Doing my thing & keeping a smile

[wooba]

This means he won’t have the opportunity to monster at you, or take anything you say the wrong way. No contact can be healing. Of course you’ll have some contact about childcare arrangements, but I bet you’ll feel more peaceful.

I do feel that I need to go NC to heal. I was a mess after our last talk about finances. As much as I've detached, at the moment all the emotions came crashing. So I'm debating whether to hand it entirely over to a L or just communicate with H via e-mail regarding money from this point forward.

He doesn’t seem to be able to cope with marital /parental responsibilities but is not craving any “new life”? It’s just enough for him to remove himself from the home and return when he feels he can cope? Is he having IC?

Nope, H refuses to my suggestions to IC (this is months ago when I still tried to help him). I don't know if there is a new life he's craving. I know work wise he has some kind of fantasy of switching jobs in his head, but reality is that it's very unlikely.

Practically abandoning his children in the middle of his emotional crisis and definitely abandoning your MR is not something he can keep quiet and quietly slink back into your old life with minimal shame. You're dealing with and addict who is very likely in MLC. You need people.

I have just never been the type who find sharing therapeutic. Most of my sharing my M issues has a purpose, such as when I was going to have the $ talk, I first spoke to a friend who has already separated from her H so I could pick her brain about this topic. Other times it's like when my friend or my mom ask for updates, I'd oblige and give them "highlights." For the most part I guess I just feel like other people cannot relate because they've never been through something like this.

And I bet your H was someone who was always logical before this?

super. logical. but I have noticed that started to deteriorate over the last few years. Now it's just full on crazy sometimes.

[wooba]

Well. after my last episode of feeling like sh1t, and finally feeling like we're another step closer to D after our talk, the last few days I have changed my attitude about interacting with H. I don't even want to talk to him like he's the friendly neighborhood cashier anymore. I don't even want to make small talk. I'm not sure if I want to save my M at this point.

Yesterday H called and asked about Mother's Day plans, "Are you planning on visiting your mother and I'll just go visit mine." I said yeah that sounds good. And then he said that I've been withdrawn and not communicative - accusing me of not telling him about xyz event regarding childcare when I DID - and then bringing up last time when he accused me of saying something dismissive to him when I DID NOT.....whatever. I rejected his statements but did not engage further.

A big thing that happened in our convo was that I told him I've told my parents about our sitch. He did not sound happy about it but he kept cool and stated that he would appreciated if I had given him notice. I told him that I'd like to tell his parents also, but for right now I will let him decide what to do.

I don't know if he knows this. but no, I no longer want to play family with him in front of my parents and his. His access to my side of family (which he loves) is gone. When papers are filed, nothing is going to be kept under wraps. Friends and even acquaintances will know. People at work will know.

I told him yesterday that we will be gone this weekend, let me know if you want to take the kids out for dinner. H called me today and said let's do dinner tomorrow. I said sure, you can take them to this and that restaurant. He said let's all go together. I hesitated. I don't really want to be part of it. He can has his time with the kids, I don't need to be there. But I agreed anyway. I feel like this is the part where I need to learn to draw the line - H has the idea that we will still be friends and hang out with the kids together after D, but that won't happen. maybe 5 or 10 years later we can be "friends," but I don't want to be his friend right now.

ironically after our D talk, this is the most we've talked since weeks ago. H has called every day so far. they were short calls, there's always something he's calling me about, but not totally necessary. weird.

[may22]

H called me today and said let's do dinner tomorrow. I said sure, you can take them to this and that restaurant. He said let's all go together. I hesitated. I don't really want to be part of it. He can has his time with the kids, I don't need to be there. But I agreed anyway. I feel like this is the part where I need to learn to draw the line - H has the idea that we will still be friends and hang out with the kids together after D, but that won't happen. maybe 5 or 10 years later we can be "friends," but I don't want to be his friend right now.

Wooba, if you need it, I just want to give you permission to change your mind on this one. Just because you agreed to the dinner in the moment doesn't mean you are bound to carry through on it. You totally have the right to text him and say you know what, I'm not up for it, why don't you pick up the kids and take them on your own. (And as an aside... if I were you, the opportunity for a little alone time would be soooooo welcome! You need and deserve that! Maybe you even frame it that way to him if you don't want to tell him you care one way or the other about being in the same room as him... just say hey I could use some time without the kids to get some stuff done around the house.)

Let us know how it goes. Wasn't your H suicidal previously? Have you heard anything along those lines recently? (Sorry if I'm remembering incorrectly)

[cardinal]

Well. after my last episode of feeling like sh1t, and finally feeling like we're another step closer to D after our talk, the last few days I have changed my attitude about interacting with H. I don't even want to talk to him like he's the friendly neighborhood cashier anymore. I don't even want to make small talk. I'm not sure if I want to save my M at this point.

This is pretty much exactly how I’ve been feeling the last week, wooba. I’m over small talk and don’t feel like interacting. I’m feeling like there is no marriage to save at this point if H is so far gone. (Still have some wish that in the future, H will come back to some semblance of the man I knew, but also be able to cope with and express emotions, but that just feels like more wishing than hoping right now).

Wayfarer, I also wanted to say I needed to hear what you wrote to wooba about talking to people—I realized I spend too much energy worrying about if saying x or y to some friend will reflect badly on H and mess up some future chance for him to own up to his behavior, but, really, what about caring for myself now? What if I need support? Meanwhile H gets to present himself to others however he chooses, so differently than he presents himself to me, which I guess I should just accept. I also know it doesn’t always make me feel better to talk, because, like wooba says, often people can’t understand because they’ve never been through something like this.

wooba, I second what May says about going to dinner. If what you’d really like is to have that time to yourself, stay home!

[wooba]

may, I did end up taking your advice and telling H that I will not join them for dinner. It was a bit strange because when I called him about it, we ended up talking back and forth about cancelling the dinner and ordering in (him) vs stick to the original plan (me). I'm giving him his alone time with the kids! Why the fuss over such a simple thing?

The past week was strange. H called me every.single.day. about logistics, kids, generally things that there's either no immediate need to call and inform me about, or just irrelevant.

I'm no longer holding my breath for recon. It's a possibility that seems light years away. But I'm still digging deeper for patience and compassion. The patience is no longer about waiting for things to turn around, but is for all the necessary interactions with the father of my children who now might as well be an alien from outer space. The compassion is to remind myself that his illogical behavior and words are not personal, they come from a place of hurt. That's what makes me sad most of the time...how he's become someone who the old him would despise. How he tried so hard to escape from that dysfunctional family dynamic that he grew up with, but ultimately still ended up in the same place.

Let the chips fall where they may. Life is defined by impermanence, therefore we must learn to let go.

"There isn't time, so brief is life, for bickerings, apologies, heart burnings, callings to account. There is only time for loving, and but an instant, so to speak, for that." - Mark Twain

[Traveler]

Glad you found your voice and spoke up about dinner. Lovely quote by Mark Twain. Happy Mother’s Day, Wooba.

[Pommy99]

Wooba I am so desperate to get to the same place as you, and build my resilience, patience and compassion. You are an inspiration, you really are.

I take my H’s words and actions as personal but I know that inside he is deeply troubled and depressed. He tries to convince himself that getting back together will work out ok, but something isn’t right for him and he randomly thrashes around with seemingly irrational explanations for things that are wrong. H also grew up with a dysfunctional family unit and I wonder how much of his behaviour is linked to his ambivalent attachment style that is surely an output from his upbringing.

{{Hugs}}

[wayfarer]

I'm no longer holding my breath for recon. It's a possibility that seems light years away. But I'm still digging deeper for patience and compassion. The patience is no longer about waiting for things to turn around, but is for all the necessary interactions with the father of my children who now might as well be an alien from outer space. The compassion is to remind myself that his illogical behavior and words are not personal, they come from a place of hurt. That's what makes me sad most of the time...how he's become someone who the old him would despise. How he tried so hard to escape from that dysfunctional family dynamic that he grew up with, but ultimately still ended up in the same place.

Let the chips fall where they may. Life is defined by impermanence, therefore we must learn to let go.

"There isn't time, so brief is life, for bickerings, apologies, heart burnings, callings to account. There is only time for loving, and but an instant, so to speak, for that." - Mark Twain

It's really nice to see how calm and resolute you are right now. I hope you had a lovely weekend.

You will need patience and compassion in spades to co-parent those kids as they are pretty young and you have a long way to go with someone who will repeatedly choose themselves over their kids. Or their own desires over your boundaries. It's a long road parenting like that, but it's a lot easier when you can calmly remind yourself that they aren't capable of thinking as you do, loving as you do, feeling as you do. Meeting them where they are at, and being the solid, grounded parent makes all the difference.

Family of origin is something really, really hard to over come even in the best of circumstances. Best of circumstances being not just a desire to not be like those people, but and introspective active plan to not be like them. And even the most motivated of people still can fall flat to grow beyond what they know to be a whole, healthy, happy person. It's hard to rewire humans. It's even harder when that person doesn't know they need to be rewired, refuses to be rewired, or doesn't have the tools to rewire themselves.

All of this is going to be hard. Keeping your boundaries with H. Parenting with him. Going forward with D. But I'm super confident that you got this. You are so strong. And you're getting to be so zen with all of this. It's all going to turn out beautifully in the end for you, even with all this exhausting and painful exposition.

[wooba]

CWarrior - Thanks! I had a lovely Mother's Day. Surrounded by family. my kids made me a card for the first time of their own volition (in the past H would remind them to make a card). It was cute, I overheard the eldest whispering to the other two about it and the middle one told me to stay away (from their card making session).

Pommy - Thank you. You will get there one day, you can't rush the process, you can only trust that you can. There is no skipping all the heartaches and sleepless nights. You'll have to drag your feet through it. But you will make it. Believe me.

It's a long road parenting like that, but it's a lot easier when you can calmly remind yourself that they aren't capable of thinking as you do, loving as you do, feeling as you do. Meeting them where they are at, and being the solid, grounded parent makes all the difference.

This. After years I've actually finally arrived at this conclusion shortly before BD. I've always known that H is troubled, but it was hard for me to accept him for who he was. Then I finally realized that he is who he is, and I should not expect him to be the ideal father I have in my mind. But it was too late! Ha!

Family of origin is something really, really hard to over come even in the best of circumstances. Best of circumstances being not just a desire to not be like those people, but and introspective active plan to not be like them.

my H fought hard all his life to be different from his family of origin. I would say he's successful on some level, but I think when you grow up with abuse, it is just a whole different story. Maybe he was successful at running away from it, but not at coming to terms with certain aspects of his childhood. There's a lot of residual anger and shame that he's carried all his life. That's why I am prepared to bid farewell because I know this is so hard to overcome for him.

Thank you wayfarer for your words. Honestly I really think the universe works in mysterious ways. Life presented this man to me for a reason. All the flaws and pain that he carries with him became part of my life, and in turn forced me to dig deeper within myself for self-examination. I have no regrets, only gratitude.

[wooba]

H stopped by.

H: “do you want to open up your own credit card?”
Me: “I already have one.”
(I walked away)

Few mins later

H: “yadayada about money.” (Asked me something but I honestly didn’t understand what he was saying.)
Me: “hm? Sorry I’m not following. I’m just waiting on your papers.”
H: “yeah I know I’ve just been so busy at work. Yadayada”
Me: nods
(I went on doing my own thing around the house)

H: “we should go visit my parents, maybe next weekend?”
Me: “sure.”
H: talking about where to eat then etc
I listened.

I’m getting better at this. It is so easy to start babbling and end up engaging in small talk out of habit. Well, I think I improved a lot today. When your emotions settle and with enough detachment, it is possible. Others who are struggling with this- learn to get used to the uncomfortable silence. You do not need to fill gaps in the convo with words. If the WAS stops talking, and no answer is required from you part, consider the conversation over.

With that said, I still struggle sometimes with wanting to give him a last heartfelt speech about his MLC/our M. What exactly would I say I don’t even know. I feel like I just wanna get things off my chest before our D is finalized (well it hasn’t even begun actually). But I shut myself down when I get those urges. My gut tells me nothing good will come out of it. Seriously, this type of STFU training exercise helps when dealing with children too. I have been blowing up less at my kids for their misbehaviors lol.