I don't want a divorce II ---- NEW THREAD Part 4

[KitCat]

Hi KC,

Just wanted to pipe in and say a few things-- one, you are getting amazing advice from vets-- you're really fortunate to have them so invested-- I would read, read, re-read everything they say. Steve85 really helped me in my sitch and I have probably read Blu's posts to me one hundred times, no exaggeration. I copied and pasted parts onto my phone so I could read over and over when I really needed it. I would do the same.

Three, STOP ENGAGING. It is not helpful. Give yourself a break of a couple of days. Make a rule that you don't respond to texts for x number of hours, don't answer his calls, and don't call back within x number of hours. That gives you some time to decide if a response is even necessary. Watch your heart rate. I have my heart rate displayed on my apple watch and I seriously watch it and didn't engage if it was elevated at all. You can set his calls and texts to have no alert on your phone so you only see them come in when you actively check for them, and you can only do it when you're feeling calm.

And finally--stop worrying about what you have or haven't done to date, DBing or not DBing, working out or not or whatever. Forgive yourself! This is NOT ON YOU!!!! Dust yourself off and go forward from here. You can do it.

HUGS

Thanks - May!!

I have started to read your sitch from the beginning.

I just feel like a fool.. so many things I want to go back on including the texts this morning. He must be so sick of me and angry that I'm working out again now... and not before he left??? Its so hard when he is getting all lovey dovey on FB and he is getting support from his other friends who know this woman... who havne't met me... they are saying how great it was to witness this happening between the two of them BUT they ALL know he is married.

I wish I could take the texts back. I had such resolve yesterday morning when he texted and I didn't respond.

What happened? He now has even less respect for me than previously.

[may22]

Try not to worry about what he thinks or doesn't think. Who cares???? You are working out for YOU, not for him. (RIGHT????) And don't worry about the texts. in his foggy brain he won't even remember it all tomorrow. And his friends are a-holes. Forget them too.

You got this.

[Ready2Change]

.. so many things I want to go back on including.....

Can't change the past. Forgive yourself.... commit to changing your behavior going forward....If you make mistakes...learn from them...forgive yourself...commit to changing your behavior going forward....If you make mistakes...learn from them...forgive yourself...commit to changing your behavior going forward....If you make mistakes...learn from them...forgive yourself...commit to changing your behavior going forward....If you make mistakes...learn from them...forgive yourself...commit to changing your behavior going forward....If you make mistakes...learn from them...forgive yourself...

[KitCat]

Stolen from Steve85 from May's thread

I can relate to your H a lot on this. I had EAs when my W didn't want to have sex with me for many years. Even recently she admitted that she has sex with me for me. It is difficult for a man's ego to have a W that doesn't want or desire him sexually. After all, that is the part of the relationship that really sets it apart from all the other women that a man knows in life. Of all the women at church, at work, at the grocery store, etc, the thing that delineates my relationship with my W more than any other factor is that fact that we get naked and sexually intimate with one another. When a W stops doing that with her H, that special nature of their R goes away in his mind. And you the W starts to become not much different than all those other women mentioned above. And in fact a lot of sex-starved husbands start to treat their wives no different than those other women. I know that's what I did.

Our sex life had dwindled... opposite shifts with his drive full on in the morning which was his evening and me the opposite. I suppose he felt he hung in there long enough... and now is getting his needs met elsewhere.

Stolen from Woomba from May's thread

sex is also an issue for us, and my H admitted to me that he's still hurt by my past rejections and he doesn't know whether coming back will change anything. He thinks that if he comes back, slowly with time, everything is just going to go back to the way it was (him feeling rejected all the time).

H is exactly that... he has felt so hurt and rejected and in so much pain that he stated he can never go there again with me for risk it only being good for 2 weeks and then going bad again --- he said he just wouldn't survive it. Instead he just goes and starts a new story with someone else. It was never my intention to leave him feeling rejected and I have no way of expressing that to him that he will understand and believe.

I don't even know how it go so infrequent. I enjoyed sex with my H. Desired it. Did we just get too familiar/routine/working too much??? I had been missing the sex recently as well. We had date night and he passed out on the way home. H is always so sleep deprived. I would have pushed harder had I know he was going to be leaving the M.

May -
My H's love language is also physical touch... hand holding, PDA, just all around general touching. I'm acts of service. I spent so much time saying - Yes, But I do X, Y, Z (because that is I show love) but to him I was dismissive of his feelings and needs. I see that now. I would never do another Yes, But argument EVER.

For all my realizations ultimately don't matter. Whether or not he comes back is completely up to him. I have to look at he is in a PA with someone that is nuts about him. He is getting his needs fulfilled.

Stolen from Steve85 from May's thread

You have to prepare yourself for the worst because unfortunately, even with exceptional DBing, the odds are against you. As another marriage saving expert puts it: you can't fix in a few weeks or months what it took you years to get into. The simple truth is that if the WAS wants to leave, get a D, and move on...they will.

This is where my H is at... he wants to rip off the bandage and move on to start a new story. That's less painful than trying to fix ours.

I've got to wrap my head around that and stop making the same mistakes... I will keep reading.

[KitCat]

So... H contacted... I have given myself ALL day to NOT think about and just let it sit there for awhile. I wanted to type things out when I wasn't emotional.

I woke up early this morning to a missed call from H at 10:40pm. Followed by a text to call when I can. Now there had been some conversation about credit card payment and bank information earlier and I had supplied information by text about both when i was home at noon for lunch.

At 5am I just responded "what did you need" and at 5:30am I sent "I'm up with the dogs now if you needed to call". He would have been at work at least until 6am. No response so I go about my day. I have texted twice and I don't need to call.

At 7am I'm working out and he calls. He can tell I'm exercising but I stop and take his call - he acts like I called him being distant and then suddenly:

H: What is my father's middle name????
Me: X
H: That's right so why didn't it work with the security question of my bank???

Now - a little history. We each had our own accounts. His is where he works and mine is where we live. They have been joint accounts for 10yr - before we actually married. We have always called them X Bank and Y Bank. Never yours or mine. Now suddenly its "his" bank. Keep in mind he also has a secret bank account where all his paychecks have been diverted too.

Me: Well its my father's middle name.
H: Why is that???
Me: I did all the banking and their had been site upgrades that required re-enrolling and it was just easier for me.
H: I don't even know your father's middle name
H: I'm locked out of the account and I can't figure what or how X card got paid. I went to X card site and I can't figure it out.
Me: I know this is upsetting. Let me see what I can find out from X card site.
H: (Continuing to belt outs complaints how I would use my father's name at HIS bank)
H: I called at a reasonable time last night and you did not answer. (10:40pm and he knows I work a lot of Saturdays)
Me: I'm sorry I was not available I was asleep.

Me: Updating H on X card site. Asking about calling the bank and getting it unlocked, but H thinks there is no customer service on Saturdays. I'm doing my best to validate how upsetting this is for him not being able to get into the bank account.

H: (seemed to think my validation was condescending) its just so narcissistic of you. To use your dad's on my account.

I should have ended the conversation there by simply stating "I have answered your question and I need to go", but sadly I did not.

The conversation continued about why the X card couldn't be paid in full. I've never allowed us to carry any kind of credit card debt. But, now this was part of what he wanted to handle from "his" account. He started complaining about the lack of overtime (but he has been working it). Stated his check was only X and stated I though it XY amount. He would only transfer a portion to the joint account so there isn't enough to cover the bill.

H: (Talks about the overtime in the last 2 days. From what he volunteers I know he is not working tomorrow. It took everything I had to ask if he was coming home today... I didn't and I know he packed 4 sets of work clothes. I expect he will sleep and the he and the OW and this married couple that he is supposedly staying with will all go out.

I also reminded him that I have paid his cellphone, car insurance and gym membership and need X amount. He had previously told me he would get it by Friday. NOW - mind you I am not asking for anything from his for the mortgage, any utilities including cable and internet. I'm just asking he pay for his items.

He said I did the stuff in the garage. I said that was not the agreement. He said fine I will give it you out of my allowance but I won't have any money at all.

I knew he was still at work pulling in overtime. We continue to talk about money. He is clearly not in any hurry to get me off the phone. I'm not sure why we are still talking. He got his point in about how angry he was about my narcissistic issue.

Me: Well I need to go and finish exercising and stop by work. Call the bank later this morning and let me know what you find out.
H: Fine.

About an hour later my phone rings but I cannot get to it in time but I immediately call him back.

H: I just sent you a text with what I was going to tell you.
Me: Great, I will let you go and go read it.
H: No, I called bank and there is only drive through today no customer service.
Me: Ok. Well I guess you can take care of it on Monday.
H: I guess I will have too.
Me: Ok good bye.

He is looking for any reason to be angry at me. I really wished I had stopped the conversation much earlier. And, while I tried to explain why the banking was set up that way (that was probably a waste of time since it just opened the floor up to put me down), I did not get baited into an argument. I remained calm and did not even raise my voice.

I have exercised today. Checked in with friends and cleaning my house. H is leaving crap all over the place and not cleaning up. I know I should leave it but I have to live here too and a dirty house isn't going to help my anxiety or depression.

[Traveler]

Hi KitCat,

Wow, that sounds like a real downer.

FWIW, I think your biggest mistake was answering, and your second mistake was engaging in discussions about finances, divorce, etc over the phone. I don't think those do your sanity or chances of reconciliation any favors. You could direct him to your e-mail if you're not comfy directing him to your lawyer.

I know this is upsetting.

Yay--acknowledging his point of view.

I'm doing my best to validate how upsetting this is for him not being able to get into the bank account.

Yay--validating!

Me: Let me see what I can find out from X card site.
Me: Updating H on X card site.

Trying to solve his problems again? That never seems to help.

H: (seemed to think my validation was condescending) its just so narcissistic of you. To use your dad's on my account. I should have ended the conversation there by simply stating "I have answered your question and I need to go", but sadly I did not.

That would've been a solid response! You saw that after-the-fact, at least. Next time.

He is clearly not in any hurry to get me off the phone. I'm not sure why we are still talking.

Maybe the same reason you couldn't hang up--because after so many years together there's an attachment between you two. It's natural, but imagine if instead of him getting his "fix" of you through this toxic call he either had to miss you or talk about something non-contentious?

[KitCat]

He is clearly not in any hurry to get me off the phone. I'm not sure why we are still talking.

Maybe the same reason you couldn't hang up--because after so many years together there's an attachment between you two. It's natural, but imagine if instead of him getting his "fix" of you through this toxic call he either had to miss you or talk about something non-contentious?

Yeah, it was definitely weird. Even though there is discussion about money and things settled down he wasn't the one to want to end the call but there really wasn't anything to talk about.

But you are right. I should have cut the call right after he got his answer he was looking for. He needs to miss me. I want him to miss me.

Yes --- fixing things... ugh. I do feel bad. H has NEVER done any of the bill paying in the 10yrs we have been together. He is a fish out of water and I am partly to blame for that. I felt it was my job to do this. After all he has the commute. My job was to make his life here as easy as possible. It was only in the last 2months that I was thinking about asking for help. Look at ways to trim things back. H had no idea that cable and internet had skyrocketed to over $240. AND, I spent $800 on something personal without discussing with him first. He would have NEVER done that to me. But, unfortunately I didn't get the chance to ask for help as he BD me. :-(

At one point:

Me: I've been going without right now as much as possible.
H: What are you going without?
Me: I'm putting off getting what I need for the puppy - food, treats, diapers ((this puppy excitement piddles at everything... I don't have the time to keep cleaning up or to have my eyes on him 24/7 because H is no where taking care of this thing))
H: You bought $50 worth of wine.
Me: Yes I did. ((Okay dude you are screwing OW, you can buy me some wine...))
H: And you went out to dinner.
Me: I have not been out to dinner. I eat at home minimally. ((Its H that his ringing up the card due to his eating out with OW)
H: Oh, there was a charge I didn't recognize - oh you bought the wine directly from winery.
Me: Yes

If it weren't for the fact he called me narcissistic - I would have thought he was trying to lean on me a little bit with hanging on the phone. He was really asking me of anything else but wasn't wanting to hang up.

I'm glad I was the one to end the call!!!! I could have easily stayed on the phone with him. I miss him. Good DB for me!!!!

And, when he called back/I had to return call he stated he had texted me so I again I try to end the call by saying great I'll just read the text... BUT, he had answered the call, since he had just texted me he could have ignored it AND he kept he on the phone to personally tell me what he had texted. AGAIN - I was grateful that I was the one to end the call and not him... Good DB for me again!!!

I'm looking forward to cleaning more. I will get the extra bedroom ready for him. He requested not to continue sleeping in the MB and I will respect that. Not sure if he is still showering in the MB or if he is going to share S18's bathroom... will wait and see I guess.

Hopefully the weather will be nice tomorrow. Hoping to get the puppy to the state park for a long walk. Sadly I just can't handle both dogs at the same time. Puppy just isn't trained enough. So I will have to walk the other dog another time.

[SteveLW]

Gotta love the idiocy of the walk away mentality. "I want to separate. But oh, I want you to do everything for me the way you used to." All you can do is chuckle and shake your head.

KC, trust me on this, if you do end up D'd you will look back one day and wonder why you tried so hard to hang on.

[KitCat]

Gotta love the idiocy of the walk away mentality. "I want to separate. But oh, I want you to do everything for me the way you used to." All you can do is chuckle and shake your head.

Well, I think he is NOT wanting my help but then is flailing about. I'm sure he is having anxiety about how high the credit card has gotten since all this went down. A $30 charge here, a $60 dollar charge there - all his of course and now we are at over 3K for the month. The anxiety is coming out as anger and he is clearly in a A-fog state so how is this HIS problem???

I truly believe the phone call was because 'how dare I leave him unable to figure this out for himself'. A little mini pity party... and then the realization that he still needs to pay me X when he gets here for the rest of his financial obligations.

I need to stop helping him. That's why I stated HE can call the bank on Monday.

KC, trust me on this, if you do end up D'd you will look back one day and wonder why you tried so hard to hang on.

Steve85

Bite your tongue!!!! I'm at a point to today where I am distancing myself more from H but I am still have hope for R. We shall see... time will tell.

[KitCat]

Yesterday was tough... I did a lot of reading... watching videos on getting through a break up. Did a lot of self realizations.

Was still in my new cute sexy pjs and busy cooking at the stove with my back turned when H walked through the door hours before expected. He actually said hi to me first.... I still had my back turned and said hi back. He asked what I was cooking. He actually took dog in other room to play with him. He seemed calm and peaceful. His face more relaxed.

I finished up prepping meal and threw into slow cooker. Washed dishes. Asked if he had dishes to add.. he said - no that he left them at R's (male) friends house. I noticed that he had not brought in his suitcase.

I disappeared for awhile to get dressed and ready for the day. He came looking for me - seemed surprised I was going out as he saw me put on hiking boots which I rarely wear... He stated you going out? Yup, I told the puppy I owed him a long walk.

Continue to get ready. Was back in kitchen. Asked if he was taking the bike out? He stated maybe but he had to clean it up. (Yes, I wished he asked me to ride with him... but he didn't) I asked that he keep the other dog distracted while I left with puppy so he wouldn't be upset - reminded him that I am unable to handle both at the same time.. hoping that he would offer to join me... he didn't. I did catch him looking at me... not eye contact so much but looking at me.. I looked cute.

I left.

I returned home and he was gone for hours. For a man who doesn't want to commute he drove home yesterday at 11am... took the bike all the way back and I expect visited with R (male friend) and maybe OW and also stopped by his parents... then he drove all the way back home.

He was cold again... just like before. The calm of that morning was gone.

It turned out I just finished dinner at the same time and asked if he was hungry... he said yes and I made him a plate.

I couldn't handle the silence so I left. He showered. Moved his stuff into the other room and fell asleep in extra bedroom. By 8pm he hadn't gotten up - he made the drive 4 times yesterday and no sleep.

I caved and got him up. He went to work and the only thing he said before leaving was thanks for getting him up.