Those sound like great resolutions Alison! I have a list of a few but need to put timescales and more precise steps I have to take. I also seem to have a lot of domestic stuff to get sorted since I put it all on hold while I was busy finishing my work last year. One of them was to do more yoga and I did a yoga and meditation retreat last weekend, it was fantastic. I really struggle with meeting new people though and them asking me about my marital status. Part of me feels like it's a lie to talk about my H as if everything is fine, but part of me feels like it's just socially less awkward to briefly mention him instead of to avoid the subject altogether. I really struggle with this. I realised how little most people talk about their spouses, but then when the question crops up I don't want to discuss the messy situation with essentially strangers, especially as it is a small world and people find things out easily. Ugh.
Ds1 had some great news on uni applications so I'm taking the kids out to celebrate tonight, and out to lunch with H on Sunday (celebrating good news and important milestones was something we were terrible at doing in the past, I'm not sure H is capable of celebrating anything really but I am determined to celebrate everything I can from now on, breaking the habit of both my family and his). I'm so proud of ds1!
H is trying to connect more with both kids, he is planning to take ds2 away in the summer and has asked ds1 to visit him this weekend. I struggle with him wanting to spend time with the kids but not with me (this was a big feature of our marriage, and I was never jealous before, but now I look back and realise how long he has been rejecting me for, literally years and years). But it's good that he has the capacity to want to see the kids, not sure he has been in that place for a few months now. He's still working insane hours and goodness only knows how much he is harming himself in doing so, but that is his decision to do it. I feel compassion but also anger because it's all self inflicted, I'm sure many LBSes here feel the same! He is not the worst MLCer, he is financially responsible and does see the kids a bit, but being a workaholic is not much better than being an alcoholic is it? Being both, ugh, there must be so much pain underneath.
I have been seeing friends, going to the cinema, going to my art classes (love these so much) and working a little bit and doing job applications and career planning stuff. Plenty of GAL going on here! I have no idea what the future holds but at some stage I will make peace with the idea of D. I read some of the MLC threads and realise that if H ever wakes up it might be years, and I'm not sure I want to be alone that long. I decided though that I won't venture into online dating until D is more certain, it has been nearly 18 months since BD but looking on here makes me realise that is a pretty short time even if it doesn't feel like it to me! This standing business is not for the faint hearted is it? I have faith in the future being pretty bright though, no matter whether I end up with H again or with someone better. It wouldn't be hard, frankly, he was a piss poor H for a good chunk of our M, if only he hadn't gone through that stage of actually being NICE to me and showing me love for the first time in years instead of being shouty and critical and just plain vile, then D would have been a LOT easier. I still wonder over that time, was he having an A then and being nice because of guilt? Was he having lots of As for years on end and I was ignorant all that time? Who knows, I probably never will. But knowing he is capable of behaving well and thinking that things were finally turning around only to have the bomb dropped, that was one of the hardest things of all. Anyway, nothing I can do about any of this. All I can do is live my life and enjoy it and laugh and exercise and be creative and make a difference in the world. Put like that, it sounds like a lot!
I really struggle with meeting new people though and them asking me about my marital status. Part of me feels like it's a lie to talk about my H as if everything is fine, but part of me feels like it's just socially less awkward to briefly mention him instead of to avoid the subject altogether. I really struggle with this. I realised how little most people talk about their spouses, but then when the question crops up I don't want to discuss the messy situation with essentially strangers, especially as it is a small world and people find things out easily. Ugh.
Hi dillydaf - I'm not up on all your sit but I wanted to stop in and say that I really relate to this right now. It throws me for a loop and I usually wind up awkwardly muttering something about separated but in the same house. It's so weird.
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...it has been nearly 18 months since BD but looking on here makes me realise that is a pretty short time even if it doesn't feel like it to me! This standing business is not for the faint hearted is it?...
I am also here right now. And I feel the same way. Standing is a difficult thing to do, isn't it? It's not waiting, and it's not giving up, and it's not moving on. It's occasionally looking backward to see if the WAS is taking baby steps forward, with the full understanding and awareness that they may never do so.
It is mentally exhausting - I think that is why GAL is so important to the LBS.
Anyway - thank you for writing that. I was beginning to think myself a fool for feeling the way I do and standing as long as I have. It's nice to know there are still others out there in the same boat.
You sound like you're doing all the right things, Dilly - and that's so exciting about uni offers for your eldest. What an exciting time for him, and what a time of transition for the whole family too. How do you feel about the prospect of him leaving home? Does he hope to study far away from home?
It sounds like with this space and self care and focus on your GAL (after the busy work period) you're getting some time for reflection about how the marriage really was. That this neglect of you and your needs and consideration for what is important to you isn't just a feature of things between you just prior to BD, but it has actually been that way for years. Perhaps it's even a feature of who he is as a person - hardwired into him - rather than anything to do with the dynamic between you? He could connect with the kids - or at least try (especially when they were younger) but wasn't ever seeking or even desiring closeness and connection and mutuality with you. Is that what you mean?
I hope you're not alone for a long time either, unless you want to be. From your posts on here you sound like a sensitive, curious, lively person. Someone with lots of interest in the world and in other people, open to new ideas, interested in developing herself and in being a good influence on other people. So much to offer! I guess as soon as you work out why you would be so attached to someone who doesn't seem to be able to give much to someone else I think you will be on your way. It will happen in its own time. (The situation is a little bit different with my H, I know, but I still need to do that work for myself now: to figure out why I would have tolerated and enabled such poor behaviour from him for so long - it's a piece of growing work I want to do even if - right now - those behaviours aren't really featuring).
I'm glad you're making a big deal of it. Kids should know they (and the things happening in their lives) matter to their parents - and uni is a big deal. Not to be a downer, but have their been discussions on how uni will be financed?
Originally Posted by DillyDaf
H is trying to connect more with both kids, he is planning to take ds2 away in the summer and has asked ds1 to visit him this weekend. I struggle with him wanting to spend time with the kids but not with me
I get this. Those flashes of jealousy were hard to overcome. My H even started showing more affection to our dog. What made it worse was the jealousy was always accompanied by guilt and shame for being so ridiculous. All those emotions rolled together, honestly, sometimes I would shut down and just have to leave the room (as he cast me a dirty look or said something like 'why do you always look miserable'). He 180'd - it took me a long time to NOT resent him for this. But it wasn't about me. He 180'd for him. And Dilly, it took a long time for me to get to that point, give yourself a break. It's OK to feel the way you do.
Originally Posted by DillyDaf
He is not the worst MLCer, he is financially responsible and does see the kids a bit ...
I honestly think there are two types of MLCers and the differences are most evident when there are kids involved. Some completely go off the rails running off into the sunset like the last 10-20 years never happened. Wash their hands of it entirely and resent any attempt to be reminded that the 10-20 years did happen. These are the monsters - the ones who fight tooth and nail for every penny, who resent having to spend time with their kids, or contribute to their children's upbringing. Mine is not a monster. Neither is yours. Unfortunately they are only human, and humans still f**k up. And the compassion you feel is a good thing. That is what loving detachment means. To know and understand his pain, but not feel responsible for causing it, or for fixing it.
The GAL sounds fantastic and I am more than a little jealous. I have been wanting to go on a weekend yoga retreat forever, but my childcare schedule isn't particularly conducive to weekends away. Date when you are ready. There is no fixed timeline. I will say do it for the right reasons - not out of loneliness, or sadness or boredom, and definitely not as a means to 'move on'.
Well I'm glad I'm not the only one suffering from jealousy and then guilt over the jealousy! I think it's just seeing that they are capable of reaching out and showing love, but refuse to do so with you, that's the source for me. Anyway, ds1 will be fine financially, it's all very exciting. Ds2 might struggle most with ds1 leaving home, but luckily it's not too far so they can see each other still, they have a beautiful bond so I think they will remain close.
Last weekend H said he was coming home to do his sport so I expected him at 10. He turned up at 11.30 and I had already gone out to run some errands, I was annoyed that he hadn't bothered letting me know he would be late. Such a lack of respect or consideration. I probably responded passive-aggressively, and H in turn got annoyed with me and said he wasn't feeling well and couldn't handle me being angry with him. I did not deal with this very well, I'm sick of him expecting me to wait about for his crumbs which are getting even fewer with his 2 jobs and health problems. I feel like a doormat (IW I'm glad not to be alone, this standing is more a process of standing, walking away, giving up, then circling back and standing again, I veer between compassion and anger, though mostly those are lessening over time). H did try to repair a bit before he left by asking about some stuff I'm doing, I didn't really respond.
In the evening I went to the pub and started playing pool with a bunch of regulars there. I got chatting with a smoking hot chap and he was seriously chatting me up. Not only was he smoking hot but he was 15 years younger! Oh my. That is good for a perimenopausal woman's ego, let me tell you He admired my lovely new dress (didn't even cross H's mind I think) and we had a good old flirt, left each other with a hug but I restrained myself from anything more even though I was drunk and very tempted. I might never see him again, if I do I should be honest about my sitch.
I went to see a careers counsellor about my next steps. We came up with some ideas which will require a lot of determination and hustling, but starting my own business will allow me the flexibility I need as a single mum as well as fulfilling my needs to make use of my skills and knowledge and contribute to making people's lives better. It's daunting but I am a determined person I've also had a nice week doing my art, I was literally smiling all the way through my classes puzzling through different ways of doing things.
I pondered over last weekend and feel the need to be more assertive with H. Avoiding him is not a great option, we have things to discuss about kids and houses etc and we do that better in person. So I texted him and said I'm doing a race this weekend and he is welcome to join me but otherwise if he wants to see me he can suggest something else. The ball is in his court. If he doesn't then fine, I just keep doing my thing. So far there have been very few times when I have suggested meeting up when he has refused, he usually suggests an alternative. But I'm sick of doing the running. If he is feeling too sick and overwhelmed with work to meet me then I don't want to see him. I have not really enjoyed seeing him lately anyway, he has been fairly miserable and has complained and been short tempered. Not his best self by a long chalk but that is his choice. And I deserve the best
Dilly, your social life sounds thrilling. Mine mainly involves workplace lunches, evening dinners with female friends, a few cinema trips with Eldest and some new friends I say hello to while dog walking. I don't want any interest from men (not that I wouldn't enjoy an ego boost!) but even if I did, I've had no exciting experiences like that!! You go!
I guess to be helpful to you, I just wanted to offer some feedback on this:
Originally Posted by dillydaf
I pondered over last weekend and feel the need to be more assertive with H. Avoiding him is not a great option, we have things to discuss about kids and houses etc and we do that better in person. So I texted him and said I'm doing a race this weekend and he is welcome to join me but otherwise if he wants to see me he can suggest something else.
I am not sure you're being entirely honest with yourself here. I am not sure that running a race together is the best time or place or most productive circumstance for discussing the house and the kids. Better to do that via email, or a short phone call if needed? The text you sent sounds passive aggressive rather than assertive. He already knows if he wants to see you he can suggest something - he seems to avoid you rather than make any indication he wants to see you - and letting him know about the race felt more like pursuit to me.
Are there practical things you absolutely have to sort out with him? Or really, in your heart of hearts, are you just not willing to go no contact with him yet?
Thanks Alison, actually we talk best when out walking so a race would have worked and also been something fun to do together (it's not a proper race but a run-walking one), we've not done anything fun in a long time so that is why I suggested it. Anyway, he said he was not well enough to do that and asked when I would be back. I said that Saturday would work better for me and he rearranged things to come over yesterday and we took ds2 for his activity and went for a walk during that. He clearly wasn't feeling great because he kept asking me to stop walking fast, for decades he has been a much faster walker than me and I always struggled to keep up. Very strange. His health problems are partly sorted but he still has some symptoms which he is getting investigated. Personally I think these symptoms might be psychological rather than purely physical (you can't really separate them, I know). H looked pale (he usually has a year round tan) and generally unhealthy. He complained incessantly about work, his health, you name it he complained about it. I did communicate the things I needed to about domestic stuff so he is in the loop, definitely better done in person than via phone or text. I validated his many complaints whilst internally rolling my eyes and sighing, he is such a victim right now. Still, if he feels terrible and has to work an 80 hour week no wonder he is complaining and has no room for anyone or anything else in his life. He has a lot of work politics right now and is (probably rightly) paranoid and untrusting of his colleagues. Hey ho. I think I might be his only confidante about work stuff right now, I assume that is the main reason he sees me. I used to offer alternative ways of seeing things, but now I just support and validate, he needs someone on his side. This work stuff also affects our finances, so it is much better to be in the loop than out of it from that perspective.
I did not enjoy seeing him, he was a bit of an emotional black hole. After seeing him I felt quite depressed that he is so pathetic. I also despised him a bit, I don't like him very much right now. Ding right now would be stupid though financially, so I will stay in limbo a while longer, I don't want to disrupt things before ds1's final exams in June either. I don't really hold out much hope for R, I can see him staying in this pity party for a long time, and nowhere in this is he taking any responsibility for anything in his life. There is nothing I can do about that, and I no longer feel like that is the worst thing ever. I realised that for a long time he held me responsible for his feelings (still does?) and I might have done the same to some extent, but I no longer do that. Some degree of detachment. I feel a bit like I'm keeping him as plan B...
This career transitional stage is hard for me, and I am feeling daunted so I am going to spend today making some lists of next steps and researching where to start. I did not share any of this with H. He did ask if I was job hunting and I said not right now, and he asked about the tiny bit I need to do to wrap up my last project and I told him, but I don't feel safe sharing the other stuff with him yet. I also told him that I do not plan on getting a full time office-based job any time soon because our kids need me. I don't really get what the sub-text to his question about me job-hunting was. Is this a D-based question? Or is it his fear of me abandoning the kids like he was abandoned? I don't know and not sure I can be bothered thinking about it. When I take ds1 travelling for a few weeks in the summer H says he is going to have to arrange to spend extra time with ds2, he keeps badgering me for dates so I think the abandonment thing is a contender. I'm not sure how I feel about him spending lots of time here, but ds2 will still be at school so it is unavoidable.
I have lots of lovely things lined up for next week so I'm looking forward to it
I did not enjoy seeing him, he was a bit of an emotional black hole. After seeing him I felt quite depressed that he is so pathetic. I also despised him a bit, I don't like him very much right now. Ding right now would be stupid though financially, so I will stay in limbo a while longer, I don't want to disrupt things before ds1's final exams in June either. I don't really hold out much hope for R, I can see him staying in this pity party for a long time, and nowhere in this is he taking any responsibility for anything in his life. There is nothing I can do about that, and I no longer feel like that is the worst thing ever. I realised that for a long time he held me responsible for his feelings (still does?) and I might have done the same to some extent, but I no longer do that. Some degree of detachment. I feel a bit like I'm keeping him as plan B...
I can empathise so much with this, Dilly. My H is not as bad as he was and nowhere near as sick, depressed and miserable as your H is - but the dynamic is very similar: the constant moaning about self-inflicted problems, the holding of other's responsible, the selfishness. It isn't constant, but it is there and I am reacting to it just as you are: being validating when I can while inwardly rolling my eyes. It isn't nice and I am sure he can sense it.
When you said 'I'm keeping him as plan B' it really hit me hard. I think that's what I am doing to my H too. I didn't think of it that way before - but you're right. I need to think on this.
I hope you have a happy weekend. I'm about to get out in the rain for some outdoors time with Youngest and Dog.
I suppose that's why validation is so essential, so you can empathise a bit, not just roll your eyes inwardly but understand that there is some deep reason behind them feeling so pathetic and victimised. Goodness knows feeling like a victim has been my main struggle in this whole time, especially as I see my mum has always done that.
I'm having a hard day today, feeling overwhelmed by everything I should do, all the hustling I need to do for career stuff, all the domestic things which feel never-ending. I really want to confide all this to H, but I cannot trust him and do not feel safe with him, and he obviously does not feel safe with me (or himself, probably and most importantly). I feel lonely and unloved and it is just so very hard right now.
Maybe I should go back to IC? A different, more solution focused one. I will do so if I continue to struggle. In the meantime I will make myself a plan, do some exercise, tick some things off my many lists and do a yoga video.
At least spring is slowly approaching, it always lifts the spirits to see the spring bulbs starting to stir
OK so yesterday was a low but I bounced back. I need to remember that the low days usually involve not exercising as much as I need (daily) and not seeing my friends as often as I need (at least one friend meeting a week preferably two on top of my art classes). I texted H and said I was going to our other house this weekend and he rang me and we chatted briefly. Then this morning he texted me asking when I would be back on Sunday and I said quite late (I don't particularly wish to see him at the moment). Then he just texted me saying he was coming back on Saturday as well (in order to see me? I have no idea, it's very, very unusual for him to see the kids twice at the weekend though, in fact I can't remember him visiting home twice at the weekend since BD). Anyway, it's interesting, he temp checked me last night about something to do with ds1 too but it wasn't a question so I did not answer. At some point if I keep pulling away I'm expecting him to threaten D again, that's been the usual pattern I really can't be bothered any more, if he wants me he needs to give me more than crumbs. When I see him he feels comfortable burping and farting in front of me with not so much as an excuse me. This is ok in a close and intimate M but it is not ok in this sitch, talk about the ultimate lack of respect. Every time I feel like contacting him I remind myself that if I can attract a smoking hot guy 15 years younger then I am worth chasing and chasing hard. I am a prize (I knew that already but it's good to have objective feedback too, lol)
I have some really great GAL things this week: running with friends, pub visits, cinema trips, meals out and more art. I'm thinking about setting myself up with a little art studio in the office in the garden. This makes me smile a lot every time I think about it: I can get to work making stuff whenever I like!
Anyway, I better get back to my hustling! Some of the GAL will also involve tapping my friends' networks and skills so it's work plus play
He admired my lovely new dress (didn't even cross H's mind I think) and we had a good old flirt, left each other with a hug but I restrained myself from anything more even though I was drunk and very tempted. I might never see him again, if I do I should be honest about my sitch.