Cross countries separation EU

[sandi2]

Sorry, I did not realize part of my post went through before I made final changes. I missed the time slot to edit, so I will copy & paste my "redo".

Just yesterday to finish what I thought was a great conversation by email she reminded me how on the 4th of Feb we are supposed to confirm the separation agreement in front of the judge. I calmly answered, "thanks for reminding me W, I wish you a nice day". She always brings that statement or attitude that reads "our marriage is dead" in big capital letters.

Until things are determined in the separation, visitation with kids, etc., your emails should only be about scheduling for the children. Having a "great conversation" through email, may need to be placed on hold until later. That's not to say you should not be polite. Your W is too angry. She wants to lash out, and every time you attempt to extend the email into further conversation......it is going to trigger a negative emotion in her. It's as if she is on high alert status.......so you need to keep the emails short and simple.

The relationship between your mother and your wife is not good. I suspect that's why your W doesn't want to give your parents visitation time. The way I see grandparents having visitation time with the children should be figured into the total days of each spouse. In other words, let's just say that your W gets 182 days a year with the children, and you get the same amount of days. Your in-laws ability to see their grandchildren should not come by taking away your allotted time and giving it to them. Their time would come out her 182 days. The same principle would apply for your parents time coming out of your 182 days. It should not be left up to your W as to how often the kids see your parents when it's on your 182 days. Neither spouse should feel that they are sacrificing any of their 182 days, so that the in-laws have visitation time. Next thing you know, everyone wants a piece of the action.....aunts & uncles, next door neighbors...... (JK) When you try to bring the grandparents allotted visitation into the middle of a messy separation......it only muddies the waters. When you have the kids, then you decide who gets to see them, and when it's on her time, she has the same right to choose who sees them. That's the only way to keep things fair, IMHO. Both of you are fighting to have control over how much time everyone has with the kids. This isn't about getting equal time with all the grandparents! Keep it as simple as you can.

You said your mother insulted your W. Did your mother express the insult to your W, or was she expressing it in your presence? If you become upset at your mother b/c she made an insulting comment about your W to you, it's b/c you still love your W. But your mother is not in love with your W. She sees your W hurting her son. The best way to handle this type of thing is to ask your mother to withhold her words b/c it is too upsetting for you. Don't punish your mother for loving her son and experiencing her own type of pain as a bystander in this mess. I'm not suggesting that you sit there and say nothing while your mother rages insults. You can always remove yourself. Do you think your parents would say something bad against your W in front of the kids? If so, then that could be a concern, and you may need to discuss it with your parents.

I will say this with my hurt, I do not try to use my children I just thought if there is a path to R is going to be through family activities and because of that I have put pressure on her with such plans. Again, mistake after mistake.

What I meant when I said I thought you use them.......is that you create an opportunity to talk to your W or spend family activity, b/c of the kids. You pressured her and tried to make her feel she had to do it for the kids. Personally, I see it so much in LBS's that I wonder if they are blind to it.

I know my 180 is going to be showing a happy and polite person when I exchange the kids AND being the first one to say goodbye. I want to ask, since I read yesterday about being surprising. What else can I do to catch her by surprise? what does she not expect? Would it be fine to make an innocent joke about her?

No, I do not recommend that you joke about your W. Her emotions are not in good place, so you making jokes about her......is not a good idea. Give me an example of how you joke about her, maybe I am not getting a clear picture. In the meantime, I suggest that you don't try to get a particular reaction from her. I'm concerned this desire to get a particular response is unconsciously tied to your need to control.

When a couple is experiencing a physical separation and their emotions are all over the place, the best 180 the LBS can do is to let go of applying pressure to the WAS. You see, the WAS senses when the LBS lets go, and therefore, the tension begins to settle. As I said, she is on high alert, and she knows you are trying anything to keep her tied to you. She knows when you are trying to manipulate her feelings. I support you showing a polite person who is in charge of his own emotions, and being the first to say goodbye (as if you have something exciting planed). This brings me to the part of showing happiness. Don't misunderstand and think you are suppose to act like a comedian or clown. For now, just show a positive attitude and it will naturally imply that you contain an inner "happiness" that does not completely rely upon her. Make sense? She may be curious, or not, as to why you suddenly act this way. Again, have no expectations.

The more intense 180's will be the inner work on yourself, b/c you don't like to be unattractive and you want to reclaim the man you once were. 180's can be very private work, which has nothing to do with the MR......other than you now see why you need to change some of your ways......especially in your interrelationships. ((hugs)) At the moment, you want to do all these things with the hope of impressing her to come back to the MR. It takes the LBS a little time before they finally let go of getting some positive reaction from the WAS, and just do the 180 b/c it is great for themselves.

I have not listened to her because I was scared, I was scared to lose her, to end up in D, to bear the pain of seeing her with someone else, to miss the childhood of our baby. I never stopped to say, hey, remember that charming man you have always been? bring him back and be the greener grass. When my W said, I do not want to talk to you, I heard our marriage is over and my instinct was to act as if replying "no, not until I decide it is". I can only give her the best incentive to come back and I know that is only going to happen if I truly listen to her and you all.

We know you are scared. It's only natural to feel all type of emotions when you are losing your family. Currently, you are being honest with yourself and are able to take a hard look at your mistakes.

Since this nightmare began, it has been 3 entire days now that I do not write to her. I never spy on her newly created IG with a new username and I have made a strong decision to not suggest more family plans as in I will be in the park feel free to join. I was reading the chapter about cheese-less tunnels and thinking, my God, this is so me.

That's progress!

I wish my W knew I now have a lot of new tools I am learning from you, I wish she knew I know R is slow, hard and only towards MR 2.0 but it is not my job to tell her. Let's hope one day she will see it. Please keep posting here, you guys are my oxygen. I will do the same, I am taking stage now and I need to monitor if my 180 works. If it doesnt, I will need help with new ideas!

Again, this is not uncommon to want the WAS to see your hard work. The purpose of this board is to support each other and try to pass along something we've learned.