Unsure where we are going

[BL42]

I don't think you want her to stay with you because she feels trapped. In DB terms, set her free.

I completely agree with this.

The goal isn't the best possible outcome for you.

I completely disagree with this. She is lying to you and cheating on you and telling you she may want to break up your family and marriage. If it comes to a divorce it becomes a business negotiation, sometimes a contentious battle. She likely will not be looking out for your best interests, and you should do everything you can now to prep yourself for the best financial outcome you can. If she wants to divorce you and leave the country and is willing to give you all the money to do that, great. I've seen a lot of people on this forum recommend splitting off finances and protecting your assets. Could she potential empty out those accounts in Luxembourg? Start protecting yourself.

Ok pretty sh$t day today. I had an app that showed me when she and OM are online on Whatsapp. They were both online within a few minutes of each other at 3AM. Coincidence, I think not. I am sure they are still talking.

Sorry man. It [censored]. They're almost certainly still talking, and very likely still meeting up. She's in an active affair, and it's going to very hard to impossible to stop her. Act accordingly.

Tidied up the house, did the kids laundry, helped my youngest with his homework and went out with a few friends for a drink.

Getting up tomorrow for the gym. Really need to take the focus away from her, and put it on the kids and myself. Prying and snooping around is really dangerous and just messes with my head.

Great work on going out for drinks and hitting the gym. Start making both of those a regular thing. You'll start to feel better.

[Traveler]

IF you can do something strategic or tactical to strengthen your case, you should absolutely consider that into your decision on how to proceed. Are you able to arrange things in your Luxembourg savings account to your benefit? Transfer it into the Arab Gulf state? ...etc, etc

I completely disagree with this. She is lying to you and cheating on you and telling you she may want to break up your family and marriage. If it comes to a divorce it becomes a business negotiation, sometimes a contentious battle. She likely will not be looking out for your best interests, and you should do everything you can now to prep yourself for the best financial outcome you can. If she wants to divorce you and leave the country and is willing to give you all the money to do that, great

BL42, yes, we disagree with each other. What you're describing is not how I treat baristas nor handle business negotiations. It sounds like you're advocating harnessing his anger ("she is lying and cheating on you") to make sneaky transfers of funds ("Transfer it into the Arab Gulf State") to win all the money ("If she is willing to give you all the money to do that, great.") This sounds more like someone deeply betrayed, hurt, or angry might behave. To me, one's best self would not be fleeced nor fleece someone else. She's done wrong, but neither is blameless. She is due a share of whatever they accrued while married. Strength--learn his rights to avoid being fleeced--but also trustworthiness.

I don't think you want her to stay with you because she feels trapped. In DB terms, set her free.

I completely agree with this.

Yes, we agree on more things than we disagree on.

I have never said she cannot have permission, I don't believe this is even possible. She is saying that I have to come to the lawyer with her and tell him I want a divorce as well. I have said I will not do this, but she is free to proceed any way she likes. I think this is inline with what you are saying about not doing any legwork?

Yes, that's great, given the power imbalances there I wanted to clarify.

I'm still developing some boundaries, but I've thought of a drop-dead date. It will be 14th August 2022, one year after she first mentioned the affair.

Sounds like a plan.

Good job getting out for drinks. Be careful about becoming “merry maid”. Do your share but no more.

Amen.

[BL42]

BL42, yes, we disagree with each other. What you're describing is not how I treat baristas nor handle business negotiations. It sounds like you're advocating harnessing his anger ("she is lying and cheating on you") to make sneaky transfers of funds ("Transfer it into the Arab Gulf State") to win all the money ("If she is willing to give you all the money to do that, great.") This sounds more like someone deeply betrayed, hurt, or angry might behave. To me, one's best self would not be fleeced nor fleece someone else. She's done wrong, but neither is blameless. She is due a share of whatever they accrued while married. Strength--learn his rights to avoid being fleeced--but also trustworthiness.

To be fair, ScaredA's barista is not going to take half his net worth or fight for full custody of his kids. I get the cashier/barista analogy when it comes to interactions with his W, but don't think it applies to a potential divorce negotiation. I've seen sitches on hear where the WAS/WS offer away custody and people support the LBS for jumping on that. Don't think this is any different.

I don't know what his financial situation is, but what if he came into the marriage with significant assets which the UK would split 50/50 in a divorce? I was fortunate to live in an "equitable distribution" state in the US as opposed to an "equal distribution" state, so my my significant pre-martial assets were taken off the top before the split, otherwise my financial outcome would've been outrageous (in her favor). What if his W clears out the Luxembourg accounts without his knowledge/approval?

We know she is being shading with this other man. Maybe ScaredA shouldn't be shady as well, but he should understand the laws in all relevant locales, what his best options are, and plan accordingly...just in case. He's acting out of fear of losing his W and family right now, but if things continue to go south and she goes after the money and kids and his anger kicks in he may well wish he had taken precautions now.

Maybe I'm saying this raw out of my sitch - I admit I may be jaded - but it never hurts to be prepared and she's giving him plenty of warning signs.

I've said my piece and will drop it; ScaredA can make his own decisions.

I don't think you want her to stay with you because she feels trapped. In DB terms, set her free.

I completely agree with this.

Yes, we agree on more things than we disagree on.

Indeed!

[detachA]

Ok so you know she’s having an affair so no need to snoop anymore.

Agreed, you have told me many times that she will do what she is going to do. If I snoop and know about it, it just hurts me more and it is going to happen anyway.

So when you confronted and said “you’re free to do what you want just don’t treat me like an idiot”
What exactly does that mean?

I meant it all out in the open now anyway. If you are going to see him, you are free, I cannot stop you. But dont treat me like an idiot and say you are going to the "supermarket" Also at least wait until the kids have been put into bed before you go out with him. The kids are really suffering.

Good job getting out for drinks. Be careful about becoming “merry maid”. Do your share but no more.

Gym is always a great outlet.

yea been to the gym again this morning. Did curls until my biceps couldn't do any more

[detachA]

Ok some boundaries I have made over the weekend;

1) I am not going to listen to her telling me how the sexual side of the affair was. I will change the subject or directly say that I do not wish to discuss this.
2) I am not going to listen to her tell me stories about the AP, pretending these are stories from a "good friend". I now know who the AP is and it is pretty obvious when she is telling these stories as I know what he does for a job. I will change the subject or directly say that I do not wish to discuss them
3) I will not listen to her bad mouthing my parents and brother (she does this all the time). I will change the subject or directly say that I do not wish to discuss them
4) If I find out she is still sleeping with the AP or another man, I will stop financially supporting her and request a separation where she needs to move out of the house. If she will not move out, I will move her stuff out.

I know these are probably quite weak, but I'm looking for some feedback from you guys.

I've also settled on a cut off date of 14th August 2022. This will be one year after she mentioned the affair. If the marriage is not reconciled by that time, I will file for divorce and move out with the kids. Additionally, I will start looking for another job, either back home or another overseas posting.

[detachA]

Some more advice required. Every time I mention that I see some softening Im told that it needs to be consistent or that she is cake eating.

I get this, but I am just curious what you guys would count as consistent behaviour for softening/non lofty goals achieved or hints of recon?

Here is a bit of what I changes I think I am seeing at the moment:

From October 2020 to 27th August 2021

1) Minimal conversation, constantly on her phone, either facebook, instagram or watching videos. Any conversation was an argument, with no eye contact.
2) Wife spends all day in MBR with door closed
3) She has blocked my on WhatsApp, text messages and her phone number
4) Doesn't do any homework with kids
5) Doesn't do kids laundry
6) Doesn't tidy house
7) Doesn't ever sit down when the kids are eating
8) Doesn't make food for the kids
9) Leaves room as soon as I enter
10) Goes out of the house at least 3 nights a week
11) Never sits in the lounge
12) Took kids on holiday and didn't invite me (I paid). She fought for the whole time, verbally and physically, with oldest son. Blamed me as encouraging him to fight with her.
13) Constantly spoke about divorce
14) Constantly asked about renting two flats for separation
15) Constantly spoke about moving back to UK without kids and living in property we own there.

Since 27th August 2021
1) Unblocked me on Whatapp and phone 3rd September. Always answers phone if I call. Sometimes ask me questions or calls to discuss the kids
2) Now sits in living room, sometimes talks about her job. Sometimes no conversation
3) Mostly leave her bedroom door open
4) Cooks maybe 3 times a week
5) Asks me if I need stuff from the supermarket
6) Has asked to extend the rental property we currently live in for one year, rather than still asking for two flats
7) Takes my youngest son to his tutor to help improve his schoolwork
8) Occasionally helps with son's homework
9) Sits down at the table with the kids and I, when we are eating
10) Has asked can the whole family go on holiday over Christmas
11) Puts phone down or pauses video, if I ask a question. Maintains eye contact when we talk.
12) Says she can see I am working hard on myself, but doesn't believe it will last
13) No argument since 16th August. I think this is because I haven't been defensive or critical. Every time her voice starts to raise, it comes back down when I validate.


I'm not looking for a lot of comments to make me feel comfortable. I am just genuinely interested in what you feel would be positive steps and what would be some achievable goals that would give me a sense of at least some traction in any direction

[LH19]

Ok so you know she’s having an affair so no need to snoop anymore.

Agreed, you have told me many times that she will do what she is going to do. If I snoop and know about it, it just hurts me more and it is going to happen anyway.

So when you confronted and said “you’re free to do what you want just don’t treat me like an idiot”
What exactly does that mean?

I meant it all out in the open now anyway. If you are going to see him, you are free, I cannot stop you. But dont treat me like an idiot and say you are going to the "supermarket" Also at least wait until the kids have been put into bed before you go out with him. The kids are really suffering.

Good job getting out for drinks. Be careful about becoming “merry maid”. Do your share but no more.

Gym is always a great outlet.

yea been to the gym again this morning. Did curls until my biceps couldn't do any more

So if she was honest and said I going to see OM when the kids are in bed you then would be ok with it?

[LH19]

Ok some boundaries I have made over the weekend;

1) I am not going to listen to her telling me how the sexual side of the affair was. I will change the subject or directly say that I do not wish to discuss this.
2) I am not going to listen to her tell me stories about the AP, pretending these are stories from a "good friend". I now know who the AP is and it is pretty obvious when she is telling these stories as I know what he does for a job. I will change the subject or directly say that I do not wish to discuss them
3) I will not listen to her bad mouthing my parents and brother (she does this all the time). I will change the subject or directly say that I do not wish to discuss them
4) If I find out she is still sleeping with the AP or another man, I will stop financially supporting her and request a separation where she needs to move out of the house. If she will not move out, I will move her stuff out.

I know these are probably quite weak, but I'm looking for some feedback from you guys.

I've also settled on a cut off date of 14th August 2022. This will be one year after she mentioned the affair. If the marriage is not reconciled by that time, I will file for divorce and move out with the kids. Additionally, I will start looking for another job, either back home or another overseas posting.

They are weak but at least a start. Changing the subject is weak. Make it clear you are not going to listen to it. If she continues leave the room.

[LH19]

Some more advice required. Every time I mention that I see some softening Im told that it needs to be consistent or that she is cake eating.

I get this, but I am just curious what you guys would count as consistent behaviour for softening/non lofty goals achieved or hints of recon?

Here is a bit of what I changes I think I am seeing at the moment:

From October 2020 to 27th August 2021

1) Minimal conversation, constantly on her phone, either facebook, instagram or watching videos. Any conversation was an argument, with no eye contact.
2) Wife spends all day in MBR with door closed
3) She has blocked my on WhatsApp, text messages and her phone number
4) Doesn't do any homework with kids
5) Doesn't do kids laundry
6) Doesn't tidy house
7) Doesn't ever sit down when the kids are eating
8) Doesn't make food for the kids
9) Leaves room as soon as I enter
10) Goes out of the house at least 3 nights a week
11) Never sits in the lounge
12) Took kids on holiday and didn't invite me (I paid). She fought for the whole time, verbally and physically, with oldest son. Blamed me as encouraging him to fight with her.
13) Constantly spoke about divorce
14) Constantly asked about renting two flats for separation
15) Constantly spoke about moving back to UK without kids and living in property we own there.

Since 27th August 2021
1) Unblocked me on Whatapp and phone 3rd September. Always answers phone if I call. Sometimes ask me questions or calls to discuss the kids
2) Now sits in living room, sometimes talks about her job. Sometimes no conversation
3) Mostly leave her bedroom door open
4) Cooks maybe 3 times a week
5) Asks me if I need stuff from the supermarket
6) Has asked to extend the rental property we currently live in for one year, rather than still asking for two flats
7) Takes my youngest son to his tutor to help improve his schoolwork
8) Occasionally helps with son's homework
9) Sits down at the table with the kids and I, when we are eating
10) Has asked can the whole family go on holiday over Christmas
11) Puts phone down or pauses video, if I ask a question. Maintains eye contact when we talk.
12) Says she can see I am working hard on myself, but doesn't believe it will last
13) No argument since 16th August. I think this is because I haven't been defensive or critical. Every time her voice starts to raise, it comes back down when I validate.


I'm not looking for a lot of comments to make me feel comfortable. I am just genuinely interested in what you feel would be positive steps and what would be some achievable goals that would give me a sense of at least some traction in any direction

Scared known of this matters if she is having an affair. Keep making changes for yourself and the rest rest will work itself out. She’ll either end the affair and mourn the loss and come back to the marriage or she’ll continue to work towards a divorce. Unfortunately you have minimum to no control over what she’s chooses. You control you.

[Ginger1]

She’s having her cake and eating it too. Family time and then affair time. She’s got a good deal