My Confusing MLC Navy W

[sandi2]

Hi Reason, I'm trying to catch up on your thread. I may say something someone else has covered, but bear with me.

Early in the next year she's going to spend 6-8 months at sea. She claims OM will be in a completely different part of the country at a different duty station by the end of December 2020.. so if that's true, it could be a blessing?

Well, whenever a person is having an EA, it doesn't matter where they live. Being at sea hasn't stopped her M, and it won't stop her EA unless she's ended it for real. You can always hope for the best, but I'm just being very realistic with you. Even if this particular OM drops out, she's vulnerable to another EA with another guy when she's in an unhappy MR. It's not the man, it's whatever she's going through emotionally. I hope to read where she's ended the EA and gone through withdrawals before she goes back out to sea.

Are your reasons for thinking this is a MLC based on her behavior? Was there some type of trauma in her childhood that she never addressed? You might want to consider something else. The behavior of a MLCW and WW are very similar.

Speaking as a W, it feels very insecure to have a H who is out of a job for any length of time. If she is staying in the Navy just for job security, it could cause a lot of resentment in her. The wayward mindset is built on deep resentment, disrespect for the H, selfishness/self entitlement/self centeredness, & rebellion. This mindset kills attraction/desire for her H, and she loses the feeling of being in love with him. IMHO, waywardness comes from a place of anger/contempt, while a MLC comes from a past of personal pain/trauma that never healed.

Okay, on the next page of your thread, I see where you read some of my thread on LBH's with a WW, and you tend to agree.

That said. My W had a EA and PA with another service member. At least one encounter of the PA was on a ship while underway. I can bring this up with her command and dramatically impact her career if not end it. It would also result in the OM being immediately out of the picture. Is this too far though? Or is it enough to snap her out of the A Fog? She would obviously be angry with me, but would that matter in the end? I know that nobody has a crystal ball. I know that there's no guarantees. I really just wonder if rolling this out with her command along with divorce would be the right call or if it would be seen as me giving up?

Some years ago on the board, there was a group of people who believed in taking it to the toughest level. They believed in exposing the spouse's affair.......and the term "scorching the earth" described it pretty well. I was not on board with going to this extent. My reasoning behind it was that it wouldn't cause her to fall into her H's arms if he had personally brought this exposure on her life in order to end an affair. I will, however, add that I've seen a few cases over the years that might have merited such action. About the only way I would agree with it would be if the LBH had given up ever restoring the MR, b/c IMHO, this action would serve to deepen her contempt for him. Although there have been a few LBH's claim it saved their M, I really had my doubts as to the degree of affection the WW held for him. Everything regarding the acts of a LBH with a WW, has to be from the point of commanding respect. Is he getting her respect or is he just out to get rid of OM? How much vengeance is involved here? There is room for argument on both sides of this question. I understand the WW brings unhappiness and the destruction of the M on herself, and therefore, some people would say she brings this type of action from her H, as well. Most WW's rewrite their marital history, demonizing the LBH. So, it boils down to the individual H and his personal integrity of what is the right thing to do for him. You are aware of more details, such as WW & OM being on the same ship, etc. It would probably bust the physical affair, alright, but I don't know that it would bust a divorce. Am I making sense? We can talk more about it, if need be.

She has childhood trauma that I forgot to mention. The death of her mother at a young age and molestation from a close relative for a long time. I also didn't elaborate on what makes me think she's in MLC.

Ah, there it is. Was she ever in therapy for these issues?

I only mention this because, to me it gives me hope that if it's a MLC, it's something that she can overcome.

But Reason...........she can overcome waywardness, too! (((hugs))) I know this, b/c I lived it. And the thing about waywardness is that it doesn't have to last as long as MLC. I'm not trying to tell you what she is, but rather explain a WW. Could it overlap? I think it might in some cases, b/c some people's lives are so complexed.......why not? I've seen many newcomer LBH's think their W is going through MLC, when in reality, she was simply wayward. Is your W's unhappiness linked with her past, or is it linked to you and the MR? In a case of WW, the H is her direct point of resentment. He's to blame for all her unhappiness.....(according to her).

If she decided a 6 month relationship was worth breaking up her family, risking her career, etc etc from a non-MLC mindset.. That just doesn't make sense to me, but she's willing to live with me for a year and a half at least in the meantime (for our kids). I dunno.. a lot of this is still so fresh in my mind and I'm honestly thinking out loud.

If I'm understanding you correctly, you see her reacting to a MLC as something she couldn't help, whereas waywardness is a choice. Is this what you're saying? FWIW, I agree, and I think it's why LBH's struggle so much with the idea that his W is wayward. He can find no logic to her actions, so it must be something else happening to her. In both cases, they are operating from their emotions. Therefore, their logical, right thinking goes out the door, and you see somebody you no longer recognize.

My question is.. does DB-ing happen, regardless of what the underlying issues are? Does the approach change based on the situation? Everything I'm seeing says A) there's no such thing as a tried and true process and B) there are no rules.

We think of DBing as the work you currently put forth. I feel as if you are asking if DBing is the results of your actions. Good point either way. Here's the thing...... the other spouse is doing no DBing. They aren't the spouse obtaining the tools. It's the LBS that DB's. (A) It's up to the LBS to decide the specifics in the approach taken. There are no guarantees, b/c one sitch will not be everyone's sitch. On the board, you can receive more one-on-one advice in how to tweak your approach. (B) Not sure what you mean by rules. Everyone has to decide for themselves what works and doesn't work. DB is doing what works. The board's vets can advise from their expertise, but it's up to you to do it or not.

Okay, so I quickly realized I just needed to stop writing and read the rest of your thread. I'm sorry if you feel criticized. Some of us do come across rather critical sometimes, but I think it's our way of pointing to what we see needs work. FWIW, I think you've done a good job, considering everything. Please don't get down and discouraged if someone points to something specific, or doesn't see what all you've accomplished. We are here to try and help someone else who is going through this hell on earth.

I've hit a point where I am really starting to feel beat down by all of this. I've tried to be optimistic and positive, but it's so heavy. I don't even think it's about her at this point, so much as her loss of self and the destabilization of our marriage has triggered the same in me. I've been slipping down a murky hill of despair mixed with bitterness, and I can't stand it. There is profound loneliness along with a void where a sense of purpose should probably be.

I think I need to seek counseling because this has gotten worse over the last couple of days. I'm not really even thinking about her. At this point, it's about thinking about the future and the giant question mark that looms over it in basically every aspect of my life. I'm going to keep on with the GAL activities because they do help, but man.. this is so heavy.

This feeling you currently have is not that unusual. In fact, Steve85 experienced it, as well as some others. It's when the LBH is very close to becoming a WAH. He's tried hard to emotionally detach, and who knows what thoughts he has, trying to numb his feeling? I think in a case like yours, where you don't really know where you stand.......can be the most exhausting. You probably feel there are days where you are just flying by the seat of your pants, right? I couldn't blame you. I think this emotion you currently feel is temporary. You two have been through a lot of turmoil, so don't trust how you feel too much at this time. We encourage individual counseling. Bear in mind, there are counselors out there that aren't pro-marriage.....and there are some who aren't worth a dime. However, there are also some who are very instrumental in getting your thoughts and feelings sorted out.

I want to say a few things on behalf of your W. She appears to be trying a lot harder than I did....(if her actions indicate her trying to salvage the MR). I went through terrible withdrawal symptoms that hung on for months. My physical and emotional health was suffering a lot. I had no hope, no feelings of love, no desire to do anything, and was terribly depressed about everything. I had made a decision to do the right thing and give up the EA and stay in my M. I decided to treat my H with respect. I prayed a lot!!! I had joined the board, and was here every night until I couldn't keep my eyes opened. Still........it took nearly two years before I truly felt remorse for what I had done. I was horrified when my kids found out. I was so embarrassed I couldn't look at them. But when it came to my H, the resentment had not turned to remorse. That took a long time. I even prayed that God would help me feel remorse, b/c I always knew what I did was wrong in the sight of God. One night while I was alone in bed and praying, the remorse came. My H was still setting up watching tv. I went to him, and I was so torn up he couldn't understand what I was saying. But he knew where it was coming. After that night, the resentment was gone and my feelings of respect followed my actions of respect. My feelings of love/desire for my H began to return.

I see signs in your W that appear as if she's experiencing withdrawal. The up & down emotion is to be expected. I think her case differs from mine, in the fact she hasn't made an official decision about the M. It's still up in the air, for both of you. The reason I told you about my experience is to say that she can choose to do the right thing, and then work toward the goals. As long as she waits for a certain feeling to direct her........she's going to stay confused. If she knows what is "right", then she should start behaving in the right way with the right attitude and speech. Those three things need to line up together. Trust me, it's not easy for her. This is a process for her, and both of you need to realize it. It's not something she snaps out of suddenly. She may have her eyes open and may even feel some guilt, but for the most part, she has to work through all of it. It was almost a two year process for me, and I was getting daily help, so I can only imagine what it's like for her. Last but not least, she has to learn to live with herself. Forgiving herself is hard.

Don't give up, Reason. Please stick with us, posting as often as possible.