ever have one of those uh huh moments? the moment where a bunch of thoughts crash into your brain and you finally see clarity on something you been working on for so long?
i had one of those in the shower this morning, and seriously i couldn't contain myself until i sat down at this very moment - and now as i sit and write this, there is a sense of calm over my whole body that has not been there in i don't know how long
everything happens for a reason
thank you betsey for sharing all of your conversation with us that you had with k. it's because of your sharing that i did indeed have a uh huh moment
let me try to explain...
i thought hard about your interaction with k and then your posts here - telling us you didn't need the 2x4's - and frankly i didn't understand what you meant. i thought hard about your 'latitude in thinking'. i thought hard about you not needing patience. all of these particular things were not clicking. and then i thought about your comment 'k has already made a decision' - when i threw that into the mix it all became so clear
betsey - your right, you don't need 2x4's, you don't need patience. the one thing we all want from this is a decision - you have that. since you have that all you need is your latitude in thinking for k to get where he is gonna go. that will take time yes, but no longer are you in limbo for him to make a decision. he has made it - he has shown you by his actions (the old actions speak louder than words).
uh huh
my husband has made a decision. i see that now. actions do speak louder than words. he isn't going anywhere - i just need to have the latitude in thinking for him to get where he is gonna go. which i can see now where he is headed - no more limbo for me.
thank you betsey, i am rambling, but i think you understand where i am. i see it in my minds eye where you are, i just have a hard time putting it into words. i am there myself - no more anxiety. just a calm of knowing a decision has been made
Thanks for clarifying that Kitti! My mind is spinning from what I just read. Betsey you have such a way with words. I sometimes wish you would just spell it out for all of us that have trouble interpreting your interactions (LOL ).
I wish you all the luck with your conversations w/MW. I hope that the patience you are planning on continuinig does not leave yet another trip to limbo land. Bets, for some time now you have been probing and questioning and basically pushing your H for answers. I'm not saying that it's a bad thing, obviously you have gotten him to realize that it is HIS ship and he is acknowledging it. I just was wondering, how you have come to conclude that these probing questions are okay now as opposed to before? Just looking for insight into my own sit....
I know that you've read the MLC stuff but I'm excited coz he is facing those final fears and if the timeline is correct, he will soon be passing through that window of acceptance and shutting those doors behind him! WOW!!! That's so exciting.
I'm on the same journey w/you Bets and may use a few of your phrases in a convo w/H today since you have the better tongue for speaking w/eloquence.
Well all I can say is that I am hopeful that you will be able to get K to make that decision soon. Time is your friend but having you been saying that all along? I don't want to rain on your parade-maybe it's coz I'm at the same frustration level as you-but K has held out before. What will make this any different from before?
One more note.....VA beach was GREAT. Met some of these great folks that we are with now - KK, GD1, Cabanaboy.......just to name a few......what can I say? It was wonderful. Take care. Tootles...................
Well, I wish I knew when I actually typed what I was really trying to say. Some of the times, I do. But in the case of the past few days of posts, digesting and observing is what has given me clarity and more direction.
What I DO know is that I won't be taking another trip to limbo. My goal in bringing up the R talk on Saturday night was to attempt to understand where he is in the decision making process. Yes, I received flowers with a swell card, but they did not tell me for sure that he was working on the decision.
Because I was typing the post right after the call and very late at night, I didn't have the insight I did the following day. My thoughts were sort of jumbled though forming a more cohesive train of thought. It took a little more time to zero in on specifics.
There were so many other things that we discussed that I didn't post. Some of them were big things. Like the fact he told me point blank that if I hadn't made such incredible progress on my anger and bitterness, we wouldn't even be talking now. He also commended me for stopping a cycle that became the source of a lot of discontent, anger and resentment: resolving all the problems that weren't mine to fix.
For those of you who don't know my life with Mr. W., this is HUGE. I realized along the way that I needed to adopt a hands-off policy where issues didn't concern me. Read: if there are consequences for not taking action to mop up the mess before it caused collateral damage, those consequences MUST BE BORNE in order for both of us to proceed to the next step.
For one, he mentioned to me that dealing with D10s anger and disappointment and realizing how he had contributed to that equation were what started his wheels thinking. He HATES hurting her, but I was no longer pretending that I had to soothe her feelings so he didn't see her agitation.
He was forced to figure out a way to address this with her (in his own way and time). And you know what? It only helped him work through some of his previous unwillingness to work through the conflict. His MO before would have been: Screw this. Betsey will clean up this mess. Well, Betsey stopped doing it.
And by addressing with him how I truly feel, he was able to see that I was not using my emotion to blame him or make him feel guilty. When I initially called him, I told him that I was suffering. Instead of ending the call (which he would have done 6 months ago at that point), he asked me to tell him what makes me suffer?
I told him it's been really hard not knowing how the pendulum will swing, the fact that I haven't had attention or affection from him and any prioritization in the grand scheme of things. He became very empathetic and validated my feelings and apologized for deeply hurting me by his actions and inactions.
I told him I accepted the apology but wanted him to know that I know he didn't deliberately set out to hurt me. It happened as a consequence of his decisions. And then we turned that around to address all the good that came of out our separation.
I admit that it was tough to hear that he enjoys being away from us on a regular basis. He said it isn't as much about me and the girls or the stress we bring as much as it is that our life has been way too emotional. I could have launched into my own tangent and commented, "Well, that's the way it is, so get over it."
I didn't. I told him I understood. I can't comment how often I've thought that I wanted to run away. The first 3 years of D7's life was living hell, and I still have difficulty forcing myself to remember things that happened in that time frame. Unfortunately, the good events are eliminated too.. because I know immediately what was going on that was distracting. ("Oh, I remember that. That was fun. But didn't it get cut short because D7 got sick and wound up in the hospital for a week?" OR "Remember our 10th anniversary? It was the first time in years that we went out to eat in a good restaurant that wasn't the Burger King adjacent to the hospital.")
I have difficulty navigating through this, and I'm in a much better position to identify, label, process and file those feelings away than he is. And I can say without pause that all of my feelings about that past are uncomfortable and foreign.
And on top of that, he had to deal with his mother and her issues with me and her caterwauling about D7's diagnosis. I have to say she was devastated the day we found out she was epileptic. Mr. Wonderful's comments to her mirrored my own, "Jeez, Mom, that's treatable. What isn't is the fact that she is developmentally disabled. We can't cure that and we're going to have an adult disabled child to worry about for the rest of our lives. Get a grip!"
Karen, this IS different from before. Before I was testing the waters to see if he had made a decision. Each round of discussions has given me more direction and courage to tackle his fears head on.
It's provided me with enough information to realize that he HAS made a decision. He doesn't want a divorce. What is the alternative? Well, it's a no-brainer for me and ther rest of us here, but he doesn't feel it's a no brainer. Because he is absolutely terrified of what it's going to entail to work through this stuff.
I HAVE had the benefit of doing this on my own timeline and without him being in my space. That has literally been a godsend. He does things differently and I see that he is going to need me and the girls to help him work through these things.
A note about Gary... he told me a couple weeks ago that he's finding out that he needs space from Gary too. It seems as though Gary is now one who calls him a little more frequently than he would like to do things. And now Mr. Wonderful feels as though some other person has encroached upon the free time he values so much.
While I agree that Gary is not OW, I hope those of you who are battling this can see it IS a symptom and not the cause or the cure. I'll make the parallel to my own life. Gary was fun as long as he didn't want anything from Mr. Wonderful that he wasn't willing to give. The moment he wanted more, it became a red flag, signalling that it was no longer fun.
One can only hope that he really thinks I'm more fun in the long run. At least I don't fart for fun!
Betsey
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
Quote: He HATES hurting her, but I was no longer pretending that I had to soothe her feelings so he didn't see her agitation.
He was forced to figure out a way to address this with her (in his own way and time). And you know what? It only helped him work through some of his previous unwillingness to work through the conflict. His MO before would have been: Screw this. Betsey will clean up this mess. Well, Betsey stopped doing it.
I was trying to explain this to kitti last night. I, too, think my H is suffering from this. And in the past, I would have tried to 'make nice' and tell the kids they must call/visit their dad... well, they don't want to. They are hurt, and HE hurt them. They are setting their boundaries. And H is going to have to deal with the mess HE made himself. You are absolutely right. As a matter of fact, a devotional pointed this out to me... that often we let sympathy get in the way of God's will by not allowing consequences to take place... I think there is a whole book series on it "Love and Logic."
Plus, the trying to fix everything has just made me CRAZY... too much anxiety and stress about THINGS I HAVE NO CONTROL over.
I think my H is still at the "ending the call after I would tell him I am suffering" stage... but I am hoping that he is paying attention to what is going on. I am still in the testing the waters stage, and to be honest, I'm not too crazy about sticking my toe in too often... the water is still WAY too cold for me... But that no longer brings about the tremendous angst it once did. I no longer feel like I am on the huge rollercoaster, maybe just the kiddie ride. I AM still in limbo, but learning to enjoy the ride, not begging, or demanding to get off, or at least KNOW when the ride WILL end.
Quote: Gary was fun as long as he didn't want anything from Mr. Wonderful that he wasn't willing to give
Let's all pray this will happen with my H's "symptom" too.
Betsey, I hope you keep thinking... and I hope you keep posting.
And how come no one told me that The Power of Now was all about STOPPING YOUR THOUGHTS? Geez.. I would have bought it a lot sooner. I am definitely a run away thinker.
Thanks again, Betsey.
Relax. Appreciate. Be calm. Laugh. Enjoy. Be secure. Be loving. Be loved. Don't personalize. Don't ASSume. Accept. Be grateful.
I'm glad you enjoy the fruits of my thinking. But I'm thinking that the manufacturers of Advil are a whole lot more pleased...
I'll keep posting when this stuff surfaces. I'm finding it really hard to remember all the details of a convo that lasted an hour and 15 minutes. Granted, some of it was in silence, but it was pretty deep.
I think your paragraph about consequences being God's will is a really great one. I never thought about it from that perspective before, but I do now. Thanks for another paradigm shift. I also think I might have to apply that logic to my next round of discussions on this topic with D10.
Here's a fun one. Toward the end of that convo, he mentioned that he would be taking the motorcycle back to the apt with him because he wanted to take it out for a spin and think. He asked me if I had been out on the Harley with D (my boss) at all this year. I said sadly, "No, I didn't even get out last year."
I could feel his grin when he said, "Have you tried the chaps on yet?" I smiled back and said, "Yep, and they fit beautifully."
He responded, "Well, I would guess so. You're now about down to your fighting weight, and if I took you out in them, I know there would be some fighting."
Next bike ride, I'm inviting myself. I'll be standing out in the driveway in my black leather, thumbing a ride. That ought to get his attention...
Betsey
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
Betsey you are an awesome lady, person, mother, wife. I am in awe of you and inpiration to many! A Harley to boot--black leather chaps
When my H left me last year it was like a whole new world had been opened up to me. I could do anything I wanted to do and wanted to do everthing it was like I came alive!! What came to mind was to get a Harley and buy some black leather! A freind of mine and her H have a cyle and she's now a "rider" in black leather, offered me a ride on her BIL's bike, he's single and always looking for someone to ride with him. I want the leather and I want the thrill!!
I have been going back and reading many of your old posts and reading the ones that you write now. I believe the Lord is leading me down and new path about myself.
He has given me a lot of insight into me and my husband through you. Your situation sounds very similar to mine in many different ways and yet different in many different ways.
Now he has me down and avenue that is totally and completely examining myself. I was wondering if you could email me at ldbuyak@yahoo.com. I do have some personal questions that I would like to ask you. The Lord told me that you could probably give me some more insight into the area that I'm going into right now and help me in some areas that I seem to be having a hard time with.
It warms my heart to hear how your sitch is going. It forces me to rethink my cynicism regarding my R.
You mentioned that you had some tears while doing yard work this weekend? Strange I did too, I havent shed a tear for a few weeks then all of the sudden I had to sit down and mourn for awhile.
Maybe it was the Sun huh?
Before my Mom died a few years back, I hadnt cried for about ten years, now I get choked up every time I think of my kids!
Betsey 
