Need advice please (2)

[LH19]

is that I know she is not obviously in a good state of mind

What do you mean by this statement?

and was worried she would bring up my past stuff if she felt I threw her under the bus and, again am wanting to protect the kids from that hurt as well.

You are going to have to own your $hit and take it like a man Dink.

[Traveler]

Dink, I agree I would stop lying to your kids if it's not mutual.

You don't need to be tell-all. "Whose decision was it and why?!" "That's between your mom and I." I don't believe my kids are served by knowing the reasons I left my XW, but I try to be honest, and don't makeup stories around it either.

I'd take some time to consider what more you want to tell them if anything. You have your whole life to add to what you tell them, but you can never subtract from what you've told them.

[Traveler]

she would bring up my past stuff if she felt I threw her under the bus and, again am wanting to protect the kids from that hurt as well.

I agree fighting out "Whose fault was it?!" with the kids probably wouldn't be best for them.

[Dink]

What I mean is that my wife right now I don’t think it is a good frame of mind. My sister in law even has said she hasn’t been for a while. So I think that’s part of why I didn’t say it was her idea.In the past when she was really down or depressed is when the whole Nashville thing and taking the pills happened. My sister in law thinks though right now she is manic state, in a high because she thinks
She is free from her past and past feelings by saying she wants a divorce and things are going to magically get better. She said also, once she finally get a dose of reality and the real ramification of her decision, and how it really is going to change her life, and her relationship probably with her kids, and she will come crashing down. Then my sister in law said, she is going to hate when all the kids are coming up to the lake and her and her husband and me and the kids are all hanging out at the sandbar and she won’t be able to be part of it. She said right now she has farsightness
And isn’t seen what the immediate impact is going to be and she said personally believe she is going to regret this. She said I wouldn’t be surprised if she might be talking to the last person was talking with before you got back together or someone’s else because she said she can’t be alone, she need someone and always has.

[LH19]

She said right now she has farsightness and isn’t seen what the immediate impact is going to be and she said personally believe she is going to regret this.

Dink I would bet that every person on this board has been told this by someone close to them. The truth is maybe she will and maybe she won't. These statements while well meaning get people stuck.

As for right frame of mind this is another narrative LBS like to spin. Well if she is leaving me she must not be in the right frame of mind, MLC etc. If you go over to the MLC thread you can read people spinning these same things 9 years later. To me it's "chasing the dragon".

[Traveler]

Hi Dink,

My sister in law thinks though right now she is manic state, in a high because she thinks

I'd drop all this armchair diagnosis and speculation about the future.

Then my sister in law said, she is going to hate when all the kids are coming up to the lake and her and her husband and me and the kids are all hanging out at the sandbar and she won’t be able to be part of it.

Often, after the dust settles, family sticks with family. There are definitely exceptions--just don't get your long-term hopes up too high based on your sister-in-law's feelings today. Those feelings often change.

So I think that’s part of why I didn’t say it was her idea.

I like "It's between your mom and I", because it keeps the kids away from the drama and picking sides. I'm 11yrs out and past any fantasy of telling my kids all the wrongs their mom did. Their mom isn't that person anymore. If they ever ask I'll be as delicate as possible because I want them to have a good relationship with each of us.

[SteveLW]

Dink, I am not sure if you are reading the responses here or not. It feels like you read one response then go into a defensive, justification mode. Just an observation. I grew up with a father like that. The minute he felt that someone was questioning him, he would go into victim mode and give a million reasons why he said or did what he said or did.

Our responses and questions are for you to think and consider. You do not owe any of us any explanations for why you did or said what you did or said. This is your situation, you have to own. All we can do is respond to what you post here, and try to get you to see a better way of moving forward. Many of us have asked you direct questions, to which you never even acknowledged or responded. That is fine. But it kind of like the rules of engagement I repeated in a previous post, if you are not interested in answering or changing how you communicate with her, then just tell me that so I stop repeating myself. I honestly do not know if you ignore the advice because you want to, or because you never even read it!

Dink, this is difficult. We all get that. You thought things were going great, though I wonder how true this is based on your exchanges with your sister-in-law and admitting to walking on egg-shells for years. But the only way you can change things is to change the dynamics involved. The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and hoping for a different result. Please read the responses and consider them. And resist the urge to jump to defensive justifications for everything you've already posted. As we say in euchre, a card laid is a card played.

[BL42]

Dink,

I didn’t want this divorce

My personal opinion is you should always be honest and never lie, especially to your kids. So, if you don't want the divorce you should not tell them the decision is mutual. Especially considering they're grown adults and not little kids. If they can't trust you on that, will they start wondering what else they can't trust you on? Be honest. It doesn't mean you should get bogged down in the details or sling mud - absolutely not - but don't lie about the situation.

but was trying to and I know now I was wrong, protect the kids from being mad at their mom for this, and In do so protecting her from her actions.

Right. Don't throw mud and disparage her but don't lie for her either. Be short, straightforward, and to the point, say the details are between you and your W but it's not your job to lie to defend of protect her.

Her sister and husband live by me on the LakeHouse

In terms of your SIL and BIL, it doesn't sounds like you sought out interactions or said anything inflammatory, which is good, but try to limit discussions with them moving forward at least related to the R. Anything you say can and will be held against you in a court of your W. Be friendly and neighborly, but don't engage in wife/relationship talks going forward. It's tempting, but won't help.

Then again she says I love my sister but I serious think she is bipolar and has so mental issues that she need to get attention for to help. Then her and her husband said, trust me we know all the stuff you do for her and you seriously are a saint, so we don’t know what the f she is thinking right now.

This may be temporarily comforting to you, but won't help in the long term.

Then my sister in law says that this same son a couple days ago reach out to her and said to her, and I believe he was sober from what I understand said, you guys better tell me if you think there is any funny business going on.

Your son already suspects funny business and he will find out eventually whether he goes full on PI (at his age) or it just comes out over time. If she's living with OM her your adult kids won't take long to figure it out. Don't be the one passing it around.

Yes I didn’t want the divorce, but I guess in my stupid mind right now I am trying to,protect the kids from feeling angry which from what you guys are telling me is the wrong thing to do and to stop trying to protect my wife and let her suffer consequences.

It's not about letting your W suffer consequences, it's about being honest in your relationship with your kids. Don't tell them you want the divorce if you don't. But again, don't drag them into the details either.

I miss my family.

Sorry man. I understand the feeling, trust me. Make sure you continue cultivating your relationship with your kids and grandkid. You still have a family, it just may be different moving forward.

You guys on here and I don’t know a single one of you, are good people, you truly are and I know I am as well. And I appreciate you more than you will know.

We're just paying it forward.

I do have plans this weekend to go golfing with my two sons

Awesome! Great way to bond with your kids. Enjoy.

and working on the house has keep me busy.

Good stuff.

and was worried she would bring up my past stuff if she felt I threw her under the bus and, again am wanting to protect the kids from that hurt as well.

You are going to have to own your $hit and take it like a man Dink.

Yep. It's all going to come out. Just be honest and own it. "Yes, I did and it's been a major regret of mine which I've worked for years to make amends for." That's all you can do.

What I mean is that my wife right now I don’t think it is a good frame of mind. My sister in law even has said she hasn’t been for a while. So I think that’s part of why I didn’t say it was her idea.In the past when she was really down or depressed is when the whole Nashville thing and taking the pills happened. My sister in law thinks though right now she is manic state, in a high because she thinks
She is free from her past and past feelings by saying she wants a divorce and things are going to magically get better. She said also, once she finally get a dose of reality and the real ramification of her decision, and how it really is going to change her life, and her relationship probably with her kids, and she will come crashing down. Then my sister in law said, she is going to hate when all the kids are coming up to the lake and her and her husband and me and the kids are all hanging out at the sandbar and she won’t be able to be part of it. She said right now she has farsightness
And isn’t seen what the immediate impact is going to be and she said personally believe she is going to regret this. She said I wouldn’t be surprised if she might be talking to the last person was talking with before you got back together or someone’s else because she said she can’t be alone, she need someone and always has.

This could very well be true, but you can't talk her out and it doesn't change how you should act moving forward. It's up to her to pick her path. As the saying goes here, "not your monkeys, not your circus". It's not your job to save her, nor can you.

Your avoidant nature still has me asking a lot of questions. So I will put them here:

- Are you in IC?
- Have you read Divorce Remedy (or at least Divorce Busting)?
- Do you still want to get back together with her despite the fact that she is in an ongoing affair?
- How are you staying busy? What are you doing for GAL?
- Do you understand what detachment is? Have you read the threads here on it? Do you have any questions about it?
- If you aren't in IC (and you seem to be anti-IC since you continue to ignore that), what are your plans for self-improvements?

Dink - How about an answer to SteveLW's questions, one by one?

[Traveler]

My personal opinion is you should always be honest and never lie, especially to your kids.

A practical consequence of lying is if/when the truth comes out Dirk's kids may have less trust in him vs. his wife. I don't know if honesty is one of his virtues? It's one I try to instill in my kids. Being an honest isn't always easy. E.g., Thu/Fri I'm taking my kids out of school for a vacation and that's not an excused absence. I could've called them in "sick". Instead, I called the school's VP to tell him about the trip and he approved it. I then helped my D e-mail each of her teachers.

[SteveLW]

Dink, I was thinking of your situation this morning. I know you have a difficult time not communicating with her, especially if she is the one to reach out.

I think the best way to approach this is day-by-day. I had a longtime, on-again off-again relationship with a woman before I was married. This went on for literally decades. It hamstrung me for other Rs until I met my W. I knew I needed to go dark but it was difficult for me because I craved hearing from her. It was very beta behavior. Finally one day I decided that I would not answer her phone calls, that I would let it go to my answering machine (yes, I said that right! LOL). I had already gone into the mode of never being the one to initiate contact. But I would take it each day. Each day I would remind myself that I wasn't contacting her. I tried to stay busy (I had two jobs at the time, and with my friends it was pretty easy). By NOT initiating contact, by staying busy, and by letting the answering machine deal with her phone calls if I happened to be home, I was able to each day remind myself that this was my approach. And I was able to stay dark until our paths would cross physically (we each had social networks that intersected).

Take it day by day. Look at my previous post about the rules of engagement. If you don't want to answer my questions that BL repeated, at least dwell on them to help yourself. I know you are spinning and struggling, and when you are it is difficult to think objectively and logically. Remember, we are here to help if you would only confer with us before taking action. We can at least giveyou things to think about.

Better days are ahead, Dink. I know it doesn't feel like it right now.