This isn't really about your wife it's about the loss of control and the fear of the unknown. This on top of a man's propensity to try to fix things and it's a receipe for disaster. You start operating under the illusion of action where you feel you need to do something to get her back. The best thing to do and would be the ultimate sign of love and that is to give her the freedom she is requesting.
I would love to see the stats on busted divorces if at the bomb drop the lbs said "lol oh you want to leave me? Well that's not what I want but ok. Do you need help packing your bags?
That's the mindset you need to develop because right now you are chasing a cat and it's going run every time you get close to it.
While there is a grain of truth in her recreation of what I have done wrong in our marriage, for the most part she is conveniently forgetting about all the other great stuff I have done.
I think a lot of us feel like our wife should love us for our deeds. I think that's a guy thing. But while we may have done a lot of great deeds most of us really neglected our wives emotionally. That is usually what drives them away, they are looking to fill that need. So you say she's "forgetting", I doubt it. Those deeds probably just weren't important to her like you (and I) thought they were. They weren't good enough to continue in an emotionally dead M.
Originally Posted by Destroyd
LH,
I know you are right. I am trying to become less dependent on my W. This is one of my 180s (for me) and GAL activities. I know this is a problem.
I am trying to pursue less, but I struggle with this too. I have stopped saying I love you. I have stopped any physical touching. But I still set up date nights and family outings. I still ask if she wants to watch a TV show before bed. 75% of the time she does. We are probably in the friend zone. It is better than being in mortal combat, but living in the same house makes it difficult to stop playing house.
I love some of LH's "blunt force trauma" posts There are "laws of attraction" that drive both men and women to choose a partner. If we ignore those laws we do so at our own peril. You may think it's "right" to remain in the friendzone with your W, but will it attract her back? Probably not. To attract her back you have to recognize what women are attracted to and model your behavior after that. The distance/pursuit dynamic is a classic case of how counter-intuitive these laws can be. You pursue and she distances, so your brain says "you're not pursuing hard enough, let's double down!" So you pursue more which makes her run away even faster. But if you can reign in your impulses and instead PULL BACK, then suddenly she's more interested. So that's at the heart of LH's comment- to attract your W back you've got to set aside all this crap you THINK you should be doing and instead learn and follow the laws of attraction.
I would love to see the stats on busted divorces if at the bomb drop the lbs said "lol oh you want to leave me? Well that's not what I want but ok. Do you need help packing your bags?
I know someone who did exactly that. He's a no-nonsense police officer. His W said she was done, he immediately showed her the door. She left, went and got a dragonfly tatt that said "she's finally free" in Latin and 6 months later was right back at home with him and has been there ever since (that was about 7 years ago). 6 months is an astonishingly short amount of time, what he did different was zero pursuit behavior. He told her buh bye and let her go and went about the business of living his life. It takes a lot of us much longer to get to that point of detachment unfortunately.
AS, I did not neglect my wife emotionally. If anything, she is the one who has a hard time opening up with anyone to connect emotionally with people. I am the only person in her life who she has ever opened up to.
Yesterday, my wife didn't want to go to the fair with the family. She wanted to get stuff done before the big holiday weekend. However, she did absolutely nothing around the house. This should come as no surprise to me as she has pretty much stopped doing anything around the house except for the barest of minimums. I chalk this up to either depression or a conscious rebellion to stop doing anything except that which she wants to do. Life for her is solely about freedom and selfishness for her right now. I pray that she finds her way through this time of trial that she is in. I can't fix her. I know I can't, but as you have all told me, deep down I am still trying to. I will keep telling myself that I can't fix her until my actions match what I know to be true. Thank you all for your 2x4s.
I wonder if she ever thinks what would happen to our family if I just stopped working for our family. I am really resentful that I must continue to uphold my end of the bargain, but she is allowed to stop doing anything nice for me. Oh well, I will continue to persevere. I will continue to do the right thing, and I will always treat her with respect and love.
So I will be GAL over this weekend. I will be taking my kids to a Fourth of July party, and then we will go to the beach for a day. I am looking forward to this time with my kids. I am a good dad, and I would be okay if I had to be a single dad.
I disagree with LH a bit. I think living together is most conducive to saving a marriage. I also think that you should be cordial throughout your sitch. I truly believe that you should kill her with kindness. (NOTE: This is not about "living for her" or becoming her slave, it is about returning good for evil. She yells, you remain calm. She throws off her vows, you double down on your vows. She goes out and hurts the marriage, you remain true to your marriage.
Steve, thank you so much for writing this. THIS is exactly how I want to DB. I know that I frustrate you guys with how bad I am at DBing, but I am getting better. I really am. But, I still need to be better at putting into practice what I learn from you guys.
What you said above is in line with my personality and values. If I can DB using this mindset, I think I can be successful.
Originally Posted by Steve85
That is what being AMOAFWL is all about. I watch videos for another relationship expert. He promotes the idea of good guys to great men. (You can google that.)
Steve, I am reading and watching the videos on that website. Thank you!! What are you doing to become AMOAFWL? I think it would help me to hear what you have focused on doing and becoming.
Originally Posted by Steve85
But Destroyd, how has "living for her" been working out for you? Stop doing what doesn't work. start doing what does work. Imagine your W's surprise when she says "I need you to do this" and you say "That will have to wait because I am going to do this thing I want to do". She is going to wonder "Hmmm, he doesn't usually do that." Believe it or not it works.
I have never been one to play hard to get. That is not how I got her in the first place, but I do think that I need to add this to my playbook.
Originally Posted by Steve85
This is the dynamic that makes DBing work. When you back off and give her time and space. Go out and GAL. Detach. And start working on you and 180ing to improve. yourself. The distance-pursuit dynamic kicks in and the WAW gets curious. Go read that thread. It is so important that you become a little mysterious. Most of us LBHs have the temptation to become an open book after BD. When we should do the exact opposite..
What have you been focusing on to GAL? What 180s did you work on?
I really appreciate everyone's time on here, especially all the help you have given to me Steve. Thank you so much!!
I have a question about Sandi's rule number 15. If your spouse is in a talkative mood, should you really not engage fully in the conversation and instead just be short but pleasant?
Quote
15.When at home with your spouse, (if you usually start the conversation---then don't, wait for him/her) then, be rather scarce or with your words, but don't sound rude or too short like you are mad. If your spouse asks what's wrong....just say "nothing" and have a pleasant expression on your face. Keep it short and simple. Don't get into an argument! Stay polite and don’ t act like you are pouting. Use poise and class. This does not mean to act like you aren’t speaking, but don’t be overly talkative.
I was looking forward to a great Fourth of July weekend with the entire family, but my wife had to go out of town (legitimate reason). The good news is that I did have a good Fourth of July weekend. I did lots of fun things with the kids, and they loved me for it! I am more focused than ever on building great memories with my children, not that I haven't always done that. But this was an important weekend for me. I am becoming a great single dad, even though I am still married. I will keep doing more and more things with my kids, just me and them. That is a 180 FOR ME. I have to quit looking at my life as my wife and I being a unit. Even if we are again some day, it is not healthy. Thank you to this forum to helping me get there. One day at a time, I AM BECOMING AMOAFWL.
Steve85, As you know I have been reading through your situation threads, and I came across many posts about you focusing on self-differentiation. Would you mind sharing with me what you have read and done in this area throughout your journey? I really feel like I have lost my identity as an individual throughout my marriage. Once we moved in together, she became my life whenever I wasn't at work. Then once we had kids, my identity became a husband and a family man. Now after the BD, I feel like I have lost my identity. I think that understanding the work you or others here have done to work on self-differentiation would really help me.
There are "laws of attraction" that drive both men and women to choose a partner. If we ignore those laws we do so at our own peril. You may think it's "right" to remain in the friendzone with your W, but will it attract her back? Probably not. To attract her back you have to recognize what women are attracted to and model your behavior after that. The distance/pursuit dynamic is a classic case of how counter-intuitive these laws can be. You pursue and she distances, so your brain says "you're not pursuing hard enough, let's double down!" So you pursue more which makes her run away even faster. But if you can reign in your impulses and instead PULL BACK, then suddenly she's more interested. So that's at the heart of LH's comment- to attract your W back you've got to set aside all this crap you THINK you should be doing and instead learn and follow the laws of attraction.