[sandi2]

Do you think you could be reconciling/piecing and YOU not realize it? I read Steve's response, and if I'm understanding what he's saying, I agree, at least to a point.......especially when a couple is living together and still shares the same bed. I can understand it in that type situation. In my sitch, we didn't start cuddling and slowly build up to discover ourselves in piecing. There was a decision made, first! I would either continue contacting OM and leave my H, or end all contact with OM and commit to working on the M. I couldn't have it both ways. There wasn't going to be any cuddles or kisses until that critical decision was made, and made quickly. (Not that I wanted his kisses, but you get what I'm saying.) He wasn't going to court me while I tried to decide between the two men. So, that was done. We didn't jump back into bed the next night, after I had decided to do the right thing, but we eventually got there. Here's the thing, although we still lived together, my H & I had not been sleeping together for several years, so you might say it was an event when we starting sharing the same room. I think not sharing the same bed for a long time, and having old wounds from a SSM, makes it more difficult when you've been married a long time. It was awkward, and uncomfortable, b/c that level of intimacy can bring all those old raw emotions right into the bed with you. It's part of the "work" we had to do. It's not that way for every couple, but it was for us.

For the most part, I tend to think you would be aware if reconciliation was taking place. It's up to the couple as to the words that said, conditions made, etc. I think a lot of it depends upon what has taken place that led them to the brink of D (i.e. affair, abuse, prison, addiction, etc.). There are couples, however, who continue to live in limbo for most of their M lives, b/c nothing is ever resolved. Sometimes, things get a little better, and sometimes it gets a little worse..........but it's still limbo, b/c one of them refuses to work on the MR, and at the same time, they won't leave. Even MWD says there has to be cooperation from the other spouse! IMHO, reconciliation comes first, and then you work to piece your MR back together. If that sounds confusing, you are welcome to read this thread about it. It's under my name, but a LBW by the name of Blu helped, and we wrote from the viewpoint of the WW and the LBW. Definition and Guidelines for Piecing
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2832573#Post2832573


You aren't accidentally falling into piecing your M. If anything, YOU are on the verge of becoming a WAH. Maybe this is what it took for you to drop the rope you have wrapped around her so tightly. It would have been so much better if you had simply detached from the drama, stopped having R discussions, etc. I don't think a spouse can detach when he is keeping a running record of how many days it's been seen they had sex, the last kiss, last argument, last R talk, the BD, or whatever. This method, IMHO, keeps it fresh in your mind, and therefore, it keeps the pain and resentment very fresh. So, now you are so mentally & emotionally exhausted until it's breaking you down.......to the point you will be ready to get out of the M, just to get some type of stress relief. I don't know how successful that works in getting relief, but you can ask some of these other guys who have been there.

Reflecting back to when your W had an EA, how was that resolved between the two of you? I mean, was she remorseful? Did she genuinely apologize for the pain she caused you (and whatever else was involved......lies, deceit, betrayal, etc.)? Did she take responsibility for the A? Was it after the EA that she no longer wanted to work on the MR, or did it actually start before the EA? Perhaps you didn't have a problem forgiving her, since it wasn't an PA, IDK. However, I suggest there was never true healing for the MR after the EA, and that's why the MR continued to deteriorate. I suspect your W was "numb" quite sometime before the EA happened. I also suspect that her sexual desire was not fully restored. I can relate to so much of your story.

I don't know how many children your W wanted to have in addition to the two, before she had to have a hysterectomy. I don't know how young she was when she had the operation. It does affect some women to know they can no longer birth a child. There are some physical side effects, with the loss of estrogen, unbalanced hormones, etc. These issues can lead to low sex drive (or no sex desire at all). The good news is modern medicine can usually make a big difference. I had a SSM for years. I had an Internet A, which had temporarily jump-started my sex drive, but when the A ended......so did my sex drive. I won't get into all of it, but just to say that I felt dead on the inside a long time before the A, and it was the excitement and ego food in the A that jump-started my sex drive. However, it was very short lived. It was sometime later that I was referred to a hormone balancing specialist. The doctor said my sex hormones had "flat-lined", along with other health issues I was having at the time. He said he didn't know how I was able to roll out of bed everyday. So, it was bad. And then, it got real good! By that, I mean I took HRT, and knew what it was like to have a healthy sex drive. There is help out there!

So, back to your sitch. You have been under a strain for quite a while, and it's taking a toll. Maybe you can't help the way you are, but it seems to me that you've caused part of that strain on yourself. I don't know a lot of the backstory, but if you're like most newcomer LBH's, you go nuts at the thought of no action. You want a list of the next steps, nonstop. Wish we could oblige, but it doesn't work that way. I will tell you this much, it's all about your attitude. You can look at this shutdown as a blessing, or a curse. You can throw away that journal, or whatever it is, where you keep track of every little move by your W, and where you grade it as positive or negative. It's not a positive force in your life, and you're losing you mind! How can you stop focusing on her when you are constantly grading her every action? You don't understand detaching b/c the thought scares you to death. You are co-dependent on a woman who doesn't want you, and it make you unattractive in her view. So, you are your worst enemy!

You want to know the next step? Get your eyes off the one who doesn't want you, stop pursuing & pressuring her, and get your male confidence. You are responsible for your own happiness. You've read somewhere close to two dozen books, have a coach, and IC and I don't how many MC's.......and you are just as miserable today as you were in the beginning of the sitch. Sometimes, you can have too many sources of advice. Know what I mean? The Pastor, friends, counselors, books............and you just get more confused. So, why don't you give a few of these sources a rest, at least where the MR is concerned? Focus on what makes you feel good about yourself. I'm not saying to be completely selfish, but you don't have to have a spouse in order to become a better version of yourself. If you want to read self help books to work on yourself as a man.......that's fine. (I just wonder if you are the type of reader who will skip parts of the book, b/c you think it doesn't apply.) Anyway, let your W figure out what she wants, rather than you trying to convince her. I'm not telling you to be a jerk toward her, just stop trying to manipulate her decisions.

I maintain that when a woman threatens divorce, but does nothing about it, it's b/c she benefits from being legally married to her H. Your W is a SAHM. That's a pretty big benefit in itself. When she gets a FT job to support herself, then she might actually move forward with a D.........unless, of course, she expects you to financially support her to stay home, although the kids are in school. Guess that's another subject for another time.

((hugs))