me: 46 h: 49 m: 24 T: 27 DD1:20 DD2:17 DS:12 BD1: PA for 2 yrs 08/2016 BD2: OW is one of my closest friends 12/2016 BD3: H wants a D 11/2019 Now: He is in the same house, but has filed for divorce.
He told him on our last session in a kind way that he was placing too much responsibility for his own happiness on our marriage. He also worked with him to help him understand that so much of this is from his childhood. His parents showed no emotions and no comfort. They had a terrible marriage. And so my H has a hard time with emotions. He tends to withdraw completely. And has blamed this on me and the marriage. We had a good session, my H just still feels like divorce is the best option. He feels like we don't do a good job of taking care of each other while married, so we can be there for each other and be close and great friends divorced.
I am reading this as, "I want everything I love about this relationship and be able to date other people also." I think he is trying to figure out a way to "have it all." I have told him that does not work for me. If we divorce I dont want to hang out with him. He got angry and said fine if you feel like you need to do that and punish. I told him not to minimize my experience. While it would be easy for him to walk away, he needs to respect the fact that for me it would be a death, and something to grieve and heal from. Before I would have tried to do it his way to please him.
He does this thing where he hugs me and spends time with me. Then the next day avoids me. I feel this underlying anger at the way he is treating me and his emotional neglect.
I am getting to the point where I am going to tell him i do not want a divorce, but I do not want to be a roommate. I want to tell him he can choose to be my husband or move on with his life. I am getting weary of this situation.
OG, it pains me so much to read this. You are still so much in limbo and I know how much that s*cks. Your H seems to be in the same place as mine - sat on the fence and not able to decide which way to jump. My H is still saying he loves me and finds it hard to imagine a life without me, but something is missing. That missing piece is on the other side of the fence. So he wants a bit from each side but knows he cant so just stays paralysed on the fence, unable to make a decision. H moved out to try and clear his head and work out which side he wanted to jump. He still cant decide, and last week after the debacle of telling me he wanted to come back home only to back track a few days later, I finally spelled it out to him that he cannot have it all. That whatever side of the fence he chooses he will lose something he wants. And he just kept saying "you're right".
But the thing is, you cant hurry them to make a decision, you cant hurry him to recomit to the marriage if he's not there yet. But you could probably hurry him into leaving - you just need to be really sure that is what is best for you. Sending you hugs - I know how awful and painful this is xx
M:49 H:49 T:20 M:18 D:16 D:14
EA: Feb 2019-May 2020 Separated: Mar-early Aug 2020 H asked to reconcile: Jun 2020 EA relapse: Oct/Nov 2020 Recon #2: since Nov 2020
I just want to defend myself. I just want to argue my point of view. When he says something about me, especially when it's a complaint or criticism, I just feel like validating it is accepting it. And I have this need to "illuminate" where he is wrong.
That sounds like right-fighting. Would you rather be happy or right? Rarely do the two go together.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
He told him on our last session in a kind way that he was placing too much responsibility for his own happiness on our marriage. He also worked with him to help him understand that so much of this is from his childhood. His parents showed no emotions and no comfort. They had a terrible marriage. And so my H has a hard time with emotions. He tends to withdraw completely. And has blamed this on me and the marriage. We had a good session, my H just still feels like divorce is the best option. He feels like we don't do a good job of taking care of each other while married, so we can be there for each other and be close and great friends divorced.
I am reading this as, "I want everything I love about this relationship and be able to date other people also." I think he is trying to figure out a way to "have it all." I have told him that does not work for me. If we divorce I dont want to hang out with him. He got angry and said fine if you feel like you need to do that and punish. I told him not to minimize my experience. While it would be easy for him to walk away, he needs to respect the fact that for me it would be a death, and something to grieve and heal from. Before I would have tried to do it his way to please him.
He does this thing where he hugs me and spends time with me. Then the next day avoids me. I feel this underlying anger at the way he is treating me and his emotional neglect.
I am getting to the point where I am going to tell him i do not want a divorce, but I do not want to be a roommate. I want to tell him he can choose to be my husband or move on with his life. I am getting weary of this situation.
OG, it pains me so much to read this. You are still so much in limbo and I know how much that s*cks. Your H seems to be in the same place as mine - sat on the fence and not able to decide which way to jump. My H is still saying he loves me and finds it hard to imagine a life without me, but something is missing. That missing piece is on the other side of the fence. So he wants a bit from each side but knows he cant so just stays paralysed on the fence, unable to make a decision. H moved out to try and clear his head and work out which side he wanted to jump. He still cant decide, and last week after the debacle of telling me he wanted to come back home only to back track a few days later, I finally spelled it out to him that he cannot have it all. That whatever side of the fence he chooses he will lose something he wants. And he just kept saying "you're right".
But the thing is, you cant hurry them to make a decision, you cant hurry him to recomit to the marriage if he's not there yet. But you could probably hurry him into leaving - you just need to be really sure that is what is best for you. Sending you hugs - I know how awful and painful this is xx
Lots of good points. It really is crazy-making. How long can we deal with the ripple effects of their cake-eating fence-sitting? I guess that's what I am trying to figure out. I am determined like never before to focus on myself and honoring myself.
When I feel that pain of rejection, etc, I remind myself that that is dependency. What am i dependent on him for? Happiness? The source of my happiness has to be me. Or else I am not much different from him.
My word I have been using lately in my head is "transformation." I am transforming myself.
me: 46 h: 49 m: 24 T: 27 DD1:20 DD2:17 DS:12 BD1: PA for 2 yrs 08/2016 BD2: OW is one of my closest friends 12/2016 BD3: H wants a D 11/2019 Now: He is in the same house, but has filed for divorce.
I just want to defend myself. I just want to argue my point of view. When he says something about me, especially when it's a complaint or criticism, I just feel like validating it is accepting it. And I have this need to "illuminate" where he is wrong.
That sounds like right-fighting. Would you rather be happy or right? Rarely do the two go together.
I understand what you are saying. I don't disagree. I just get confused sometimes. Can I be happy if he is blaming me all the time for his problems instead of taking accountability? That's what I've got to remember validation is not agreement. It doesn't mean I am agreeing with his point of view. This is something I am working on.
me: 46 h: 49 m: 24 T: 27 DD1:20 DD2:17 DS:12 BD1: PA for 2 yrs 08/2016 BD2: OW is one of my closest friends 12/2016 BD3: H wants a D 11/2019 Now: He is in the same house, but has filed for divorce.
Here's what I think might be helpful... you don't need to defend yourself to him because who cares what he thinks? Not you. So what that he's made up this narrative, or blames his own shortcomings or indecision or whatever on you? Let it roll off your back. You know it isn't true and that is what matters. You are giving him power by caring what he thinks. Getting defensive just plays into his game.
Know your truth and don't let his nonsense push you off kilter. I'd avoid R talks but if he brings it up just listen. There are some good threads around here about validation with helpful phrases you can have ready to go, like "Wow, thanks for sharing that, I'll have to think about that" and "That must be difficult for you" etc etc. In your mind you can be rolling your eyeballs like crazy but externally you're like whatever. You aren't worth the energy to argue with.
My H also imagined we would get Ded and remain best friends. That was absolutely not going to happen and by the end I didn't argue with him about it. I was just steadfast, like nope. Not gonna happen. Period, end of story. He would throw these temper tantrums like "I must not really love him" because if I did I would want him to be happy/want to stay friends, I didn't care as much as I said I did about the kids because it would be better for the kids if we still had dinner together every night, there was something wrong with me that I could throw away his friendship like that after everything we've been through just because he (whoops!) fell in love with someone else (mmm hmmm. that was something he really said.). I just stuck to my guns and repeated over and over... I will not work on our R with a third party in the picture. I will not be friends with you if you leave. And if he saw her again without ending it we would be over.
I totally agree with Pommy-- you can't hurry his timeline. You can't make him be ready to recommit. You can probably hurry him out the door if that is your choice. You can't control anything except yourself. I think if you can focus on you, less on him, work on not letting his BS affect you, and cultivate patience like mad, you'll come to a place where either you're ready to move him along or you'll find he's gotten to a place where he can make his own decision. And either way you will be fine.
Hey, I do have a question for you that has been on my mind for some time-- what happened between when he ended his A and now? It's been a couple of years, right? Did you guys work through stuff, were things better for awhile and then got worse again?
Hang in there.
Me (46) H (42) M:14 T:18, D9 & D11 4/19 - 12/19: series of escalating BDs 9/20 - present: R and piecing
Here's what I think might be helpful... you don't need to defend yourself to him because who cares what he thinks? Not you. So what that he's made up this narrative, or blames his own shortcomings or indecision or whatever on you? Let it roll off your back. You know it isn't true and that is what matters. You are giving him power by caring what he thinks. Getting defensive just plays into his game.
Know your truth and don't let his nonsense push you off kilter. I'd avoid R talks but if he brings it up just listen. There are some good threads around here about validation with helpful phrases you can have ready to go, like "Wow, thanks for sharing that, I'll have to think about that" and "That must be difficult for you" etc etc. In your mind you can be rolling your eyeballs like crazy but externally you're like whatever. You aren't worth the energy to argue with.
My H also imagined we would get Ded and remain best friends. That was absolutely not going to happen and by the end I didn't argue with him about it. I was just steadfast, like nope. Not gonna happen. Period, end of story. He would throw these temper tantrums like "I must not really love him" because if I did I would want him to be happy/want to stay friends, I didn't care as much as I said I did about the kids because it would be better for the kids if we still had dinner together every night, there was something wrong with me that I could throw away his friendship like that after everything we've been through just because he (whoops!) fell in love with someone else (mmm hmmm. that was something he really said.). I just stuck to my guns and repeated over and over... I will not work on our R with a third party in the picture. I will not be friends with you if you leave. And if he saw her again without ending it we would be over.
I totally agree with Pommy-- you can't hurry his timeline. You can't make him be ready to recommit. You can probably hurry him out the door if that is your choice. You can't control anything except yourself. I think if you can focus on you, less on him, work on not letting his BS affect you, and cultivate patience like mad, you'll come to a place where either you're ready to move him along or you'll find he's gotten to a place where he can make his own decision. And either way you will be fine.
Hey, I do have a question for you that has been on my mind for some time-- what happened between when he ended his A and now? It's been a couple of years, right? Did you guys work through stuff, were things better for awhile and then got worse again?
Hang in there.
These are all really valuable insights that I needed to hear. I have been trying to get a life, but too often what I think he would want to see in the past. I am really focusing more on what it means to me. Just little shifts like this.
As far as the past...yes, it's been about 3 years. We sort of tried to work through things. It was hard because he refused to tell me who it was the first six months and after that would not stop working with her. I really don't care about her anymore and don't compare myself to her. Although, I get sad that real life cant compare with fantasy affair life.
Anyway, in the beginning I made all the mistakes. I had no help, I didn't know anything about this resource. I only found this board about two months ago. So it's frustrating, but it is what it is.
He feels like he tried hard before. He was frustrated because I didn't heal fast enough. I am a reminder of a time he doesn't want to remember.
I'm having a hard time now because i am so tired. During his two year affair he wasn't nice and she could do no wrong. And then these past few years... i have put up with being devalued for so long. Really, I've allowed it. Part of me wants him to hit the road. The other part of me that can't stand the thought of my family being split up, that values family, and also believes we could be happy doesn't know what to do.
I don't want to be Plan B. I don't want him in my life if he leaves.
I do think things were better for awhile but not fast enough or blissful enough. And of course not having this resource I pursued a lot.
me: 46 h: 49 m: 24 T: 27 DD1:20 DD2:17 DS:12 BD1: PA for 2 yrs 08/2016 BD2: OW is one of my closest friends 12/2016 BD3: H wants a D 11/2019 Now: He is in the same house, but has filed for divorce.
Anyway, in the beginning I made all the mistakes. I had no help, I didn't know anything about this resource. I only found this board about two months ago. So it's frustrating, but it is what it is.
It's never too late to stop making those mistakes. Here you are, I'm sure you will get better at it.
Originally Posted by Oceangl
He feels like he tried hard before. He was frustrated because I didn't heal fast enough. I am a reminder of a time he doesn't want to remember.
ugh. He was frustrated that you didn't heal fast enough?!?! What did he expect??
Originally Posted by Oceangl
I'm having a hard time now because i am so tired. During his two year affair he wasn't nice and she could do no wrong. And then these past few years... i have put up with being devalued for so long. Really, I've allowed it. Part of me wants him to hit the road. The other part of me that can't stand the thought of my family being split up, that values family, and also believes we could be happy doesn't know what to do.
I honestly feel your pain. But here is a Q for you - do you value yourself? How do you view yourself through all of this? Does he really deserve you?
I honestly feel your pain. But here is a Q for you - do you value yourself? How do you view yourself through all of this? Does he really deserve you?
This is the question for me. No, I have not valued myself. I have let him set the tone, and been dependent on how he feels about me to calculate my worth. This is the biggest thing I am working on right now.
Sometimes I feel like I am too late on everything. Too many mistakes. But I also believe in God and try to remind myself that is the opposite of spiritual messages I've been given.
I'm trying to learn not to beat myself up.
That is a new question for me. Does he deserve me? It's like a completely new perspective. I read people's posts about being someone they are crazy to leave. And that's what I want to work on. For me.
me: 46 h: 49 m: 24 T: 27 DD1:20 DD2:17 DS:12 BD1: PA for 2 yrs 08/2016 BD2: OW is one of my closest friends 12/2016 BD3: H wants a D 11/2019 Now: He is in the same house, but has filed for divorce.
I just want to defend myself. I just want to argue my point of view. When he says something about me, especially when it's a complaint or criticism, I just feel like validating it is accepting it. And I have this need to "illuminate" where he is wrong.
That sounds like right-fighting. Would you rather be happy or right? Rarely do the two go together.
I understand what you are saying. I don't disagree. I just get confused sometimes. Can I be happy if he is blaming me all the time for his problems instead of taking accountability? That's what I've got to remember validation is not agreement. It doesn't mean I am agreeing with his point of view. This is something I am working on.
Here is where you may need to check yourself. Because a lot of us LBSs are willing to take any attention we can get from our WAS, even negative. It is a vicious cycle:
1. The LBS finally decides to work on giving time and space, and backs off. 2. The WAS feels something has changed, and is out of their control, and wants to find out what is going on, so they start a MR discussion. 3. The discussion ends up being the WAS giving their litany of reasons why they are leaving, again. 4. The LBS is thrilled that the WAS is taking an action, even thought they've heard it all before. 5. The LBS engages with the WAS too much, instead of just listening and validating, which reassures the WAS that the LBS is still attached, and in their control. 6. After the discussion the LBS starts feeling bad about themselves again because the WAS made it clear that they still intend to leave. The LBS is upset that the same complaints were voiced again. The LBS also feels guilty for not applying DB principles and vows to do better. 7. Go back up to #1.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018