Another year in life of

[Dawn70]

It has been my experience, LH, that some men have equally high expectations. But, why is having high expectations a bad thing? While you might not be put off by the women I was talking about, a lot of men would be, so the whole thing is a crapshoot. I'm not saying that is a bad thing either way...just an observation. And, I absolutely could not agree more that it is sad that bad people ruin it for everyone else. It's a mixed bag, honestly, because good can come from it and I'm actually proof of that, since Sparky and I met OLD, but not everyone is as lucky. I think a lot of things play into it, actually. Geographical location is a huge factor, I think (and could totally be wrong). I think what, specifically, you are looking for makes a huge difference as well.

I guess the world would be perfect or I would be a gazillionaire because I solved all the world's problems, if we could "fix" OLD, but it is what it is.

[LH19]

It has been my experience, LH, that some men have equally high expectations. But, why is having high expectations a bad thing?

No it's not a bad thing on an individual basis but when I read stats that the avg. man has to send 120 messages to get one returned it seems insane to me. Don't get me wrong the majority of the reason OLD is not working is because of men but I also think women over value themselves.

I will say this to the day I die. One of the biggest lies ever told is when a woman says "All I want is a nice guy".

[kml]

I’ve met plenty of pervy and skeevy guys at parties and nightclubs too when I was younger. OLD may make them more bold but normal people are OLD too. Honestly, if you’re of an age where most people are coupled up (therefore single people at their parties are rare), and don’t work in an occupation that brings you into contact with lots of members of the opposite sex, you’re pretty much left with OLD, meetup groups or trying to pick someone up in the grocery store. Maybe it’s a factor of my age, but since my divorce at age 52, I’ve dated one guy who picked me up in a store (Mr. Big Lots), and been the victim of one unwanted blind date (concert with friends, they invited their single guy friend without telling me it was a fix-up, he was a skinflint chiropractor who didn’t want to tip the waitress). EVERY other date has been from OLD. This despite, pre-Covid, me being active in the music community and meeting many men there and even fans. The truth is, OLD is just a way to meet people who are actually available to date, in the large sea of people who aren’t.

[LH19]

I think it's pretty simple. The people who have success with it like it and the people who haven't don't. I just don't like how Don always has to take every opportunity to squash it. Some of the new guys are reading this and giving up on it way to early. Is it for everyone? No. But it can be rewarding if you are patient and keep your expectations low.

[DonH]

I think it's pretty simple. The people who have success with it like it and the people who haven't don't.

Very true. However, how do you define success? I guess clearly Dawns experience could be termed a success. And I know there are others. I have a good friend who also has a success with 3 kids coming up on married 15 years through OLD. I went into OLD some, what, 12 or more years ago, with a hopeful attitude. And back then the chances at success and the ratio of honest and real to scammer and broken seemed much better. But like many things in life, over time OLD has gotten worse and worse. As Dawn asserts, the dynamic has gotten worse over time because the quality people see what’s there and run away after a few bad experiences while the bottom fishers see an opportunity and are attracted to the fray. Then there are the scammers, the liars, the broken and yes all the misfit toys. Quality attracts quality and broken and misfit attracts more of the same. Nothing in life is ever absolute. Some people can make it work but for everyone of the success stories there are at least a 1:10 ratio of disappointment - and 1:10 may be very generous.

I just don't like how Don always has to take every opportunity to squash it.

Im a very data driven person. I just gather the intel, and form my opinion. If it were simply my own experience that would be one thing but LH says himself how it takes maybe 100 messages to get one response. That’s how you define success? I guess I have a different definition. Dawn is a success story but Ginger is clearly not. Sadly there are far less Mary Anne’s (Dawn [Wells]) than there are Ginger’s. Stretching to make that joke work. If dating 2 or 3 women for a few months after a year or two of trying which included countless hours of effort and dozens of single dates and likely far more ghostings, well more power to you. I’ve likely dated the same amount but without all the online effort and disappointment. Likely going out this weekend with someone I met Saturday. She may not be a match (she’s more shy and introverted than I’m typically attracted to) but who knows. At least it’s a level playing field and I see first hand who I’m about to spend some time with on a date and so does she. Neither of us are hiding behind a keyboard.

Bottom line, there are clearly more frustrating failure stories than there are true success stories OLD. At least when using my definition of success. There are just far more people saying, nope, I’m out, this is a good idea that has been too corrupted. Im much happier and far less frustrated offline. I’ve pursued dates or meetups perhaps with 2 women this year (remember we’re on,yb5 weeks in) and 1 is in the que, while the other somewhat flaked but I also then lost interested and didn’t try again. It still could happen as I know our paths will cross again. I’m still 1 for 2 - which would never happen OLD. That doesn’t mean it does not work for others - just many to most of the others. I may have a shot at less women but my frustration, and I suspect Gingers and many others as well, is far lower while still getting the same number if quality dates.

So if it works for you - great. I’d say play the lotto as well since you are beating the odds. Just dint go in thinking OLD is going to be the magic ticket. It just clearly is not. But hey someone has to be like Dawn or my friend. There are just far more like Ginger and myself. And remember Ginger went in with a positive attitude and gave it a huge and long try. And for the record I don’t consider a FB hiking group to be OLD.

[bttrfly]

the thing that no one's mentioning is age playing a factor. single people of a certain age are single for a multiplicity of reasons which add up to one thing: we're not young, fresh and without baggage.

I tried the online thing. It was a huge turnoff for me. I won't venture back. If I date at all it's going to be meeting someone organically in the wild, as it were ... I feel much safer taking my chances there, but diff strokes for diff folks ...

[LH19]

Ah so you have to get married for it to be a success. Again I think me and Deja have the same opinion about it. Even if we don't find a match we spend a night out meeting someone new so in that regards it is a success. I don't get ghosted often and when I do I certainly don't lose sleep over it. Again I am really sorry that the the experience you had was so bad that you spend your time degraded it every chance you get. Makes me a little sad. Anyhow I am glad you have a date this weekend and I hope it works out for you.

So FB hiking group message good a match.com message bad. Yeah this makes sense to me (insert LH eyeroll).

[LH19]

the thing that no one's mentioning is age playing a factor. single people of a certain age are single for a multiplicity of reasons which add up to one thing: we're not young, fresh and without baggage.

I tried the online thing. It was a huge turnoff for me. I won't venture back. If I date at all it's going to be meeting someone organically in the wild, as it were ... I feel much safer taking my chances there, but diff strokes for diff folks ...

BF what was your issues with it.

[Dawn70]

Ah so you have to get married for it to be a success. Again I think me and Deja have the same opinion about it. Even if we don't find a match we spend a night out meeting someone new so in that regards it is a success. I don't get ghosted often and when I do I certainly don't lose sleep over it. Again I am really sorry that the the experience you had was so bad that you spend your time degraded it every chance you get. Makes me a little sad. Anyhow I am glad you have a date this weekend and I hope it works out for you.

So FB hiking group message good a match.com message bad. Yeah this makes sense to me (insert LH eyeroll).

Isn't that the brunt of this entire issue? How people define success with OLD? I mean, as I say ALL the time on here, we are all different. So you say you and Deja have similar opinions, but that doesn't mean that someone who has a differing opinion isn't equally as right. For me, personally, I would consider it a success much more closely to what you and Deja think it is (a night out, meeting someone new). If I deemed it a success based solely on marriage well, I'd be batting .500. I met my first husband OLD too and we see how that worked...I'm HERE, so clearly it didn't go well. Now, you could look at that relationship and say yes well, but........ and justify and say it was a success ultimately, just like I could say my current marriage is a success, but I have had other OLD experiences with varying degrees of success. I say all that to say that everyone is likely going to claim success for their own various and sundry reasons and just because one person thinks success is marriage and another thinks it is just going on a fun date doesn't make either person wrong.

What I do know, for myself, is that if I were to find myself single again (Lord help us all if that happens), I would likely NOT OLD, though I have arguably succeeded at it in the past. I'm older now and I just wouldn't put up with the BS that I experienced in past attempts. In fact, I was about to give it up last time when Sparky popped up and I gave him a chance because he came across as a nice guy and I thought I'd just see what happened. Sure enough, he was a nice guy! And, I disagree that the biggest lie women tell is that they want a nice guy. That is ALL some women want and I know this for a fact because that is what I was looking for. OLD is full of guys who will TELL you they are nice guys then show you they are not. Just like I'm sure OLD is full of women who will tell you they just want to have fun when they are really trying to lock you down.

I think bttrfly made a good point about age certainly being a factor. I also truly think that looks is a factor. Overall attractive people have better luck. I had honest pics that showed me as I am (a big girl) and I never used filters or anything. I would have guys who would reach out to me under the guise of being a nice guy, only to exchange a few messages, then lambast me for being fat when they didn't like fat girls. Ummmmmmmmmmmmm.............ok, captain douche canoe, YOU MESSAGED ME. If you don't like fat girls, don't message fat girls. I'm sure there are plenty of examples you men could give of women doing similar crazy or off-putting things. Since I am not like that, I don't see it, but I'm not communicating with women on these sites either.

My point to all this rambling is that EVERYONE has different experiences because we're all different people. I wouldn't necessarily consider my overall OLD experience a success, percentage wise, but I would consider my current one a success since that is how Sparky and I met. If someone point-blank asked me for my advice concerning OLD, I would tell them both pros and cons, but I wouldn't go out of my way to discourage them from it because I think it certainly has its place, even if that place is just to serve as a lesson in how completely whacky people can really be. LOL

[DonH]

Ah so you have to get married for it to be a success.

Not at all! Dawn beat me to it but the definition of success varies from person to person but can also be debated. It’s hard to debate a happy marriage as anythung but a success which is why I used it as my example.

A happy rewarding year or two R could also easily be termed as a success. A single date? Not so much. I just look at everything with a cost versus benefit or risk versus reward bent. And as Butterfly says, age has a huge piece in this. I have no idea how OLD works for a 20 something - although I suspect it’s similar. But I really don’t know. My comments hold for the demo of this section of the boards. It might be different for younger ages. It’s the same with my thoughts on vaccines. The risk versus reward is clearly demonstrated for 60+. It’s very hard to argue. Not the case with children who rarely get sick. Their risk is higher and reward much lower than a 70 year old where any risk is well worth the benefit.

And I have no axe to grind with OLD or no regrets. I’m just trying to warn others. Simple as that. I’m way way way more upset over my life be hijacked by morons the past 2 years - time and lost experiences I can never get back - than I am with OLD. I just know I feel worse and a bit scuzzy when I tried it than I do not trying it. But I don’t even have regrets. It was a life lesson learned that I’m just trying to now pass onto others. Nothing more.