Limbo over, now separated but in lockdown (part 3)

[may22]

Hey Pommy,

I know you'll be cautious and careful as you move into this next stage. I feel that by the time your H MO, you really were seeing the gaps between his behavior and what you want and deserve in an H. Hold onto that and don't accept less. It may take time to get there and if I can give one piece of advice, patience is what you need in spades!! It takes time and work to get from where he was, both in terms of the choices he made and his behavior towards you, and where you want to be.

Don't let yourself get discouraged too quickly. Just because he is saying this is how he feels-- and there is no reason to doubt this is how he does feel-- he'll slide and question his decision, you'll slide and question yours, and time and consistency are both really important ingredients. I think the same rules of believing little of what they say and only half of what they do still apply for awhile through this, as well as not letting your own emotions drive your decisions-- good or bad. Just like you didn't react emotionally and boot him out at the first drop of a hat, you also don't want the positive feelings of what he's saying now to cause you to bring him back too quickly.

I would recommend journaling, if you aren't already, either through this or separately, so that you can track his behavior and see how it changes over time. That has been helpful for me when I get frustrated to go back and realize that things HAVE improved quite a bit, even though it is hard to recognize on a day to day basis because it feels slow.

I totally agree with WF on the power dynamic. You need to change this as the power has been in his court for too long, and you need to take that back I think both to facilitate the reconciliation but also for the health of your R in the long-term. He can't jerk you around. If this is the decision he is making, he needs to make it and stick with it and show you through his behaviors that he is in it for the long haul. And let him be the one to bring up R talks. You don't want to come off like you're happily taking him back just because he said it would be so, or pushing for it now that he's said what he's said. This is your decision too, he took a pretty major step of MO and you need to do what is healthy and right for you and the kids, not just accede to his desires and his timeline.

If it gives you strength around taking it slow-- as hard as it would be on you if he moved back in only to change his mind again in some weeks or months... think of how hard it would be on your children. Be sure you can trust before you take that step that you're not setting them up for whiplash emotions either.

Think on your boundaries. Your boundaries will be different from anyone else's so spend some time thinking about what is your line of what you will and won't accept, and what you're willing to accept for now as long as there is change in the right direction. Once you find your boundary, stick to it.

This might not be a fun question but: what is up with his EA? Is there any reason to believe that there is information you don't know about it/her? Has he been in contact with her while on lockdown and is there any possibility that it went farther than he had previously admitted to? I'm not saying to confront him on this now, unless the information would change how you respond (and assuming you can trust him to be honest). I'm just saying there was a time when we both had Hs with long-distance EAs, and I wrote to someone on here that I was 99.9% positive it never went physical... and then I was so, so wrong. I guess I'm saying that once you guys decide to R I think that the road will be a lot easier if you start out with total transparency. I still don't have that with my H-- I still have unanswered questions about whether they saw each other in other cities, how they communicated, and what exactly happened between them when he broke it off with her-- but I will say that time is helping me not to worry about these quite so much, I'm focused more on his behavior and the interactions between us, and I know we'll get there eventually. But, I do think that *I* would be farther along if he'd answered those questions back in January/February.

You might read through Blu's thread and Alison's -- I think both have good perspectives on the difficulties of R and piecing. (Lots of good advice on my thread too if you want to read it there.)

And finally... I'm glad to hear you got some too You go, sister! Do I recall correctly that you also had an SSM? I think this will be an important area for healing for you both if I do remember that correctly.

Stay the course. You got this. And yes, let's have a virtual G&T. I just switched over to the Botanist from Hendricks as my gin of choice and it is very tasty.

[Pommy99]

Hey May, WF, thanks for your thoughts.

H is having his first slide. It didn’t take long. We’re back on the intimacy blocker again. Today, however, he’s contacted someone for IC, which he’s been saying he’d do for months to help him work through his confusion, but never has. Now 3 days after wanting to come home he’s decided he needs IC. I’m trying to see that as a positive.

He still says he feels deep down he wants to be with me, that he wants his children to be part of a family unit, but there is this feeling that he can’t connect with me intimately. I’m honestly exhausted by this. He’s still been very loving today , lots of kissing, but he’s now firmly put the brakes on about moving back home - and everything is now preceded with “If”.

Tbh I’d not given him any indication that he should move back home, but in my mind it was more “when” and not “if”. I didn’t initiate a R talk last night or today -he did. I’m trying to be in control of me, although tonight I finally feel defeated and that I have no fight left in me.

He says he’s apprehensive about recommitting in case it’s not the right thing to do. I can’t help him with that, but I’m sure apprehension is an emotion for most people in this situation. I feel it too.

So I guess it’s just a case of being patient. It feels like limbo all over again. He still can’t work out if he wants me or not.

[may22]

Pommy, I'm sorry. This back and forth has got to be so exhausting. I hope you can continue to work on detaching and let his issues be his issues until it makes sense for you to actually worry about them. Sounds like he isn't quite there yet.

He still says he feels deep down he wants to be with me, that he wants his children to be part of a family unit, but there is this feeling that he can’t connect with me intimately.

UGH. I'm sorry, that not being able to connect part just feels like such BS. Get the F over it, H. You choose to work on it or you don't.

FWIW, my H said this up and down and right and left for months-- the impossibility of having those feelings again for me. I just kept holding to my position, which was... you won't know until you try, and you can't really try until the third party is completely out of our lives. Once she is gone and we give it some time, then we can see if we can re-start that part of our relationship again. But I completely understood why he felt like this since he's emotionally connected to someone else-- until that connection has been severed, how could he reconnect with me?

I'm sorry. Hang in there and remember you are going to be 100% fine no matter what. His wishy-washy-ness isn't very attractive. Remember he tends to lean in when you lean out, so maybe you need to really keep the gas pedal pressed on detaching and not letting him back for kissing etc until you're confident he isn't still waffling. And if he never gets there? You haven't wasted any time in focusing on healing yourself.

[Oceangl]

Hey May, WF, thanks for your thoughts.

H is having his first slide. It didn’t take long. We’re back on the intimacy blocker again. Today, however, he’s contacted someone for IC, which he’s been saying he’d do for months to help him work through his confusion, but never has. Now 3 days after wanting to come home he’s decided he needs IC. I’m trying to see that as a positive.

He still says he feels deep down he wants to be with me, that he wants his children to be part of a family unit, but there is this feeling that he can’t connect with me intimately. I’m honestly exhausted by this. He’s still been very loving today , lots of kissing, but he’s now firmly put the brakes on about moving back home - and everything is now preceded with “If”.

Tbh I’d not given him any indication that he should move back home, but in my mind it was more “when” and not “if”. I didn’t initiate a R talk last night or today -he did. I’m trying to be in control of me, although tonight I finally feel defeated and that I have no fight left in me.

He says he’s apprehensive about recommitting in case it’s not the right thing to do. I can’t help him with that, but I’m sure apprehension is an emotion for most people in this situation. I feel it too.

So I guess it’s just a case of being patient. It feels like limbo all over again. He still can’t work out if he wants me or not.

Pommy, I've missed you and I hate reading that you are still in yoyo territory. And limbo is so painful. I hate this they want to be with you but on their terms only. I go back and forth between trying everything I can and wanting to kick him to the curb. You deserve better than this.

[Pommy99]

Thanks for your messages OG and May

Well, it’s like the last 9 days never happened. H and I are back to being completely distant. Is this normal WAH behaviour? To say you want to come home and act like a happy, affectionate couple, to (understandably) sayIng that we should take things slowly, to completely backtracking and saying I don’t know what I want and not having any affectIon and hardly seeing each other for 5 days?

So after my last post on Tuesday, H was a bit distant on Weds (saw him briefly when he dropped kids off but he still kissed me) and Thurs he had an IC. After his IC he said the therapist had questioned his mental health and said he was putting a lot of pressure on himself (the pressure is him telling himself he needs to be 100% sure he will never walk out on me again before he can recommit). He was basically intimating that we slow things right down as things weren’t normal right now (referring to lockdown). I think I got very uptight and questioned how the heck he could say he wanted to come back and then backtrack. He said again he needed to be sure he was coming back for me and not for any other reason. In a further conversation he said that he’d felt pressured to coming back, pressured to do the right thing for me and the kids but that none of that took into account his feelings and something still didn’t feel right, it didn’t make him feel happy. I’m struggling to buy into this. What about the statements that deep down he felt like he wanted to be with me? That he finds it hard to imagine life without me. And that he was certain it was the right thing to do!!

By Thursday night we were having a pretty hostile FaceTime chat, with him giving the old “you’re not flirty/dirty/spontaneous/cheeky” and my usual response of “you’ve rejected me for the last year and asked me not to put pressure on you re sex”. I can’t win! I didn’t validate, I just got defensive.

We had a chat on Saturday when he popped round and he now won’t even consider trying to make it work, or commit to moving forward. Coming home is completely off the table. We exchanged some nice texts on Sunday. I told him I missed him and he said he was missing my company too. I said I had woken up and wished he was here as I miss lying next to him and chatting about random stuff, and he said he missed all that too, and how much he loved my passion for travel and telling him about places, and how much he relies on me for that, and he loves how I listen to him ramble on about cars. And that’s been it.

I don’t know what to do next as in walk away, try NC as much as poss or see if we can get back to talking about reconciliation. I guess DBing would be NC and detach?

Did I mess up last week? Did I push him away when he was asking to slow down and let him get through some IC sessions to soart out his head? I feel like I went cold and upset on him when I should’ve just taken a step back and talked gently about what we do next. We might have been able to carry on building up the affection and trust but I basically shut him down when he said started to back track and blamed him for leading me on. Help!

[LH19]

P,

I think there is a lot of things going on here. You guys are trying jump back in too fast. You took him back too easy. If you don't make him work and earn it he will just walk again down the road. You are pressuring him. You are listening to his words and not his actions. He can't 100% guarantee you he's never going to walk again.

I don't think you messed it up I just don't think he's completely committed.

[Pommy99]

P,

I think there is a lot of things going on here. You guys are trying jump back in too fast. You took him back too easy. If you don't make him work and earn it he will just walk again down the road. You are pressuring him. You are listening to his words and not his actions. He can't 100% guarantee you he's never going to walk again.

I don't think you messed it up I just don't think he's completely committed.

We had only got as far as discussing whether it was the right thing to do, i hadn’t welcomed him back with open arms. I’d laid out what I felt about him working in the city and what wouldn’t work for me long term. He even said to D16 the following day that he didn’t know when he would go back to the city but it would need to work for me as well.

He is putting pressure on himself to be 100% sure he won’t walk again and I’ve said we need to work towards that. If everything felt perfect now we wouldn’t be in this situation. I guess I did put pressure on at the weekend. I feel like he wants to be at the finish line before he’s crossed the start line, and this frustrates me so I was trying to pressure him to accept we are at the start line and a good starting point is getting on the same page about being willing to try.

What do I do next? Back off or remain quietly visible on the sideline? He is depressed and alone in lockdown. He says it is killing him as much as it is killing me that he can’t get over this blocker and that’s why he realised he needed IC. He says he desperately wants to feel the right things but something isn’t right. I don’t want to alienate him when he has nothing else, but maybe it’s what I have to do?

[LH19]

Yes back off listen and validate. Do not use words like “you need to” “we need to” . This can’t be because he’s lonely. If memory serves me correctly he wanted to hit the dating seen. Well that’s completely dead right now. What happens when it opens up again?

You are going to have to have infinite patience.

[wooba]

He is putting pressure on himself to be 100% sure he won’t walk again and I’ve said we need to work towards that. If everything felt perfect now we wouldn’t be in this situation.

I think this is actually a good sign. He wants to be able to commit once he decides. the difficult part right now seems to be for him to decide that he's going to commit. You are also right, there will forever be a risk and nothing is perfect. He will have to see that too, to embrace his fears yet willing to do the work to recon.

What do I do next? Back off or remain quietly visible on the sideline? He is depressed and alone in lockdown. He says it is killing him as much as it is killing me that he can’t get over this blocker and that’s why he realised he needed IC. He says he desperately wants to feel the right things but something isn’t right. I don’t want to alienate him when he has nothing else, but maybe it’s what I have to do?

Keep validating and DBing. but I would recommend pulling back a little. He is obviously still very confused. He was ready, and then he got cold feet. Sounds like fear to me. He is questioning whether that was the right call, and you should too. Just because he says he wants to be back does not necessarily means he's ready. Has he worked on himself? What's changed? Lots of questions I know......again, give it time. Wishing you luck!

[Pommy99]

I think this is actually a good sign. He wants to be able to commit once he decides. the difficult part right now seems to be for him to decide that he's going to commit. You are also right, there will forever be a risk and nothing is perfect. He will have to see that too, to embrace his fears yet willing to do the work to recon.

There is something missing for him, and I think he feels what is missing has never been there (or not for a long time). I’m referring to physical connection. And I think he fears recommitting and being unfulfilled. And it’s catch22 - difficult to test the waters there without being willing to take a leap of faith.

He is working on himself and now having IC. But he has completely pushed me away, and R seems so far away now.

If memory serves me correctly he wanted to hit the dating seen. Well that’s completely dead right now. What happens when it opens up again? .

He had a desire to find romantic/passionate love. I’ve had the ILYB for a year. Although last week he was saying he’s realised that the love he does have for me after 20years is far deeper than the euphoric love and passion of a new relationship. And the weekend he announced he wanted to return there was a lot of tension and build up between us over 2 days and we ended up doing what he felt we would never do again! But then afterwards went back to saying it didn’t feel right.