I too, dealt with lying towards the end of my M. I HATED it and would go absolutely ballistic when I disocvered H in a lie! It was usually about stupid things too!
Now I look back and think..."poor thing, no wonder he lied...who wants to deal with my wrath??"! LOL!
He had conflict avoidance behaviors and I had crazy making behaviors, just like the rest of you! Thanks for helping me see things so clearly...it really is a pattern.
I know others have noticed H's lying and I feel almost sorry for him, becuase I don't think his words are valued by others. I now know that is a lesson he has to learn for himself ~ it is not a lesson that I or anyone else, can teach him!
I also feel I have been set free. Our D is almost final and I no longer have to worry about discerning lies from truth. I do wish I knew WHY he lies. I'm not sure he even knows he is doing it anymore!
UD ~ I LOVE the 24 hour rule ~ it works well for work situations too!
Happy Mother's Day to all!!!
Happiness is like a butterfly: the more you chase it, the more it will elude you, but if you turn your attention to other things, it will come and sit softly on your shoulder.... (thoreau)
Myrrh--I'm really glad you had a good C session yesterday!
Pam, Sun and all--yes, thought provoking stuff is good for us! But I have a headache from thinking about all this stuff.
I left my letter to Mr. Wonderful (in an envelope) on the bed in the motor home. He will be gone until late Monday night. He looked awfully happy about things... the motor home was stocked and he had his fishing pole. Now I just gave him something to read and think about.
Meredith--I realize that I never answered your question (am I worried about him being off in it alone?). The answer is no. He's always had a "loner" streak, and his seemingly incessant need for time along used to be a source of resentment for me. That is no longer true.
While D7 is being a real little sh!thead today and I wish I could send her off to live with the gypsies, I'm glad that he's out of here and I'm at home with my little ones.
D10 made a fabulous dinner tonight, so all is well in this part of the ocean.
Time to clean up the kitchen, finish laundry and get some really dirty girls in the tub.
Betsey
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
I wanted to respond to your query to me on H2H's thread. (And you didn't upset me - I don't know that I want to hear that yet - but it didn't upset me).
Anyway - you asked if I thought it possible that maybe this sitch is God/karma way of getting us out of a sitch that isn't right for us. That maybe our S has changed so much (values/beliefs etc.) that we wouldn't want to be with them in the end. {I'm paraphrasing here very poorly - my writing skills are not as well developed as yours}
Anyway - I do believe that is true! In fact when P decided that she wanted the chance to "explore" this new R with the OW instead of "working things out" with me. She said that she needed to work on herself and maybe I wouldn't even like her when she was done. I see how it might be possible that she comes out so changed that I won't care to be with her anymore once it's done. I'm having a hard time imagining that being possible - but theoretically I understand.
However, if that's the case - why are we DBin? Why not just "move on" as all of our friends suggest. And as they tell me - if it's meant to be it will come back to you in the end. Now that's really leaving it up to karma/fate/god. But isn't it our duty to do everything possible in our power to save this R? I guess I'm confused about the difference!
Quote: However, if that's the case - why are we DBin?
i go back to - what is the reason your db'n in the first place? is it to when your mate back or is it to become a better person within yourself? michelle never tells us that if we db we get our mates back, remember, we cannot control what our mates do. she suggests that if we change certain behaivors then there is a good chance that our mates will see these changes, be intrigued by them, and eventually turn back to us. but the changes have to be real
that is all...just wanted to butt into this conversation for a moment
and btw - i have been enjoying this whole discussion on the lying thing ... just another thing i have learned about my interactions with my hubby - thanks
Quote: is it to when your mate back or is it to become a better person within yourself? michelle never tells us that if we db we get our mates back, remember, we cannot control what our mates do.
Dbing didn't necessarily "save" my M but it did save my sanity!! I have definitely learned that the only behavior I can control is MY OWN!!!!
I am so much better off with myself and with my interactions with STXH thanks to Dbing! The idea of detaching is worth its weight in gold!!
Happiness is like a butterfly: the more you chase it, the more it will elude you, but if you turn your attention to other things, it will come and sit softly on your shoulder.... (thoreau)
I had a pretty significant insite that I just could not wait to share with y'all.
I've been mulling over the various conversations we've been having on this thread.
One thing that I've been focusing on is the conversation about namecalling the OP. And how the OP is merely a symptom, not the cause. I explained this to Husband and he agreed and understood. Including the bit about if it hadn't been that particular OP it would have been a different OP. But that there would still have been an OP because the spouse was looking for something outside the marriage that he should have been seeking from the marriage.
Well, yesterday, Husband and I had a talk about his friendship with Amanda. In that conversation, I rehashed all the things/incidents that had happened.
And for the first time, he told me that he could see how things looked to me, and why I would come to the conclusions I had. And he told me that if the situation were reversed, he'd have been distressed/angry too. That he could understand that even though he wasn't cheating on me, that it LOOKED like he was...to me.
For the first time, I felt understood...and sane!
He apologized and told me that he 'just didn't know how to handle things.'
When he said that it soothed some wound inside me.
I thought about it more as the day progressed.
And I realized.
I really wasn't angry with Amanda. I was angry with him.
Yet, I didn't feel safe being angry with him...so I was projecting my anger onto her.
And I realized that by doing that, I was withholding forgiveness.
On the one hand I had told him that I forgave him EVERYTHING. On the other hand...I was telling him that I couldn't trust Amanda because of all these things she had done..and that she had never given me any reason to trust her.
And it hit me. I was being hypocritical.
Since I was really angry with him, but disguising it as anger towards her...the message I was sending to both of us, was that I hadn't forgiven him.
I told Husband this morning that I was so sorry. That I realized I was being hypocritical. And that I felt something heal inside when he said, (in pain and sorrow) "I just didn't know how to handle the situation."
I told him I had really needed to hear that from him...and didn't realize I needed to hear it.
And that when he told me that, I realized that all this time, I hadn't been angry with her, only him.
I told him that on some level he must have realized that I was still angry at him...even though I had told him that I wasn't and that I forgave him.
He said, "Oh, I knew on EVERY level that you were still angry with me."
I blushed, apologized and said, "I hadn't realized it."
I hope this is making sense to y'all. I don't think I'm expressing it very well...but this was a huge insight for me.
And I told Husband that way early in our relationship I had set him up on a pedestal. It never occured to me that he didn't know how to handle a situation.
And that was unfair of me.
The big insight was that I was angry with him. But I didn't have that insight until his words healed that wound inside of me. And I started pondering why him saying, "I just didn't know how to handle the situation" had such a huge impact on me. And that's when I worked my way backwards and realized that if some wound was healed by those words..then I HAD a wound that needed to be healed...and then I realized finally what that wound was.
Isn't it strange that this whole time I thought I was angry with her...when I was angry with him...and I never realized it?
Right now I have enough anger for the both my husband and his brazen hussy.
Yes I'm angry at my husband.And my anger at him is stronger for him than it is for her.
But this anger I have at this woman isn't the same kind I have for my husband.
I'm angry at her for ever putting her slimey hands on my huusband.How the hell dare that nasty hoe touch MY husband.
Woman are not suppose to betray woman like that.It violates a code of ethics that you don't betray a sister like that.
I know woman have been doing it for years but it is still wrong.
Don't get me wrong I'm not siting around wallowing in my anger.
However if I were to ever lay eyes on her I will be bringing the redneck in me out just for her.
I think that if I were to get to have revenge I could let go of the anger. I don't mean I want to ruin her life but if Karma ever gets her I will be on the curb laughing my @ss off.
I have gotten off the curb and I'm moving on.
Later Friend. Briget
The grass is always greener over the septic tank... Erma Bombeck
Treat hate with Love... DR. Martin Luther King
Isn't anger an odd thing? You just need time and purpose to explore the why's of things. Funny thing here... I didn't see myself as angry until I began this journey.
My hairstylist told me Friday night that she can't remember the last time she thought I looked really happy... and she didn't even realize it until I walked in on Friday and she understood how happy I am.
So that DOES make sense.
Briget, I'm not gonna beat you up, darlin'. You have every right to that anger, and to express it. It has to come out some way or another, and I think maybe you're finally getting there. I'm glad you feel comfortable sharing it with us.
After a long day of planting flowers, I've decided not to cook. I'm ordering the girls pizza! So I'm outta here... at least until tomorrow.
Betsey
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
I totally understand! And, I'm so happy for you!!! I remember so many times reading that the OW is a symptom, and honestly, it went in one ear and out the other. Then, one night, I just "got it." It was such a relief too. I apologized to my H and told him how sorry I was for all the anger. And now, I am to a point where the past is the past and I don't get all crazy thinking about it.
I'm so happy for you, I really am. I know what a burden you've been carrying.
Myrrh, we're here when you're ready to start talking. I know that Betsey and Meredith and I all have had different experiences, so if there is any way I can be of help to you, please ask. Betsey has my e-mail address.
I have definitely learned that the only behavior I can control is MY OWN!!!!