Originally Posted by Jhopeful
I used sex as a way of seeing if she was truly back in again.


If you've gotten to the point of BD, then she's not coming back for a long time. I think this is the one concept that LBS struggle the most with- time. There are no quick fixes, the sooner you realize that then the smoother this will go.

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I used the word "child support" for the first time in a Venmo message. I only wanted to communicate by email for a fw days. When I realized how I was feeling I owned it all and apologized.


Pull back and be quiet. LBSs are masters of saying all the wrong things and novices at shutting up. Be the opposite.

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She just told me things are final. She is moving on. I feel she's done.


She thinks she's done right now. She will probably think that for months. After that, who knows? You'd be amazed at the turnarounds that have happened against seemingly impossible odds.

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I want to ask - is there hope I can do anything and I'm also afraid of someone saying NO.


There's always hope. Again, don't worry about what she says now. It's only a reflection of her current feelings, and they may very well change.

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How do I move forward from today?


Read DR. Read all the links Cadet posted. Then read it all again. Read other sitches. Post more. Your first post doesn't make a lot of sense. Collect your thoughts and post in more detail.

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I wrote her this email and would love anyone's thoughts on it or anything else.


Well everyone else already told you not to send it. They are absolutely correct. WAS's feel like they're under a lot of pressure. A letter and/ or relationship talks are even more pressure. You want to remove all pressure.

Don't take the following personally. This is the beginning of your education into how WAS's read and perceive things, I am showing you how she is going to interpret your comments in her current WAS mindset:

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I want to repeat and share once again that I see your hurt.


Talk is cheap. She won't believe anything you say/ write. You've got to show her change through ACTIONS. And even then she will think they are "tricks" to get her back. So she needs to see consistent change over a long period of time.

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You spoke about your #1 value. I've known that, we had so much and what you were bringing and how you were shaping our time was enough for me - apple orchards, family walks, family breakfasts. I shared a lot this morning about my view on it, and I want you to know, it is ever so apparent how important it is to you and how much I am aligned and wanting it as well.  


She's done with the R, the LAST thing you want to do is bring up old romantic stuff or drag out a photo album to show her how happy she was and how she should want all that back. IT WILL ONLY DRIVE HER FARTHER AWAY. Right now she's rewriting history, all of those warm fuzzy memories you have she will NOT have. If you say something like "but you were so happy then" she'll say she was faking it. And she really believes her rewritten history. So don't even go there.

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I imagine you may have felt abandoned and the pattern was repeating.


Read everything you can on listening and validation skills. Don't ever tell someone what they feel! Ever! You can ask someone what they feel or felt, but if you tell them what YOU think they felt then they'll just think "he never listens and he always just makes assumptions."

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Internally I was dealing with my own process and the failure to meet my exam deadline, a broken computer which I drove around all day on Sunday trying to buy a new one and repairing what looked like a failing deal with my new job.


Don't try to make conversations about you. She won't care. It just sounds like lame excuses to her.

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I see where I could have just brought this all up in a more vulnerable way


Do you seriously think this is appropriate for a letter????? I mean how ironic that you are talking about how you could have handled this in a better "more vulnerable" way, and you're delivering that message in the cold, uncaring format of an email, perhaps the least vulnerable possible communication format. Right? Vulnerable would be opening up in person. The time for that has passed though, so table it for now.

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i was stuck, I wanted you to secretly come over and surprise me. You deserved a man that night.


After you read DR, read No More Mister Nice Guy. What you describe here is a "covert contract" and they are extremely harmful for relationships. You need to learn about them and the harm they cause so you can be mindful of not allowing it to happen in the future.

Anyway you get the point. That email is saying all the wrong things at the worst possible time. If you feel the need to write things like this then by all means do so and post them here. But do not send them to your W. There may have been a time when a letter like this would have welcomed by her and mattered to her. That time is past. Now she will find fault in everything you say.


Me: 60 w/ S18, D24, D27

M: 21 years; BD: 06-14-12; S: 09-10-12; D final: 03-17-14; XW:57