One day at a time.

[MikeP]

Not related to my sitch, awesome weather today. Low 80’s. Sitting here in shorts and a tee, waiting for charcoal to be ready, listening to some good tunes , and enjoying a good beer. Doesn’t get much better considering it’s March 1. I love summer and hate winter. How’s everyone else doing?

I would like to politely disagree. This is a great post about your sitch. It is focused on you and your happiness.

I thought the same thing after I posted. Thanks.

[MikeP]

Had a nice weekend. Met a guy for dinner that used to work for me. We sat and talked for 4 hours. Worked bingo with W and d13 for softball yesterday. That was an experience, met some interesting characters Then we went to eat dinner and things went south, think I got food poisoning. Not fun. Feeling better this evening except I feel like I was run over or beaten with a bat. Hopefully I be up and about tomorrow 🤞🏻

[MikeP]

I think I need some help/advice/reminders concerning my situation. Let me preface this by saying we had a R talk a few nights ago. It was mostly calm with one exception. W made the comment she could still end up back with the om if we were to get a D. That upset me because it sounds like she is still thinking about him. Of course I've thought that was still the case since she works with him. I simply stated that I'm tired of being an option for her versus us trying to reconcile and that we don't have a chance as long as she's still seeing him everyday at work. I know, I know. Say it anyway. What I need help with, besides my mouth, is the feeling that we are just going to slide back into the old R and nothing changes. Most times it feels that way. She still can't say she wants to be here. Ok. It's difficult not getting sucked into the feeling that things are normal. It's hard to detach when she is here, mostly being loving/affectionate, and wants to spend time together. Not tons of time, some time. She still says "I want, to want to be here". Her exact words. I have no reason to believe she's seeing om other than at work. We have Life 360 for the family so we all know where the others are. I guess I'm struggling to follow the rules because we are together so much and it messes with my mind when I am reminded she still doesn't know what she wants even though she acts like things are good. Hit me upside the head with a 2x4 if need be. I'm just feeling lost again lately. I'm in good spirits and staying somewhat busy. Probably not busy enough. Since I'm home a lot due to retirement I feel as if I've turned in to the housekeeper. Maybe I need to back off on that because I do think it makes me appear a bit beta if I'm being honest. Cleaning, doing laundry, doing dishes, running d13 everywhere she needs to be. In a normal situation having just retired this wouldn't be a problem. Currently I think it is. Thanks for any input. One last thing: we started talking at dinner one night about me getting a bike again. Not sure how it came up. She started in again acting like I'm crazy and as if I need her permission. My response was something to the effect of "I've done nothing my entire married life except try and take care of my family. I never bought toys for myself. I had a few old cars that were cheap at the time and sold them at a profit. Can you not stand to see me have this one thing that might make me happy?" She didn't know what to say. Finally said something about me getting hurt and if I get one I need to up my life insurance. Something I realized before that convo is, she has always treated me like a child to some degree. Everything I wanted to do in the past, for the most part, needed her approval. Every purchase needed her approval. Same rules didn't always apply to her. Just a realization that came to me. I also think there is a lot of resentment towards me in general just because I'm a man. I think deep down there is a good deal of Feminism in her. I think it's only the negative parts though. She can't stand it when I can do something she can't. Anything. No matter how silly. Even things that involve strength. We used to occasionally wrestle like a couple of kids. Inevitably she would become angry because she couldn't beat me. Sometimes I would let her and then she would be pissed cause she knew I let her. I was never a bully about it. Tried to keep it light and fun. That's one example of many others I could give. I don't mean to ramble I just remembered this as I was about to post. Maybe it's meaningless. I just know it has bothered me in the past.

[Kind18]

"I want, to want to be here".

Translation:
“I don’t want to be here, but I feel bad about it.”

[Rockon]

I hear ya Mike. I’ve been thinking of getting a bike too! Interestingly I haven’t mentioned it to W - my sitch is different in some ways to yours - this week she sends me a phot of a collector bike she thought I might like (in fact she mentioned that eldest S might like it).

My thoughts for you are :
-I think you are doing a heck of a job and it’s really not easy. Maybe give yourself a bit of a break.
-own your power be strong for the benefit of yourself, who you want to be what you want out of life. That’s attractive for a woman (might be your W in the future ) who wants to be with you.
-know what you want in your ongoing M if that happens and don’t settle. Terry Real has some really good stuff on this. Be clear.
-listen and validate. Be curious. You might not know a response that fits right away - could say I need to give that some thought. Don’t react.

[DnJ]

Hello Mike

I want, to want to be here.

That’s different than “I don’t want to be here”, in my opinion. True it’s not the grand committed statement of wanting to work things out. However, that’s not how these situations go. It took a while for her to stray and decide to want to leave, it takes a while for that to unwind. It starts with a whisper of doubt. The tiny voice and realization of what they might just be tossing away.

Hit me upside the head with a 2x4 if need be. I'm just feeling lost again lately.

Okay.

W made the comment she could still end up back with the om if we were to get a D.

Sounds like OM is the one placed on a shelf, if he is anywhere. She states “could still end up back with”, which implies he is current not.

They will test to see how we will react. Can we forgive them? Do we forgive them? Is the new and improved Mike real? He has been acting different. And I’ve noticed. But is it authentic? And so on. These are some of the doubts and questions swimming around W’s mind.

I get it, pretty unfair being tested and having to hold your tongue. Look, she doesn’t realize she is testing, and she hasn’t done the same level of inner work as you; so the lion’s share of this falls upon you for the moment. Her time is coming. Be patient.

That upset me because it sounds like she is still thinking about him.

Why would you be upset with whatever her thoughts are? I think you are most upset because you are/keep thinking about him.

I’m pretty zen-like. Consider the following:

- - - -

A senior monk and a junior monk were traveling together. At one point, they came to a river with a strong current. As the monks were preparing to cross the river, they saw a very young and beautiful woman also attempting to cross. The young woman asked if they could help her cross to the other side.

The two monks glanced at one another because they had taken vows not to touch a woman.
Then, without a word, the older monk picked up the woman, carried her across the river, placed her gently on the other side, and carried on his journey.

The younger monk couldn’t believe what had just happened. After rejoining his companion, he was speechless, and an hour passed without a word between them.

Two more hours passed, then three, finally the younger monk could contain himself any longer, and blurted out “As monks, we are not permitted a woman, how could you then carry that woman on your shoulders?”

The older monk looked at him and replied, “Brother, I set her down on the other side of the river, why are you still carrying her?”

- - - -

Live in the present moment. Carrying around past hurts, holding onto resentments really only hurts ourselves.

We all go through times in life when other people say things or behave in a way that is hurtful towards us. We can chose to ruminate over past actions or events, which will ultimately weigh us down and sap our energy.

Or one can choose to let go of what doesn’t serve anymore and concentrate on the present moment. Until one finds a level of peace and happiness in the present circumstances of their lives, one will never be content, because “now” is all one truly has.

Stop carrying OM around.

Of course I've thought that was still the case since she works with him. I simply stated that I'm tired of being an option for her versus us trying to reconcile and that we don't have a chance as long as she's still seeing him everyday at work. I know, I know. Say it anyway.

“We don't have a chance as long as she's still seeing him everyday at work”. Do you believe this? Deep down Mike, do you believe that statement?

I’m talking a belief, a conviction, a deeply held motivation for how and why you live your life like you do.

I’m going to go out on a limb and say you likely spoke more from your emotions than reason or faith/beliefs. Do work to limit such outburst. Especially when they reinforce “reasons” for ending things.

What I need help with, besides my mouth, is the feeling that we are just going to slide back into the old R and nothing changes.

Ok. So change something. What would you like changed? What would you like to change?

You like to change. You can only directly control yourself. So, what do you want to change? And what is stopping you?

By the way, positive changes, and continuing positive present actions will influence W. That’s how you can influence a change in her.

You don’t want the old R back. Good. Craft a better one. Live a better one. It’s a slow process, and one which W is likely to be suspect of. And maybe even you will likewise be wary. Of course, you kind of currently are methinks.

Most times it feels that way. She still can't say she wants to be here. Ok. It's difficult not getting sucked into the feeling that things are normal. It's hard to detach when she is here, mostly being loving/affectionate, and wants to spend time together. Not tons of time, some time.

Turn your expectations down to zero. Unmet expectations lead to resentments. And resentment builds and builds over time. Dial those expectations back, you don’t want to poison things.

I have no reason to believe she's seeing om other than at work.

Good. Now listen to the senior monk and quit carrying him around.

I guess I'm struggling to follow the rules because we are together so much and it messes with my mind when I am reminded she still doesn't know what she wants even though she acts like things are good.

Her not knowing what she wants is much better than her knowing she wants out. Right now, her uncertainty is an ally. She is open to influence.

Be the best version of you. A man only a fool would leave.

Not a doormat. Not sulking and resentful. And not a housekeeper either. Do your fair share. Maybe even more than; being retired does offer you that opportunity.

Probably not busy enough.

And do stuff. Hobbies. Projects. Things you’ve been putting off. Pick them up again.

Can you not stand to see me have this one thing that might make me happy?

Mike, happy doesn’t come from things.

I've done nothing my entire married life except try and take care of my family.

You’ve been on this journey for a while now. Long enough that certain facets of your situation are through anger, have entered into some bargaining, and some have entered into depression.

Bargaining is the last ditch attempt at feeling the old normal. Then comes the sinking feeling of depression as we face our loss. Depression is dark and one looses sight of good and happy feelings and memories.

Getting to the other side brings acceptance and a new outlook. One which quite frankly is hard to fathom while working one’s way through the bog.

Have faith my friend. Make no major life decisions based upon these temporary feelings. I know they feel strong. And they do fleet in time.

D

[MikeP]

Thanks for the reply D. I think I'm upset with her making that statement because it reinforces what I already know, she's not committed to us. I honestly haven't thought about him for quite some time until now. I do believe we don't have much chance at least as long as she's around him every day. My logic says this-She was intent on leaving me for him. Told me it was so much different; she was happier around him. I forced her to make a choice she wasn't ready to make, and she did choose me. Almost a year later and she's still not happy with me. She interacts with the thing she thought would make her happy every day. How does she ignore that? I know the things she said about him being the answer were mostly b.s. She may not come to that conclusion until she finally leaves me for him and finds out. That's why I believe this to be true. Hope I'm wrong. I'm not looking for a reason to end things yet. I want this to work out. Turning my expectations down to zero is probably what I was needing help with or a reminder. That's what has been so hard lately when things seem normal. I like what you said about her uncertainty being an ally, never thought of it that way. Thanks. What I meant about not wanting the old relationship back was her just deciding everything is back to normal without doing any of the work she needs to do. She desperately needs counseling or therapy, whichever applies. I don't know that she will ever take that step. I would hate for us to never reconcile because she won't do anything except show up. I know that material things can't make me "happy". However, they can provide entertainment or enjoyment and that's something I've been missing for most of my adult life. Cruising around and working on old cars used to be my thing. I loved it and miss it. I've also always wanted a street bike. I know a lot of people that ride and that could provide me a new experience in life. A new community to associate with. I've never been much on material things, I'm a pretty simple (boring) person. I don't know which stage or facet of this journey I'm in. I do struggle with feelings of depression at times. Mostly I seem confused. I'm probably to blame for not following the rules better.

[Rockon]

What I’m reading here Mike is - sounds like time to get the bike.

[Ready2Change]

What I’m reading here Mike is - sounds like time to get the bike.

I agree.

And if she brings up upping the insurance, she can pay for it out of her money. My X wife was paying for life insurance on me up until recently. Think of a good way to state this to her.

[Dats000]

Cruising around and working on old cars used to be my thing. I loved it and miss it. I've also always wanted a street bike. I know a lot of people that ride and that could provide me a new experience in life. A new community to associate with.

Sounds like you would be GAL in a big way.

I'm a pretty simple (boring) person. I don't know which stage or facet of this journey I'm in. I do struggle with feelings of depression at times. Mostly I seem confused.

I get it, this it is a good reason why our W leave. So if you financially can get a bike. Do it then you become more attractive to your W. If you go out with your friends biking you become more mysterious to W and she will want to know where you’re at, and want to be with you, and then hopefully W becomes attracted to you again and respects you more. To me this is all part of the divorce busting principles.