1st Anniversary of Limbo, Indecisive WAH (part 2)

[may22]

I didn’t make contact with H all day, after I had left for work. He slept in the spare room, I cleared the top of his bedside cabinet and put his things in the drawer. Maybe that was cruel, but I was feeling like this is my MBR now, you’re choosing not to be in it. I knew he went to see the rental at 10am but I didn’t contact him to ask how it went. He txt me about 3pm to ask if I was ok. I replied 2 hrs later just to say yes, good thanks. He tried to call about 6pm but I ignored it. I then came home at 7pm and he commented that I was late so I simply said yeah, busy day, and left it at that.

Nice job-- I know that is all so hard to not respond or contact your H. I don't think it was cruel to clear his stuff off the cabinet. Not at all.

He’s decided to take the rental which left me a bit shocked but I said it sounded cool. His response was well not really, and proceeded to tell me how down and depressed he feels about it all, frightened, fearful, but that he needed to step back and press the reset button and get out if this cycle of emotions.. I validated but didn’t enter into further conversation about it, other than when he asked what I thought about it and I said in a positive tone that something needs to break the cycle. I feel like I said the wrong thing. Or did I? I’ve previously been very clear that it’s not what I want but today I’ve shown him the IDGAF attitude.

I mean... I think he DOES need to break the cycle. Something needs to change. And just because he's saying he decided to take the rental doesn't necessarily mean he'll go all the way through with it. maybe what he needs more than anything is to get a bit of space and break from all of this (including the EAP) so that he can get his head on straight. Do you know (or care) what is going on with that at the moment? I definitely felt with my H that his declarations of he was thinking of moving to the basement or getting an apartment were driven by the desire to be able to tell AP that he was making progress towards breaking it off with me, but he never actually did it.

We discussed what he would tell the children. He said he will say that he loves me but he’s not sexually attracted to me. (Here we go again .). Then he realised how utterly ridiculous and inappropriate that was for two young teenage girls. He needs to rethink that one. I’ve made it clear that I don’t in any way support his decision to leave, that there’s no “we” have decided -it’s all him.

Holy cr@p, Pommy. That just shows you how insane his mind is right now. Glad he realized it for himself and you didn't have to say anything. I know some folks will say it is best for the kids to approach them together as a team, but your girls are old enough and I one thousand percent am behind your call here. There is no need for you to solve this one for him, even though I do agree that he should discuss with you anything he wants to say before he says it (obvs) and you can be there with him when he tells them. Honestly... I think letting him wind through this on his own could potentially slow this whole train down a bit. This gets real very quickly when he starts really thinking about the kids and needs to plan out what to say.

I know exactly how you feel, being so angry with him. I *have* done the 2 am waking him up and saying stupid stuff and I inevitably regretted it. (luckily my H was always so tired I don't know how much of what I said he actually retained.) It is OK to be angry. It is not fair what is happening, but it is what it is and you need to decide how you want to deal with it. I think you've been handling yourself with class and strength and you'll keep doing that no matter what. One thing that really has helped me immensely in the last few weeks is that stoicism video that was going around here on someone's post-- for whatever reason, the sports "you control how you play" has been really helpful for me. I listen to it a lot and it has helped me with letting go. So you can't control what he is doing. But you can control you from going into that room at 2 am. You get to choose how you respond to his insanity.

(((Pommy))) you're so strong. you got this.

[oceangrl]

Pommy, I just want you to know I am here with you as well. This totally [censored] and hurts like h3ll and I am sorry. I wish we could all go on a cruise together and laugh and cry. You are not the only one feeling this pain and enduring this horrible process. I went out with my little son tonight and as we were sitting there eating the thought just popped out of the blue and washed all over me again: My husband doesn't want to be married to me anymore. Some moments I feel more confident, others I am just in shock and disbelief that this is my life. I suspect you are going through the same.

Hugs to you. You are doing amazing. You're doing better than you think you are. You are a catch and happiness is on the other side of this. We just have to push through the crazy to get there.

[Pommy99]

I know some folks will say it is best for the kids to approach them together as a team, but your girls are old enough and I one thousand percent am behind your call here. There is no need for you to solve this one for him, even though I do agree that he should discuss with you anything he wants to say before he says it (obvs) and you can be there with him when he tells them. Honestly... I think letting him wind through this on his own could potentially slow this whole train down a bit. This gets real very quickly when he starts really thinking about the kids and needs to plan out what to say.

I do intend for this conversation to take place as a family but I’m not going to write his script for him. I will, however, make sure I understand what he is going to say. This morning he wanted use the concept of ILYB, together with the fact he’s not happy being with me. I have made him think hard about the message he is giving to two teenage girls. I sent him this, from an article written by someone reflecting on their childhood experience of separation:

“This moment, when my family broke apart irreplaceably, became a pivotal point in my future expectations of men and relationships. It doesn’t matter if they love me, they’ll leave because I’m not enough”

I absolutely want him to think about the underlying message of his words and what they will take from it. Of course they have a certain level of maturity, and D15 is just starting to discover romantic relationships of her own. They are not emotionally mature enough, however, to understand the complexities of love and desire, and they still have a deep need for emotional and physical security at this transitional age. Their world will be rocked anyway, and my concern is how they interpret his reasons for leaving a M.

And whilst I somewhat agree that it is important to put one’s own happiness first, and that this is a value I would want them to live by, there are consequences of doing so, and I am struggling with the fact when it comes to children, you don’t just walk out. They have emotional needs too. That’s what you sign up to when you have children.

But then I think, what am I asking for here? To keep an unhappy H here with us? What is the point of that? Neither of us want the sitch to continue as is, so what other options are there?

[Pommy99]

Wooba, Cardinal, thanks for your words of encouragement. I lie in bed with tears rolling down my cheeks when I read your posts. Thank you for keeping me strong about not going to him in the night.

Wayfarer, it feels like it’s over. The way he talks about the future, the way he talks about the past. I haven’t been so strong this morning, as I’ve put a little pressure on him asking if he really is doing the right thing. He’s a mess right now. As May said, the reality of breaking this to the kids is tearing him apart. It might slow things down but it won’t change the outcome.

Oceangirl, May, I know you are also in a similar and equally as bad a place as me (I guess we all are). Thank you for your support. You are also doing better than you think in this crazy crazy sitch.

It means so much to be able to share this with you guys and to have you comforting me and keeping me strong in return.

[dillydaf]

Pommy: my H left 18 months ago. Weirdly, we never did talk to the kids about it, I was too distraught and trying to stay strong for the kids to discuss the situation or him. Since then we have not discussed H much, other than me revealing to them how his mum abandoned him and his sister when they were teens and having lots of affairs. They have connected the dots.

That said, both my kids are happier since H left. I think maybe they miss him a bit (they only see him once a week for about an hour, but then they barely saw him before he left). For years H was angry, shouted a lot, went to bed at 9pm and left at 6am and was usually too tired to do anything at the weekends and shut himself away watching sport or doing his own thing. He was miserable to live with, and I think the kids have benefited from him leaving and not having to walk on eggshells all the time. They also don't have to watch him being horrible to me, as he was intermittently for years. Yes, the reason he was horrible to me was because of his own unhappiness, but I still tolerated his behaviour and that was not a great R model for them. If H and I ever start D proceedings, I will be more open with the kids. For now, I simply do not really know what to say, other than to tell them frequently that I love them, and to show them with my actions that I am making my life my own. The other day I wandered upstairs singing a song and ds1 said 'stop being so HAPPY!' and that made me smile, to know how far I have come in the last year and a half. Separation was an utter shock to me, H dropped a total bomb on me, but in a way it has been easier than living with someone miserable. You will survive, your kids will survive. This situation is horrible but as one of the stickys up there says, it won't kill you.

[wayfarer]

Wayfarer, it feels like it’s over. The way he talks about the future, the way he talks about the past. I haven’t been so strong this morning, as I’ve put a little pressure on him asking if he really is doing the right thing. He’s a mess right now. As May said, the reality of breaking this to the kids is tearing him apart. It might slow things down but it won’t change the outcome.

It means so much to be able to share this with you guys and to have you comforting me and keeping me strong in return.

This part is over. This he's in your home but isn't in your marriage part is over. You can't trust literally anything he's saying to you about how he sees the future or your past. FFS he was ready to tell your teenage girls their mother isn't as bangable as she used to be in his eyes and that's a good enough reason to get a divorce. Those are not the words of a grown a$$ man who has any idea of the difference between his head and his arse. In his head this is the beginning of the end. But you and I know the beginning of the end happened a long time ago. You can't let his skewed reality directly effect yours. If you wanna mourn what's going on right now I won't stop you. You should. This is a hot mess. I'd be tearful and angry. If you think this is your line in the sand and you're ready to throw in the towel on this whole mess I fully support that. You know your end, and your limits. But, and this is a big but, if you either don't know what you want for an outcome fully yet, or you still want to stand, I don't want you to end up in a hopeless place. That hopeless place is how we lose power in the dynamic. That's when we get desperate and we become the caged animals.

I'm just gonna leave you with a couple of my thoughts on my impending separation. And you can take it or leave it. The reason I'm just so ok with him going is that the power dynamics in our relationship are completely skewed right now. He practically holds all the power and he unfortunately knows that. The only things I have power over are the muffin shop, our bed, and what I'm willing to share with him. Because our space is small and he's decided he can't live a life without me in it even if it's just as his friend even in the case of sharing things I have no ability to properly put up boundaries, or cut off contact, or make him see what he's about to lose. He has to leave to miss me, value me, miss us, see the value in our relationship, or at the very least for me to continue on my journey to remembering who I was and finding her without his influence. I can neither win him back or move on with him looming ever present in my house. He needs to go so we can heal individually, and maybe someday together. I know that isn't going to fix the pain you're going through, and I'm so sorry for that. But I just wanted you to have some food for thought. I'll be thinking about you today ((((pommy))))

[oceangrl]

This part is over. This he's in your home but isn't in your marriage part is over. You can't trust literally anything he's saying to you about how he sees the future or your past. FFS he was ready to tell your teenage girls their mother isn't as bangable as she used to be in his eyes and that's a good enough reason to get a divorce. Those are not the words of a grown a$$ man who has any idea of the difference between his head and his arse.

YES

What kind of person does that? It's not very attractive.

But you girl, are a catch. Look at how strong you are in the middle of all of this.

As far as the telling the kids thing goes (I am dreading that, too), here is a MWD video with her advice on it that I found last night:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ImZwhQKVzo

[AnotherStander]

Pommy, sounds like you handled the conversation with H really well. Keep trying to strike that balance of listening and validating and keeping your emotions out of it.

Regarding telling the girls, I understand you want them to know this isn't your doing but be very, very careful about this. Kids tend to blame themselves even though that makes no sense. What you should stress is that it isn't about them, and that both of you will continue to support them. No matter what happens to the M, that you will both continue to be their loving parents and put them first. Here's the thing about blame- you think it's his fault, he thinks it's your fault. You say he is the one moving out and pushing for D, he says it's because you were a bad wife and neglected him. Who is right? Your kids won't know, it will just confuse and upset them. This is why most states have gone to no-fault D, it's just too hard to sort out who is to blame in these situations.

[Pommy99]

The reason I'm just so ok with him going is that the power dynamics in our relationship are completely skewed right now. He practically holds all the power and he unfortunately knows that. The only things I have power over are the muffin shop, our bed, and what I'm willing to share with him. Because our space is small and he's decided he can't live a life without me in it even if it's just as his friend even in the case of sharing things I have no ability to properly put up boundaries, or cut off contact, or make him see what he's about to lose. He has to leave to miss me, value me, miss us, see the value in our relationship, or at the very least for me to continue on my journey to remembering who I was and finding her without his influence. I can neither win him back or move on with him looming ever present in my house. He needs to go so we can heal individually, and maybe someday together. I know that isn't going to fix the pain you're going through, and I'm so sorry for that. But I just wanted you to have some food for thought.

wayfarer I really needed to read this from someone else because this is what is starting to go round in my head. Not just the bit about what the distance might do for him, but what it will do for ME. I have previously been fearful of him going, that he might not have any regrets, that OW might appear and it’s game over, but now I feel like he HAS to go. We both need to breathe clean air. Neither of us can move forward whilst we’re going round in circles. I need to find my original self too, and introduce her to current self, and then make v3 out of all the good bits!

[Pommy99]

Regarding telling the girls, I understand you want them to know this isn't your doing but be very, very careful about this. Kids tend to blame themselves even though that makes no sense. What you should stress is that it isn't about them, and that both of you will continue to support them. No matter what happens to the M, that you will both continue to be their loving parents and put them first. Here's the thing about blame- you think it's his fault, he thinks it's your fault. You say he is the one moving out and pushing for D, he says it's because you were a bad wife and neglected him. Who is right? Your kids won't know, it will just confuse and upset them. This is why most states have gone to no-fault D, it's just too hard to sort out who is to blame in these situations.

You are so right. It is easy for me to pin this on H, as being his doing. I feel like my conscience is clean because I have been trying for a year. In truth, he checked out of the M because of the unresolved problems, and he can argue that he was the one who took us to MC 2 years ago - he already tried to save us from D back then.

Without doubt the priority will be for them to know they are in no way to blame, and that they are loved deeply by us both. In spite of how I see this as Hs decision right now, I will never ever try and turn them against him, or use them to get back at him.

****

Little update from today....

H has initiated talks with me 3 times. He has been coming to me more and more to talk since I really started to consciously validate. Each convo today has really been around the theme of telling the children, how much his head is in a spin, but also still feeling uncertainty with what he is doing and still questionning why he feels the need to go. He made reference to how stable he feels with me. I didn’t really think about what he meant until sometime later, when I pondered over what on earth was stable about our sitch right now. And then I wondered if he meant that I stabilise him? Is this what being the lighthouse is about? He told me just the other day that I am calming and he likes coming home to that. He seems in more turmoil than ever but somehow he feels stable with me. I could be interpreting this all wrong, I know I shouldn’t be interpreting it at all, but it did make me reflect on the lighthouse story.

H had planned to tell the children tonight, having paid a small deposit for the rental this morning. This avo we went out as a family to an ‘escape room’ and had really good fun. It was actually a REALLY good activity given the sitch because we had to work together as a team, a single unit. One Family. After we had finished he looked ashen. He told me he didn’t know if he could go through with it. I wasn’t sure if he meant telling them, or actually leaving. He meant both. He said he’d had a great time as a family and how much he loved being in my company. The the thought of telling them was making him feel physically sick and he felt like he was about to break down. I suggested maybe he just needed to apply the brakes a little and he agreed.

We went for family dinner, then when we got home I left him alone and came upstairs to the MBR to read. He came looking for me, went and got me a tea, and then asked if I minded if he stayed to talk. He talked some more about how much dread he had felt about telling the kids, having listened to people telling him “oh the kids will be fine”, and the reality of it seeming completely different. He said right now lying on the bed he felt calm, as the pressure had gone. He wanted to freeze time, however, because there was a deadline to submitting some rental forms and he wasn’t sure if he was ready to commit. He mentioned again how he swings wildly from needing to leave, to wondering why he would want to.

What I’m really pleased about is that I feel mostly calm, that actually, I want him to leave, because, going back to Wayfarer’s point, neither of us can see clearly. We need to get outside of ourselves and of each other and look at everything from a bit further afield. He said goodnight and went back to his room. And I wasn’t sad he was leaving. Nothing has changed in our sitch, but I feel a change in how I am dealing with this.