Quick recap-- H had a 2 year long distance PA. Two daughters, aged 8 and 10. I found out full extent at the end of December, we went through six weeks of DC and incredible ambivalence where H wanted both AP as a lover and me as best friend/co-parent. He decided to end the A in mid-February though his decision was based more on the kids, inability to continue the current situation for all of us, and AP's desire to have children (she's 11 years younger than me and H firmly does not want more children) rather than a desire for me as a wife.
Over the past four months, things seemed to be going well. He was turning towards me more, being a great H in all ways except the romance wasn't there, though he did start to make some gestures towards it. We were in MC at first but once COVID hit, we stopped and H wanted to not talk about the A or our R given the stresses of the quarantine. I said OK and bounced around between being OK with it and having angst about not dealing with all the issues, including the fact that he hadn't ever given full transparency on the A and answered the questions that I had.
Two weeks ago, he agreed to have the talk and we went through everything, including how they had communicated, etc. He talked about her in the past tense, told me he had been thinking it wouldn't have worked out anyway, he thought about her less and less. The passion and angst he had around his feelings from her had faded considerably in the way he talked about her and their R. He also had had this buried but really deep anger towards me for the SSM we'd had for a long time (due to my lack of desire) that surfaced every time we started talking about why the A had happened... he finally started to move off of that space and talk about why he did what he did, trying to understand the immensity and gravity of what it all meant, hurting me, potentially the kids, etc. We started having some mini-R talks here and there about all of this.
It turns out that a couple of weeks before our talk, AP had sent him a message saying she was moving on, no turning back. He waited on responding for a few days and then responded he understood. (I had believed there was zero contact between them this whole time, but in fact there were a few texts and birthday calls here and there. He said that while I had asked for NC, he didn't think it was fair and so didn't adhere to it fully, but that they've barely communicated in that time frame and he considered their R over.)
Then, five days after our talk, he reached out to AP to make sure she was "OK" with the protests where she lived. She responded saying she'd had some major trauma, he called her, and it all took off from there. She told him she'd slept with someone, he panicked, and rewound to January where he's again totally in love with her, can't imagine happiness without her, also still wants me as his best friend, etc. His whole fantasy D scene has resurfaced. The difference now being that he has "tried" for the past four months to let her go, he can't, and also she's told him she doesn't want children any more if it means not being with him. (This is just so gross to me on so many levels, for both of them. But whatevs, none of my beeswax.)
We've talked a lot since that revelation. I've told him to go, asked him to go, he is refusing to leave. He can't decide what he wants. He knows he has to make a choice. He feels like if he doesn't choose her, that chance will be gone forever as she will move on. (I think he didn't fully do this the last time, thought she might still be there if things didn't work out with me.) I have told him to go if that is what he wants, but that he can't expect to be my friend. He doesn't get both. He is almost manic, a total mess, crying, depressed, bouncing back and forth. He doesn't want to hurt anyone, he can't see a path where anyone isn't badly hurt, no matter what path he chooses he'll be worse off.
He asked for six months to try out an R with her while living in the basement, and that at the end of that if he chooses me I'll know he is choosing ME rather than staying out of guilt/duty/kids. I said go for it, but I won't be here when you get back. Sorry. No hall passes, no coming back. Once he walks, that is my bright line and we are done. (I'm thinking I'm done regardless but need to sit with this a bit more.) He doesn't believe me, he thinks I will be friends with him for the sake of the girls in the end. All a totally familiar re-run.
Last night he came to me and asked for three things: one, that we make a decision as partners in this; two, that we both prioritize the children's well-being and preserve as much of the important parts of the family structure for them as possible; and three, for me to fully acknowledge the depth of his feelings for AP (he thinks I don't take them seriously, I think it is a fling, a fantasy, etc.) He feels if we can set these as the guidelines and work together envisioning all possible options, we can come to something together-- anything on the spectrum from M2.0 to he leaves for AP altogether. Just like last time, making a decision together is somehow really important to him.
I told him I was committed on the child front in principle though not committing to any particular structure (I wouldn't keep the kids from him); I wasn't sure if I could commit to the partnership piece, and I also didn't think I wanted to hear or learn anything more about how much he loves AP. That is hurtful and cruel to ask of me and I don't understand why this is so GD important to him, especially if we end up (as I think we will) apart. It is weird and wrong. He said he doesn't need to tell me any more details or information and can't fully define what "acknowledge" means, but he wants me to understand and believe how difficult and shattering it will be for him to lose her and the possibility of a future with her. (I know some of you guys are throwing things at him right now. Is this weird or what???) I told him what I need now is some space to really think about myself and what I need to protect myself and heal going forward, and I would let him know when I have something to share. This morning he came into the bedroom and laid on the bed next to me and cried.
So here we are! Woo-hoo! I want to say to all of you posting here for me how grateful and supported I feel right now. I feel love and compassion flowing to me and I can't tell you how much it means to me right now.
Here are my thoughts, in no particular order (sorry for the length of this post, guys, just trying to get it all out there for myself as much as anything):
-- in reflecting back on the last few weeks, I wonder if I hadn't pushed that transparency R talk if this would have happened. Whether it got him thinking about her again (combined with her reaching out), or the beginnings of discussions where he started to take responsibility for his own actions, rather than blaming it all on me and the SSM, setting conditions that essentially made the A inevitable-- I don't know. Probably it isn't worth worrying about, since I can't go back in time. And truthfully, I had my own issues around the A that needed to be addressed to start healing. Ironically, the conversation did help ME a lot, but maybe pushed my H in the wrong direction. Newbies, keep DBing even when you think you are getting to a safety zone.
-- I am thinking about asking (not telling) him to move out completely for a period of time if he wants space to pursue his R with AP. That moving to the basement won't really give him the full experience of what it will be like in an R with AP and D from me, and if that is the path he chooses, it is smarter to rip off the bandaid and really experience it rather than half-a$$ it in the basement, still having dinner at home etc. (He insists he would need access to the kitchen and would want to spend time with the kids whenever he could, saying it would be cruel of me to make him sit down here while he could be upstairs with the family. I could hold my nose and ignore him but it is wrong to deprive the kids of time with H or with both of us.) I think there is a possibility he would go for this if I positioned it like making sure he had the space he needed to work on his R with AP.
-- I need to think through some career stuff I had been working on. H is a consultant and we had been working on a plan all spring for me to leave my job, or go halftime, and start up my own consulting practice. I can only do this because of access to health care through H and the cushion of his salary and our savings gives me the opportunity to build up slowly. Now, I don't know that i can do this anymore. He doesn't want to actually D if we S, is fine with staying M on the books forever or as long as it is beneficial for me financially. He also said he is committed to me financially and wants me to go ahead with my plans, said the financial support doesn't change on his end. I told him I wasn't sure I would be able to do or accept that. I am angry at the potential loss of this new venture, which I was really excited about for myself, but probably isn't the smartest thing to do if I am on my own financially. I also am worried about how we afford a second place (we can't) and so if H wants to go off and do his own thing, I don't want to be supporting that from a shared financial perspective. As of now, his idea is that I would live in the house, have the kids living here full time, and he would get time with them every day, whether he lives in the basement or eventually somewhere else.
-- I don't know how I will feel if he says he wants to break it off with AP again. I am back to where I was in January-- I feel I can't really trust him, I know he isn't the person I need in an H right now. Maybe at some point he will be, but to me that is moot as I don't see taking him back after it becomes publicly known that he had an A, nor once we have to tell the kids we are breaking up. (<-- THAT is the thing I will never forgive him for-- breaking the girls' trust in love.) I might go through an exercise of what I would need in order to move forward with him, but not sure it is worthwhile at this point and just has my head somewhere it doesn't really need to be. I did tell him that 100% honesty and transparency is an absolute must no matter what. He can't go along with something because I say it is necessary but not really agree, and then decide on his own to skirt around here and there (like he called her on her birthday to say HBD, he felt it was NBD, he didn't feel anything from it, and it helped him in his healing so why hurt me by telling me about it? Whereas... I don't think I need to explain it to you guys. On a side note, this just infuriates me more that he is now saying his love for her never abated, yet in the next breath that he talked to her twice over the past four months, plus a few texts, and it was all fine and dandy to not be with her until this last conversation where it was "different".
-- I've put my kids first in this the whole time. I have swallowed so much pride and power in the slim chance that we can make this work without hurting them. (I think I am pretty clear-eyed on this one-- they are not in a bad place because of what is happening in our R at this moment.) I want to start thinking about myself now, and what I need/want in a R in the future. Yet, yet, yet. I think I've said this before, but the idea of doing this to the kids is the most gut-wrenching thing. It makes me physically ill. I talked to my one friend yesterday, who was amazing, and also said she thinks it is time for me to start putting the focus on me, but she knows the girls will be OK no matter what, and that was the one thing that broke me.
I'll respond individually later where it makes sense, but please know how much I appreciate and need all this support right now. It is hard to have gone from starting to hope--feeling like i was finally seeing real progress-- to this in the space of a few days.
Me (46) H (42) M:14 T:18, D9 & D11 4/19 - 12/19: series of escalating BDs 9/20 - present: R and piecing
I want to say to all of you posting here for me how grateful and supported I feel right now. I feel love and compassion flowing to me and I can't tell you how much it means to me right now.