a mom, step-mom and wife, and that [censored]. Living full of stress with someone that is merely a roommate [censored].

Counselor asked how I’ve been this week. I said I’ve been good, I have some good support. Some things came up in conversation with C that may have been anti-DB. Talked about what I was wrong about when we bought the house (that it would help melt the ice between W and mom, etc).

Counselor was pro-reconciliation and was kind of pushing that. More like gently encouraging, but I could tell W doesnt want to entertain it atm. He outlined what a planned separation could look like. W gets space for a while until she feels more normal away from the stresses she was feeling at our house. After a while, we could “date”, like grab lunch or a coffee. I dont think W is ready for that but she agreed she’d see where she is in a couple weeks. That may have just been to get out of the conversation, I dont know.

My impression of the entire session is she is overwhelmed with stress. She has never been great with stress. I hope for her sake and any chance of a future R that she really learns how to handle stress.

I told her I would continue giving her space, and that I’m not pushing for dates. Said we’re good at home.

I wasn’t expecting a miracle and didnt get it. I was still discouraged afterwards. It’s good to know more of what’s going on with her, but hurts to hear your W doesn’t love you, even if it’s obvious since she left. It’s me and the kids at home for the time being. She’s operating on temporary plans right now.

[Card29]

DnJ, that’s a beautiful story. And it’s real. Home is where the heart is. I do believe there will be warm, bright days ahead. A lot of work for me in the meantime.

Still, your situation is just days passed BD, and there really is nothing concrete to inform them of. I wouldn’t share what you’re doing - the giving of time and space as W has requested, nor the focusing on you and the kids, and especially not DB or anything like that. Just tell them summary facts of the situation. W has been stay at her friends for a few days.

Noted. I tend to overshare. I’m noticing how strong it is this week. I will try my best to keep it to a minimum. I know especially her dad may be asking some questions, though. He’s been concerned about her for weeks and has asked me whats up with her. I hadn’t told him what I was really thinking because it felt like going behind her back, but he could tell there was much more than “stress from work”.

Regarding sleep, I’ve actually been very relaxed at bedtime. It’s waking up in the middle of the night and getting flooded with every terrible thought that’s been the problem. All of the dread, shame, fear, betrayal, hopelessness, etc. But as you say, it must just come with the territory. There’s no pain-free way through this situation.

Your 47 year old cousin does sound awesome and wise. Thank him for listening and offering his support and perspective. I’d ask him if he would be open to be one of your few trusted support people during this. Someone to help you stay on track. Lots of times folks do want to help, yet they do not know what to do. Having a known person just a phone call away is pure gold! You’ll likely not even “need” him that often. (Also part of that family foundation from above.)

He’s already on board and is probably my favorite contact now. And I’m going to try to call him even when I don’t need a talk about W or my struggles. He’s a hoot and his family is awesome.

My best friend is also a great guy, but he’s younger (~32) and hasnt been in a serious relationship in a while. He’s an engineer like me and is trying to problem solve it, trying to figure out what her problem is and how I can fix it. I know it comes from love, and I also know it’s not the right thing to do, so it doesn’t bother me. It’s almost like I preach DB to him on our calls haha. Good practice for me.

“I don't want a lot of help right now. I don’t want you to take the trash cans out for me.” This is interesting. Why? Why don’t you want help? Is it just her help you don’t want? I ask to prompt that inner realization. That subconscious self stuff

I will definitely take help. I’m going to need it. Right now I dont want any help from her specifically. I see it being a slippery slope to being babied and her getting to play mom to a child again. She has invaded my parenting over the last several years, and invalidated W. It’s just not a healthy relationship and I dont want to pretend like everything is great. I know I need to move. I’ve known that for 3 weeks now, before BD.

Mom, likely cares, and wants to help. Folks do not want to feel useless in their support. Something small can also help to break the ice to that pending bigger elephant in the room discussion. Fighting begets fighting, and if you want to reach Mom, head on likely won’t get there.

I’m sure she does because I’m hurting, but I dont think she’s sad at all about my M falling apart. She has not liked W from the start. I love my mom and I’m not trying to pick a fight with her. I just dont even want to have to crack the door right now. I dont have a morsel of spare energy. I dont plan on shunning her, but the old way just cant continue, with or without W.

Thank you for the feedback on my conversation.

I think just answering with “Ok” would have been fine. There was no need to go further. And I think you are hoping, maybe even unintentionally trying, to instil some stress and anxiety into her stoney exterior. And that’s pretty common for us LBS, when seeing our spouse behave in such an unemotional manner.

I think I was trying to validate as she had inferred anxiety about it earlier in the week. But you’re right, it wasn’t necessarily. Less is more

Thank you again

[Card29]

Ready, thanks for the sleep tips. I’ve been caffeine free this week, actually. I’ve been thinking of quitting diet sodas lately, and took this as an opportunity to try. I dont drink coffee too often, or tea, so that leaves no caffeine! I havent had trouble falling asleep at first, but I will try those if I wake up in the middle of the night again. Thank you

YUP, get your non-verbal communication into a great place. Body language, facial expressions, tone, inflections are very important skills to master. Smile with your eyes.

Any any resources you recommend to learn from?

Keep text to business. Follow DBing rules. Only texts that need a response are questions. Answer with the fewest words needed to get your point across. Take your time to respond. 99% of messages are not urgent.


W: Do you know what time it is?
H: yes.


W:What time is it?
H:1:41pm

W:"I am going to the store and won't be home until late"
H:(Crickets)


W:Why didn't you respond to my text?
H:"I was busy."

I forgot about this part of DB. I dont know if you copy-pasted that convo, I seem to remember it or something similar. It actually makes me chuckle at the dryness of the answers. Thanks for the reminder, I will try to implement.

[Card29]

I had my first angry thought in the situation today. She had talked about all of the stresses at home and how she cant imagine going back to it. IC asked her “how have you felt this week away from that situation?”

She said, “better, I only have to worry about myself. I miss S1 though *tears*”

So you dump ALL of the responsibilities on me? I dont know how long this will go on, I dont think she has a plan. She said she’s going to the lake next weekend (gee have fun). I know to say “ok sounds fun” if she tells me. But I have to say out loud that it’s BS. And this is also after she went to EU for a total of 5 weeks and left me with the kids. And when she came back the 2nd time, she acted like she had to coach me with S1. That really bothered me at the time and it still plays in my head.

[Ready2Change]

Any any resources you recommend to learn from?

I am a youtube junky. A good place to start down the rabbit hole : @CharismaMatrix.

[Pattnee5]

Stress is a killer Card, and if they don’t know how to handle their stress they destroy their lives in MlC or depression or likewise. My H was buried by the stress of his work and this all started after a big promotion and step up into a big management position. Working lots of hours, getting angry at people at work and taking it out on me and the family, whingeing about being burdened by the stress of life. Never any self care or time out, de-stressed with alcohol.
It really was his own mess.
Their love is in there it’s just buried and burdened.

I could be wrong here but don’t be super man. Don’t try and do everything and relieve W of her responsibilities as a mother.you’ll burn out, you’ll resent everything. I made the same mistake with H early in trying to do everything lighten his load appease him in everything and he was just cruising through and I absolutely hated it. Might be time to have some sort of schedule so you have some time alone too and also maybe you need a holiday.
Don’t you love the way they feel the world owes them all this freedom and holidays 🙄 it’s utter BS. Sorry I could be wrong as I’m further along but I hated doing everything I burnt out massively and resented H so much for enjoying his freedom and basically his ability to revert to a 17 year old slob

Anyway there’s a great app called “insight timer” it’s all these free meditations. There’s some fantastic sleep meditations. I would put that on every night and would help. Even if I woke up a few hours later
There’s some very calming soothing voices