Sometimes, misogynistic books get plugged here. Many good ones get plugged, too! I'd do a quick search for <title>/<author> + "misogyny" and see what pops up. Misogyny isn't self-improvement and is more likely to lead to frustration than success with your W and dating.
My fave book is "The Lost Art of Listening". The Active Listening and Validation skills it teaches were huge for me in getting to reconciliation and addresses 2 of the 3 problems MWD cites as responsible for the downfall of most salvageable marriages. Scott has also recommended it. Titles by Brené Brown and Kristin Neff also tend to be excellent.
LOL. He'll try to get me removed from the board by saying I am "cyberbullying" him but you may want to read Travelers threads before you take advice from him.
If we're talking about pie-in-the-sky hopes, I would want my old wife back and to live the life I thought we were destined for, raising our children together.
You're not alone. Most of us wanted that. However, as you mention it's not up to us.
Originally Posted by Doug54
Since I can't control W or her actions, I want to work toward self-betterment, being a good father, being happy, eliminating any co-dependent traits, world peace, ending hunger...
Good goals. Though you may be biting off a little too much with the last two ;-)
Originally Posted by Doug54
You know...of course the easy answer is that it's her journey. But I'm definitely getting the brunt of it- the snippy responses, moods, eye rolls. One minute she might be acting p!ssy towards me, the next having a full-hearted chuckle with her daughter (my stepdaughter). My IC said I'm probably being "targeted" as a source of what's wrong in her life, though I don't know how much specific familiarity he has with MLC.
It's common for the WAS/WS to give a lot of grief to the LBS, even in cases where the LBS was a pretty decent or even good spouse. They're unhappy, and they often put the blame of their unhappiness onto someone else rather than looking inward. So I wouldn't be surprised if you're IC is right (at least partially). It could also be projecting the hurt/anger/blame she has for her own actions & decisions onto you. She feels bad at first about what she's doing but can't blame herself forever and live with that so she has to put that on someone else (often times the spouse).
Originally Posted by Doug54
Yes, I do still love her. Eighteen years together and three children (plus the two stepchildren I raised as my own with W) creates a history that can't just be turned off.
Understandable. A lot of shared history and memories. It doesn't just go away (on either side).
Originally Posted by Doug54
To answer the second question, today, at this moment - no, I don't think I could do two years of this. Even if I were to assume we're maybe 6 months in, and that two years is down to 1.5...I just don't know. If I had a crystal ball and *knew* W would come out of it- could I deal with a year and half of suckitude? Probably. But as a total maybe that she'd exit the MLC? I just don't know.
I think I told you once you have to steel your resolve if you're going to stick it out. Every timeline is different, but it's most likely to take much longer than you first imagine/hope/realize. If you're already saying you can't stick it out a year or two...
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
Yes, I do still love her. Eighteen years together and three children (plus the two stepchildren I raised as my own with W) creates a history that can't just be turned off. Some erosion has definitely occurred, but what's been broken can still be put back together. Will it? I really don't know. If I had to guess today, I would put about an 80 percent chance of divorce on my situation. W is really yearning to see if the grass is greener on the other side.
To answer the second question, today, at this moment - no, I don't think I could do two years of this. Even if I were to assume we're maybe 6 months in, and that two years is down to 1.5...I just don't know. If I had a crystal ball and *knew* W would come out of it- could I deal with a year and half of suckitude? Probably. But as a total maybe that she'd exit the MLC? I just don't know.
I would say that YOU have some decisions to make then.....
You are torn....
That's fairly normal this early on...
What if I would guarantee that she would come back ?
What if I would tell you that she just has some steam to blow off and she will be home by November ???
You would do that....right ?
What if, I told you that you would walk through hell with gasoline shorts on, not knowing if you would ever get another chance at a relationship with her...
Go about YOUR business, do the hard internal work of making yourself a better person, just living your life for you and your kiddos....
That makes the choice harder....yes ?
One of those options is "for better"
One of those options is "for worse"
You did promise both didn't you ?
Standing for your marriage is your choice....
You get to make that choice every freakin morning when you wake up...
But you kinda should choose one or the other...
You can't ride two horses with one a$s....
Halfway doing this isn't either answer...
And not to bash you in the head or anything....
But 18 years, and 5 children....
I would think that she deserves a little more than a few months to figure it out...
Maybe ?
Don't let HER define who YOU wanna be....
Once a person finds them self here, the majority of the time, the Marriage that you once knew is already gone. It will be no more. And anything down the road will have to rebuilt from the ashes of that. Hopefully with a new set of skills, appreciation, and commitment from both of you.
And would you really want the same marriage back ?
Soooo....
What would YOU like to do, and work on ???
Somewhere around here, Cadet has some reading material lists....???
Hey LH19 - I saw in another thread that you mentioned since your D you'd probably read about 40 books on self-improvement and relationships (while your EXW had read maybe one). Can you think of maybe the best book that I should look into for this point in my situation? Or maybe something generically good and helpful? Appreciate it.
Doug I think every man should read "How to be a 3% Man" by Corey Wayne. If you are looking for something to get your mind off your sitch I would suggest "Four Agreements". Of course at some point you should read the "Five Love Languages". The girl I am dating just borrowed my copy this morning.
Are you hitting the gym Doug?
Thanks for the suggestions. Want to hear some horrible irony? W gifted me a copy of "The Five Love Languages" many years ago and I never fully read it. I guess I got what I deserve.
And yes, I'm always hitting the gym. If I strike out in post-marriage dating, it won't be due to my body (uh... I hope not).
Sometimes, misogynistic books get plugged here. Many good ones get plugged, too! I'd do a quick search for <title>/<author> + "misogyny" and see what pops up. Misogyny isn't self-improvement and is more likely to lead to frustration than success with your W and dating.
My fave book is "The Lost Art of Listening". The Active Listening and Validation skills it teaches were huge for me in getting to reconciliation and addresses 2 of the 3 problems MWD cites as responsible for the downfall of most salvageable marriages. Scott has also recommended it. Titles by Brené Brown and Kristin Neff also tend to be excellent. Live well, live bravely!
Thanks, Traveler. I definitely need to work on my listening skills, which have gotten better since coming upon this site, for what that's worth. I think I'm getting better at validating, though it's not second nature for me yet.
Want to hear some horrible irony? W gifted me a copy of "The Five Love Languages" many years ago and I never fully read it. I guess I got what I deserve.
Easy not to fully appreciate the significance at the time, so don't beat yourself up over it, but likely a warning sign back then...
Last edited by BL42; 08/03/2201:58 AM.
Me:39 Ex-W:37 M:7 T: 9 S:6 D:3 BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20 OM1 affair ends: May '20 W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20 W files for D: Jul20 OM2 confirmed: 9/2020 Divorced: May '21
It's common for the WAS/WS to give a lot of grief to the LBS, even in cases where the LBS was a pretty decent or even good spouse. They're unhappy, and they often put the blame of their unhappiness onto someone else rather than looking inward. So I wouldn't be surprised if you're IC is right (at least partially). It could also be projecting the hurt/anger/blame she has for her own actions & decisions onto you. She feels bad at first about what she's doing but can't blame herself forever and live with that so she has to put that on someone else (often times the spouse).
That's spot-on. I'm not saying it makes things easier to deal with, but there are common traits to WAS/WS/MLCers.
Originally Posted by Doug54
To answer the second question, today, at this moment - no, I don't think I could do two years of this. Even if I were to assume we're maybe 6 months in, and that two years is down to 1.5...I just don't know. If I had a crystal ball and *knew* W would come out of it- could I deal with a year and half of suckitude? Probably. But as a total maybe that she'd exit the MLC? I just don't know.
I think I told you once you have to steel your resolve if you're going to stick it out. Every timeline is different, but it's most likely to take much longer than you first imagine/hope/realize. If you're already saying you can't stick it out a year or two...[/quote] That's a fair point. And like you, I don't want to be the one pulling the plug. But if things deteriorate to the point where I feel treated like a second-class citizen in my own house... who knows.
I would say that YOU have some decisions to make then.....
You are torn....
That's fairly normal this early on...
What if I would guarantee that she would come back ?
What if I would tell you that she just has some steam to blow off and she will be home by November ???
You would do that....right ?
Just to be clear, no one has left the house yet and we're still sleeping in the same bed, looking like a regular all-American family to our neighbors. But the writing is on the wall with W wanting out, dreaming of greener pastures. Will she pull the trigger? We'll see.
Originally Posted by Mach1
What if, I told you that you would walk through hell with gasoline shorts on, not knowing if you would ever get another chance at a relationship with her...
Go about YOUR business, do the hard internal work of making yourself a better person, just living your life for you and your kiddos....
That makes the choice harder....yes ?
One of those options is "for better"
One of those options is "for worse"
You did promise both didn't you ?
That's true, but as I alluded to in my first post, I don't know the depth and scope of this emotional affair that happened and/or continues to happen. The MLC "journey" in and of itself is easier to stomach than your spouse having an inappropriate outlet with someone else that supersedes the marriage. A lot unanswered...I have to make my peace with it or move on.
Originally Posted by Mach1
Standing for your marriage is your choice....
You get to make that choice every freakin morning when you wake up...
But you kinda should choose one or the other...
You can't ride two horses with one a$s....
Halfway doing this isn't either answer...
And not to bash you in the head or anything....
But 18 years, and 5 children....
I would think that she deserves a little more than a few months to figure it out...
Maybe ?
Figure it out? Sure. Fish around for other men? Nah. Which of the two is going on? I feel like I'm eating a shyt sandwich. My default mode is giving her space and getting my @ss outta the house. Every moment isn't bad but it still feels a little like purgatory.
Originally Posted by Mach1
Once a person finds them self here, the majority of the time, the Marriage that you once knew is already gone. It will be no more. And anything down the road will have to rebuilt from the ashes of that. Hopefully with a new set of skills, appreciation, and commitment from both of you.
And would you really want the same marriage back ?
That's fine. Sign me up for it. I could handle Marriage 2.0, featuring the refurbished Doug...validating feelings and sucking the marrow out of life.
Originally Posted by Mach1
Somewhere around here, Cadet has some reading material lists....???
Codependent no more....
Journey from abandonment to healing
No more Mr. nice guy
The 5 love languages...
Those were a few that I read during this.....
Good titles. I will look into the ones I haven't read yet; thanks.
