Meeting over. We spent about 1 hr 15 min there. We each had 1 beer. He was sitting at the bar when I arrived. I asked to be moved to a booth for privacy. He then looked worried. There is way too much that occurred to include here, but I’ll pick the bits I remember more specifics on.
So, this is what I read to him:
H - When I asked you to move out, I was hoping time and space would allow you to find yourself, and figure out how you want the rest of your life to look. I still stand by that, and understand that it is a difficult process and may not be anywhere near complete. Only you can decide that. I believed that I was giving you a gift. A gift of time and space to find yourself.
Although we are not living together, we are still married. You are still my husband, and I am your wife. We have 28 years of marriage, and 2 wonderful kids. I felt it was time for me to be true, authentic, and honest with you about our situation.
You are bringing your girlfriend to meet your mother. I can only assume you will also be seeing your cousins. I would like to know why you think this is the right thing to do. Because to me, it’s insanity. We are still married. I have loved your family like my own, and to me this is the epitome of disrespect. And I don’t think I deserve that. Our kids don’t deserve that. I have given you your time to start the process of figuring out your life, but I am not o.k. with your choice to ignore our vows, the fact that we are still married, and openly have a relationship with (OW). I can’t imagine anyone thinking this is o.k., including you and (OW).
Then I said ‘I’d like to hear what you have to say about that”.
True to the MLCr’s M.O., he tried to blame and OW, had excuses. He said “it’s not what you think”. He tried to explain that he wasn’t bringing her specifically to “meet his mom”. That she pressured him into him agreeing to go, and he caved. I called bull on that, that he could easily go himself and just tell her “no”. I told him I see his mom as my own, and I wanted him to know it’s like a nail in my heart that he would bring her to his mother’s home. There was a lot more back and forth over this. It got heated at first, but we both calmed down rather quickly.
I then made the mistake of saying that “I also understand you will be getting a new apartment. I’d like to know your plans for that, and whether she is moving in too.” This was too much after our lengthy discussion of him and OW. He blew up, and demanded to know where I was getting my information. I think he thought OW was feeding it to me. I was truthful, and told him. He said OW was looking for places, but he hasn’t agreed or participated. Hmmm. Don’t believe that. Maybe, maybe not. I have evidence to the contrary possibly. A hard check on his credit. We’ll see. I told him that every decision he’s making is moving towards her, and not his family, and maybe it’s time for the kids to know what’s going on, that he is establishing his own life apart from me. That their limbo isn’t fair. He thinks that it is none of their business and they are mainly at school anyway and it doesn’t affect them. I disagreed, and I told him that if he proceeds to live with her, they will be told. He’s not happy about it, I assure you. He doesn’t want to see that they are hurt, because he knows he’s the source.
In between all this, he broke down several times. He was really trying to control the tears. He is in such a dark, dark place, and I know he doesn’t know how to find his way out. I could feel his despair and turmoil very acutely. He mentioned disappearing, death, etc. I just listened. I wonder if rock bottom is near. I think he’s been hovering over it for a very long time. He expressed in general terms all the terrible things he’s done. We talked about choices pushing us to our destiny (he had posted something on FB related to this a few days ago). I asked him to think about what destiny he wanted, and that I had hoped he could find one small step he can make towards that. He listened.
He has such blinders on for our marriage. Typical MLCr stuff. The one and only thing he could say ”bad” about our marriage (and he’s said it many, many times before) was that “I never desired him. I believe this was in the context of why I would want to be married to him (I never said in the convo I did or didn't), and I’m happier without him and it was “obvious” I never had desire for him. I told him I was sorry he believed that for so many years. Not true, but in his mind, he believes it strongly. I asked him if he remembered any time when it was very evident I did desired him. He said no. I reminded him of a time about 9 years ago when we made a big effort to put all our energy into each other, and reminded him how he knew I was turned on. I also told him that for much of our married life, I got nothing from his to feed that desire. He actually agreed. He told me that he has thought a lot about how he failed in so many ways as a husband that wasn’t fair to me. That he knows he was a terrible husband to me. . For most of our marriage I told him I appreciated him saying that.
He also made a very declarative statement “I’m depressed. Clinically depressed”. He has done nothing to start the healing process in that regard though. He shared that he doesn’t have a single friend, and said he sees how all our friends have rallied with me and ignored him. I did not fall into the guilt trap. I refuse, because I know it’s not my fault. I reminded him our best friend reached out to him, but he only said “thanks” and never reached out back. His choices. He said he sees how happy I am, much happier without him. I shared a little bit about my journey these past 10 months, and how I found my inner happiness (and gave a few examples). I shared that I hoped the same for him, whether his journey included me or not.
He told me he loved me, that he always loved me and still does. I told him I loved him too. We held hands across the table. He said he was feeling so much pressure from himself, OW, everyone. That he was happiest when he was alone. I asked about what pressure he had from me. He made a comment about every time he comes over, I bring up something. I heard that loud and clear, and will make sure I adhere to that DBing principal going forward.
This is his journey, and he seemed to really take in at least a some of what we talked about. It’s a lot to process.
I don’t know, nor will I ask, if anything I said will change his plans. My intent for the meeting was not to throw down the gauntlet. And I didn't. It was for being real, expressing to H that his behavior is not o.k. with me. Towards the end I even said “OW’s H is having an affair, she’s having an affair with you, you’re having an affair, and OW and her H still live together and have no plans for D (because she needs the health insurance, apparently). That’s insanity! Really f’d up!” He said “yes it is”.
One thing very clear to me, though. OW definitely is not his key to happiness. He knows it too. Perhaps the seed to understanding that only he holds that key was planted. Only time will tell. Time will also tell whether he can overcome his fear of turning the key to unlock what’s inside. To face it.
If he gets a place with OW, I may pursue more formal separation arrangements. I need to process this first. Time, time, time. I am going to pay very close attention to our finances, too, in spite of his promises that he will “always take care of me and the kids”.
But, I feel a heavy burden lifted from my shoulder’s and soul.
These are the things I learned yesterday:
1. My fear of addressing difficult issues is now gone. That is a burden lifted, and a 180 for me. 2. H is in the depths of despair. He is lonely, miserable, and profoundly depressed. He may be hitting rock bottom. 3. H has a clear understanding that I do not believe his behavior with OW is o.k. (I believe he thought that my saying nothing and H seeing how happy I am said to him it was o.k. because I was getting on with my life). It’s lifted a burden from me now that I actually said it to him. 4. H knows my compassion for his turmoil. Maybe this is the seed for him to realize he really is not 100% alone. 5. I am in a good place. I’ve accepted that H is still on his own journey. I will continue mine. 6. I still have enough love and compassion for him to help H on his journey if he chooses to ask for it. He knows that I’m here even if the journey does not bring R. He knows I want him in a better place for himself. 7. H has made some progress. I don’t believe he recognizes it as such, but to be I think it’s very important. He realizes and is proud of the fact that he can take care of himself (i.e. cook, shop, do laundry, etc). Basics. He realizes, and admitted out loud, he is clinically depressed. He realizes how awful he was to me throughout most of our marriage, and admits he was a terrible husband. He has shown remorse to me for this.
About 1 hour after our meeting, he sent me an email: “Not an easy conversation to have, but I appreciate your honesty.”
This morning, he took the kids to breakfast. I saw him. We spoke for a while. Chit chat and a bit about the kids. He told me that he had a good conversation with the kids, that they are adults, and he wants them to not just look at him as “dad”, but as an adult man that makes mistakes and has flaws just like everyone else. That he sees them as adults, and that he (and I) are stepping back for them to make their own decisions. He seemed very pleased about it as he said they were receptive. There was no talk about his crisis or OW, however. And for now, I don’t think I will speak to the kids about it.
Time will bring answers.
I am holding the Lord’s hand, and letting Him show me the path as my journey continues.
