Needing to pull a last resort

[CaptainN]

On a side note, what's with the flashing envelope at the top of the page? I figured it indicated there was unread private messages or something, but there's nothing there.

[Pommy99]

I'd rather spend time with my kid.

I enjoy it. It's the best part of life IMO. I can't think of anything more getting a life than that.

That is something to be proud of, for sure. But you aren’t just a father. Is this why you are in this sitch? That you forgot to be a husband and your own person? I haven’t read your entire thread, sorry, but you need to be out there showing your W that you want and need adult relationships ,so go and interact with other adults. That could involve your daughter if you wish, like a playgroup, for example. But also think about what life will look like if you do split . You won’t have your children 7 days a week so prepare yourself now for how you might start spending child-free time. Your W presumably wants a man to shower her with attention, to put her front and centre. If she still only sees you playing the role of father she will never see that you are husband material.

[CaptainN]

That is something to be proud of, for sure. But you aren’t just a father. Is this why you are in this sitch? That you forgot to be a husband and your own person? I haven’t read your entire thread, sorry, but you need to be out there showing your W that you want and need adult relationships ,so go and interact with other adults. That could involve your daughter if you wish, like a playgroup, for example. But also think about what life will look like if you do split . You won’t have your children 7 days a week so prepare yourself now for how you might start spending child-free time. Your W presumably wants a man to shower her with attention, to put her front and centre. If she still only sees you playing the role of father she will never see that you are husband material.

No, it's definitely not why I am in this situation. My wife would probably tell you the opposite is true (I would not agree with her there). In fact, a part of me believes that some of the reason a divorce is attractive to her is that she would only feel responsible for our daughter half the time, and that is appealing to her. Of the two of us, I am definitely the one that kept up with my interests/hobbies after our daughter was born. I just had to adjust the time of day I was involved with those things. She on the other hand, did not just withdraw from me, but from most of her interests as well.

I am already just getting home in time to say goodnight a couple nights a week, so I like to spend time with her when I can. Sometimes, that involves taking her somewhere, but it just depends on how early I get home from work and if there is time before bed. There's more opportunity for this on the weekend.

I don't think my wife wants to be showered with attention, again, I'd say the opposite. She has somewhat of an avoidant personality.

[Cadet]

On a side note, what's with the flashing envelope at the top of the page? I figured it indicated there was unread private messages or something, but there's nothing there.

Its a message that does not work on this forum

It says this

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[Ready2Change]

Hi capt,

What typically works is counter-intuitive. This is one big onion that you have to peel. One layer at a time. Use DR as a foundation for positive changes in your behavior.


What women find attractive is not what most guys believe. Do your research and start making changes to be attractive. Most of it comes down to the way you behave and interact with her.

Understand the difference between seduction and attraction. Also work on becoming seductive.


Start by reading this post:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2846984

When you have more time dig through the rest of the quotes threads:
https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712

I am sure there are around 1000 quotes now.




She thinks she knows you. Your job right now is to prove her wrong and surprise her. You do this by changes in your behavior. Not your words.


If I was in your shoes, I would do everything that Steve85 and AS advise. They are two active vets that know their stuff. Keep an eye on the number of posts made by people. The higher the number, the higher I would weigh their advise.

Job and sandi2 are wise ladies that are active posters as well.



R2C

[CaptainN]

I have to say, I'm a bit confused. Some of the information I hear seems contradictory.

Completely detach and have as little interaction as possible, but work on seducing?

And the "detach" I hear about here, in many respects sounds very different than the impression I got from reading DR.

It sounds like detachment in ways is somewhat akin to becoming kind of a childish jerk. Some of the behavior sounds less polite than I would give someone who I wanted nothing to do with and wished would just leave me alone.

I thought I was supposed to be about working on being the best me I can be, not becoming something I hate.

I get not pursuing, and being restrained, but *some* (some does not and seems more like the idea I got from DR) of this stuff sounds like the immature babble. No offense.

Maybe, I am just not clear on what is being suggested, but I don't want to become a somewhat absentee dad, who is rude and dismissive.

[ovrrnbw]

Read it again. Detachment is nothing like what you stated, I'm not sure how you came to that conclusion.

Detachment means that other people's words and actions don't have control over your words or actions. Instead of feeling and reacting emotionally, you are thinking and acting logically.

Yes, work on being attractive while detaching and limiting interaction. When she wants a divorce and you continue to pursue her, what does this look like to her? What are you telling her with your actions?

[SteveLW]

I have to say, I'm a bit confused. Some of the information I hear seems contradictory.

Completely detach and have as little interaction as possible, but work on seducing?

And the "detach" I hear about here, in many respects sounds very different than the impression I got from reading DR.

It sounds like detachment in ways is somewhat akin to becoming kind of a childish jerk. Some of the behavior sounds less polite than I would give someone who I wanted nothing to do with and wished would just leave me alone.

I thought I was supposed to be about working on being the best me I can be, not becoming something I hate.

I get not pursuing, and being restrained, but *some* (some does not and seems more like the idea I got from DR) of this stuff sounds like the immature babble. No offense.

Maybe, I am just not clear on what is being suggested, but I don't want to become a somewhat absentee dad, who is rude and dismissive.

Boy this sounds awfully familiar.

Captain, assuming you aren't a previous poster that always liked to belittle this forum, detachment is not RUDE nor being childish or a jerk. Google: self-differentiation in marriage. The opposite of detachment/differentiation, is being overly attached and codependent. That is never a healthy way to be. Being overly attached and codependent means you rely on your spouse for YOUR happiness. Not only is that not a way to live your life, but it puts a tremendous burden on your spouse. No one want to be solely responsible for the happiness of another. A person eventually collapses under the weight of that kind of pressure.

Captain, I did a ton of reading, watching videos, etc during my sitch. Of all the experts I listened to and read, there was a lot contradictions between them. But one thing they ALL agreed on was to give your WAS time and space. To remove all pressure and pursuit. To not try to control them.

Lots of newcomers struggle with detachment. It is a complex concept. That is why studying and understanding it well is important. One expert I read said it best. He said: Give your WAS time and space. Become the best you can be. And then when the opportunity arises, show them your new and improved self. The problem with LBSs is that when we do 180 on bad behavior we want to strut those changes in front of our WAS like a peacock. And that comes across as disingenuous.....a kiss of death for the LBS.

This is why we say to never point out your positive changes to your partner. "Look how good I am now!" It comes across as "I've changed to get you back, and once you are then I will go back to the way I was."

Never be dismissive or rude. However, when you get BD your spouse is telling you "I want time and space". All you are doing is giving that to her. But when you DO interact you are attentive, present, upbeat, and happy. Just do not be the one to start conversation, but when she does then fully engage. Read sandi's writings on the friendly cashier. Great stuff.

I've been on this forum for over two years and NEVER EVER have I heard one of the vets here say "Be an absentee parent". Where did you get that!?! Coparenting, putting a child care plan in place, is NOT being an absentee parent. It is again giving your WAS what they asked for.

As far as seduction. That is an art. Most men especially can't pull it off subtly. R2C likes to see LBSs apply some seduction...and done right it can be effective in certain sitches. However, we men seem to think "Hey, you wanna?" is seduction. It isn't. But dressing nicer. Taking care of grooming (trim those nose hairs!). Smelling good. Being quietly confident. That is all seduction and you haven't done a single thing explicitly to "seduce" her. Remember, seduction isn't going after her, it is getting her to come after you. Think of the WAS like a cat. Any movement towards them will send them fleeing. Sitting quietly and invitingly will sometimes draw them towards you.

So as you can see, this can all fit together if you let it. Or you can just argue and compare us to a another forum. Up to you.

Oh, I think you could stand to read the distance pursuit dynamic thread. PURE GOLD. In fact, did you do all of the reading cadet linked in his first response? I think it will clear up a lot of this for you.

[CaptainN]

I have to say, I'm a bit confused. Some of the information I hear seems contradictory.

Completely detach and have as little interaction as possible, but work on seducing?

And the "detach" I hear about here, in many respects sounds very different than the impression I got from reading DR.

It sounds like detachment in ways is somewhat akin to becoming kind of a childish jerk. Some of the behavior sounds less polite than I would give someone who I wanted nothing to do with and wished would just leave me alone.

I thought I was supposed to be about working on being the best me I can be, not becoming something I hate.

I get not pursuing, and being restrained, but *some* (some does not and seems more like the idea I got from DR) of this stuff sounds like the immature babble. No offense.

Maybe, I am just not clear on what is being suggested, but I don't want to become a somewhat absentee dad, who is rude and dismissive.

Boy this sounds awfully familiar.

Captain, assuming you aren't a previous poster that always liked to belittle this forum, detachment is not RUDE nor being childish or a jerk. Google: self-differentiation in marriage. The opposite of detachment/differentiation, is being overly attached and codependent. That is never a healthy way to be. Being overly attached and codependent means you rely on your spouse for YOUR happiness. Not only is that not a way to live your life, but it puts a tremendous burden on your spouse. No one want to be solely responsible for the happiness of another. A person eventually collapses under the weight of that kind of pressure.

Captain, I did a ton of reading, watching videos, etc during my sitch. Of all the experts I listened to and read, there was a lot contradictions between them. But one thing they ALL agreed on was to give your WAS time and space. To remove all pressure and pursuit. To not try to control them.

Lots of newcomers struggle with detachment. It is a complex concept. That is why studying and understanding it well is important. One expert I read said it best. He said: Give your WAS time and space. Become the best you can be. And then when the opportunity arises, show them your new and improved self. The problem with LBSs is that when we do 180 on bad behavior we want to strut those changes in front of our WAS like a peacock. And that comes across as disingenuous.....a kiss of death for the LBS.

This is why we say to never point out your positive changes to your partner. "Look how good I am now!" It comes across as "I've changed to get you back, and once you are then I will go back to the way I was."

Never be dismissive or rude. However, when you get BD your spouse is telling you "I want time and space". All you are doing is giving that to her. But when you DO interact you are attentive, present, upbeat, and happy. Just do not be the one to start conversation, but when she does then fully engage. Read sandi's writings on the friendly cashier. Great stuff.

I've been on this forum for over two years and NEVER EVER have I heard one of the vets here say "Be an absentee parent". Where did you get that!?! Coparenting, putting a child care plan in place, is NOT being an absentee parent. It is again giving your WAS what they asked for.

As far as seduction. That is an art. Most men especially can't pull it off subtly. R2C likes to see LBSs apply some seduction...and done right it can be effective in certain sitches. However, we men seem to think "Hey, you wanna?" is seduction. It isn't. But dressing nicer. Taking care of grooming (trim those nose hairs!). Smelling good. Being quietly confident. That is all seduction and you haven't done a single thing explicitly to "seduce" her. Remember, seduction isn't going after her, it is getting her to come after you. Think of the WAS like a cat. Any movement towards them will send them fleeing. Sitting quietly and invitingly will sometimes draw them towards you.

So as you can see, this can all fit together if you let it. Or you can just argue and compare us to another forum. Up to you.

Oh, I think you could stand to read the distance pursuit dynamic thread. PURE GOLD. In fact, did you do all of the reading cadet linked in his first response? I think it will clear up a lot of this for you.

This is more clear and makes more sense.

I should be clear that, my impression was not just from this thread, but from reading some of the others as well.

If this post describes detachment, then I feel like I'm doing pretty well on that (at least the last couple of weeks - and in some areas, longer).

I haven't seen a lot of talk about children on here, which kind of surprises me, because they are a pretty significant aspect, and I think probably expected there to be more dedicated discussion to that subject. But, with work, and other things I have going on, I only get to see my daughter so much as it is, so I like to take advantage of those opportunities when I can. Sometimes (most of the time during the week) that means my wife will be there as well. But, that doesn't mean that my wife and I have a lot of interaction during that time. My attention is focused on my daughter.

This may be where I get confused, and maybe I read it (or rather the contrasting part) wrong:

But when you DO interact you are attentive, present, upbeat, and happy. Just do not be the one to start conversation, but when she does then fully engage.

Contrasted with advice on texting and then to avoid being around her at all made it seem like I should limit my engagement, even if she initiated.

Also, we do have a co-parenting plan in place already for when the divorce is final, but also, my wife has intimated that she doesn't expect me to leave the house after the divorce either, so what exactly she wants is not clear, at least not to me. Time for herself maybe (see my comment in the last post about thinking part of her thinking is to avoid responsibility for our kid half the time), but I'm certainly not prohibiting her from going out and doing anything she wants to do.

[Ready2Change]

You will get lots of contradictory advise. What worked for some, did not work for others, and vise versa. Only you will be able to determine what works in your sitch. Evaluate all the advise, decide what you would like to implement, and make your changes. If W likes what she sees, she might have a change of heart.

Ultimately you should take a good hard look at yourself and decide if there are things you want to change about yourself.