But what has resonated with me from everyone here: LH, Steve, AS and others is - you're not in a position to negotiate or win your marriage back anymore by conceding or acquiescing to her needs.
Exactly right.
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My W is a SAHM, I'd feel horrible to do anything that feels like kicking her out financially BUT this is the family agreement we talked about before we even had kids. I'm not going to feel guilty about me bringing home all the money and her not having the opportunity to because we agreed she'd raise the kids at home.
I think a lot of us go through this and it's due to NGS. We at least in part buy into our WAS's claims that it's our fault, we were abusive or dismissive or didn't meet their needs or whatever. But at the end of the day we are the ones fighting to save our M's and they are the ones FIGHTING HARD TO END THEM. They may do it by withholding sex, or treating us like crap, or accusing us of things we never did, or rewriting history, or threatening to take our kids away. Or all of above and more. But what a lot of us should really wrap our heads around is THEY ARE THE BAD GUY HERE, not us. All we're guilty of is ignorance. Now that we know there were problems, we're willing to change. But they won't even crack the door open to that. Sandi is a big proponent of playing hardball with WAW's and WW's in particular. Why? Because it's the only thing that works. The WAW has lost respect for her H and he is not going to get it back by appeasing her or making this easy on her. The more he rolls on her demands, then the more pathetic she thinks he is and the less respect and attraction she has for him.
Here is the attitude every LBS should take- "I made some mistakes, I own those mistakes, and I vow to correct those mistakes. But I am not the one wrecking this M, my spouse is and she needs to be held accountable for that."
HELD ACCOUNTABLE. Quit giving your rogue wives free passes on this guys. What have they done to deserve keeping the home, the kids, and half or more of YOUR paycheck.
U, all this crap your W is feeding you about being confused and not knowing what she wants and blah blah blah is SCRIPT. We call it script because nearly all of them do it. What do you think we mean when we say believe nothing they say and only half of what they do? We mean don't buy into the script. She has a hidden agenda that you are not a party to. She has a plan of action that she is following step-by-step.
Step 1- pull back and treat U like the plague to prepare him for S and D. Step 2- rally others to my cause- find a "marriage counselor" that is pro-divorce and willing to help with BD Step 3- BD him with the help of the MC Step 4- push him out of the house with minimal impact to me, dangle the carrot to him (I'm confused, I just need time, later who knows what may happen, just give me space and we'll see what happens) to maximize financial support I get from him Step 5- file for D, continue dangling the carrot (I'm open to sex, maybe D will give me the time and space I really need, there's still hope, this may be a new beginning for us) to soften him up to give me a big settlement Step 6- move OM into family home (may move this to step 4A or 5A but if I do I'll have to ramp up the gaslighting)
U, you can't stop her plans, her agenda. But you CAN make it on YOUR terms instead of hers.
Originally Posted by unchien
What my W has essentially told me (and I tread carefully here because words can betray true feelings, and her feelings themselves may be fluctuating for all I know):
- She is really confused what she wants, but she is not happy with how things are. SCRIPT - She feels fear around me. SCRIPT - She does not trust me, in particular as a romantic partner. SCRIPT - She doesn't even know if space would help or not, she just requested it. SCRIPT - She said she wants to see improvement on my emotional issues SCRIPT
- this is confusing as heck, because I have been so even-keel lately, but I will keep going to IC and working on myself.
It's confusing because it's BS. It's all excuses to further her agenda. She has no intentions, and I mean ZERO of giving you a chance. She gives you a list, you work on those things, she gives you another list. Eventually she's got you afraid to chew with your mouth open or put the toilet paper roll on because you might get it backwards.
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You might say she's feeding me BS, but then she makes statements about how we used to be, and how she wants to get back to that, and really doesn't want D.
SCRIPT See what I said above about "dangling the carrot".
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Sigh...I don't know what to believe anymore. Just a lot of information to process.
That's what we are here for, to help you navigate this.
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1. Evidence she wants to work - what UC wants to see is that we continue to go to MC and W gets off the abuse narrative and onto the "we need to communicate better" narrative. This will be a work in progress. I also need to see her accept the consequences of separation -- (again let's ignore the house for a moment) -- no "playing family" for instance. If abuse keeps coming up it's going to scare the s@#$ out of me that she's going to make some move for 100% custody or something and it will push us right out of being able to trust each other... because I also lack the necessary trust to build an intimate MR right now.
2. This option exists at any time, for both of us.
3. Small timelines - part of MC would include this. The MC seemed like he would help drive this as well. A 6 month separation is not "let's put our heads in the sand and then look up 6 months from now". I agree. MC is a great way to measure weekly progress.
U, you seem to be in the grip of a delusion that you are in a position to work on the M with her via MC. NO NO NOOOOO that is not an option right now. Let me remind you that she has a clearcut agenda and she's ticking off the boxes right now. Notice what is NOT on her agenda? Work on the M. It's not on her radar and won't be for a long time. Probably over a year. Let me also remind you the MC just assisted her in BD'ing you. This is not someone that's going to help you rebuild the M.
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Now what exactly are small timelines and measurable goals? I don't know. Need to think more about that.
No you don't. You need to think about what you need to do to protect yourself from her, and to make yourself a force of nature, the spouse only a fool would leave. Time to start DB'ing.
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Actually... I have zero clue how reconciliation even works in a separation situation. Honestly. Do couples reinitiate date night after awhile? I don't get it at all. It seems like the very nature of separation makes it almost impossible to rekindle anything. Or is ti just one spouse decides "Hey let's move back in together it seems like things are better."
No the LBS quits putting up with the WAS's BS and leaves her alone and goes about the business of building a life separately from her. He gives her REAL time and space. She does her own thing and eventually discovers it's not the nirvana she expected. She looks back and sees a confident, sexy, independent LBS that isn't showing any interest in her anymore, and that makes her wonder, makes her want to find out more.
