My H has severe separation anxiety re the house. He hates me making changes without consulting him. He will find something wrong with everything I do - because it was not his idea/doing. And you know what, I do what I want anyway knowing that he will start some type of passive aggressiveness which is now like water of a ducks back. My home, my money. I repeat this like a mantra in my head whenever he starts.
And given all of this, he would NEVER invite friends over here when I am not here. I
Last Halloween H invited his niece and his mum over to celebrate and go to trick-or-treating with our girls. We live in a fairly posh part of our town and the pickings are better here. I wasn't bothered about them coming over but I made clear that he needs to ask and not just assume I am ok with it. I reminded him that I would not invite his mum round to his flat for tea.
Remember be careful what you tolerate.
Just change the effing locks. Say you the old ones seemed a little old and it needed doing. Don't offer to give him a set. If he demands a set, then say, sure, when you give me keys to your flat.
It's a couple of hundred pounds and it will give you peace of mind.
Alison - British curse words, whatever do you mean ?!?!?
FS: I've already changed the locks not that long after BD because the lock broke. H was a bit anxious about this and then I gave him a key. It will look deliberately inflammatory to change them again. And H has always been like that about making changes to the house, the few things I've chosen by myself have been criticised mercilessly. That's why I told him when I bought my new car he wasn't allowed to complain about it (and he hasn't). I don't think H has separation anxiety about the house because he's always been critical about me doing things in the house (is it still territorial though? It feels like a power thing though I've always been careful to involve him in most decisions, like I'll give him 3 paint colours to choose from and then give him the final say). He might have finally realised though that I've moved almost all of his stuff out of the wardrobes in the bedroom, so that might be one reason why this happened!
I'm not going to start a full scale fight over this, but I am going to make it clear that it won't be happening again. And I'm asking for my car key back, there's no reason for him to have it in his flat because if he's using my car then it'll be because he's here to take one of the kids somewhere when he doesn't have his car.
I am super tempted to give him a bag of my dirty laundry tomorrow night though and say that I'm sure he won't mind doing mine if he expects me to do his
I would ask for the key back. If he balks, ask for a key to his flat. If he refuses, tell him that either he can give the key back, or you can have the locks replaced again.
No more Mrs. Nice Girl!
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Well, I did agree with him coming to the house this weekend in the first place, the fact that he has behaved this way I'm not sure justifies me taking his key back, does it? We didn't agree any ground rules on how he should leave the house or whether he was allowed to ask friends over, until now he has actually been fairly respectful of this house and usually knocks instead of letting himself in. I think I will tell him that I was very disappointed in what he did and that it will not happen again in the future, and then ask for my car key back. Or is that me being wimpy and frightened of his anger?
Steve: I agree that there are differences based on gender, which is why it's valuable to get different perspectives. Otherwise we end up with segregated threads and entrenched views, and entrenched views are partly how we got here! I think that part of the problem in my M is that my H is a ridiculously hard working breadwinner and I ended up as an unappreciated SAHM, and we lived such separate lives both of us felt resentful of each other and unvalued and lacking in understanding of the other person's perspective. In any M there are inequalities and misunderstandings and these creep in and multiply over time, sometimes these are gender-based and sometimes they're power-based, and the two interact.
Steve: I valued reading your thread because your description of your behaviour pre BD was very like my H's, and it gave me hope in him changing. Getting a male perspective is good even if it's a LBH instead of a WAH, because there are certain ways of looking at a situation that you might understand differently from a woman. For example, my H has said to me frequently that his ego is everything, and that embarrassment is the one thing he cannot tolerate. He works in a hugely competitive environment (of mostly men) and it is really hard for me to understand from a female perspective, because it is SO male-oriented.
And oh, the bitterness is so hard to avoid isn't it? But I want IH to be better, not bitter. I found it empowering to step out of blaming and bitterness (though I have to admit to a right old pity party on the phone to a friend this morning though, thank goodness I didn't ring my H then!) because bitterness gives all the power to your spouse. So I'm sorry if I was a bit blunt earlier IH, I like Steve's explanation of you ranting to decrease pain. Natural, but ultimately unproductive I think. And it's so much easier to see bitterness and victim behaviour in other people than in ourselves, I usually have to spot it in someone else to make me reflect how I'm doing it myself.
Sorry for the thread hijack Destroyd
Moving this to your thread.
Your first paragraph, as you know, described my sitch to a tee! "I think that part of the problem in my M is that my H is a ridiculously hard working breadwinner and I ended up as an unappreciated SAHM, and we lived such separate lives both of us felt resentful of each other and unvalued and lacking in understanding of the other person's perspective. "
And I agree 100% that the opposite sex's perspective is invaluable. But one of the reason sandi's advice is so good is because she has been a WW, so she can council LBHs dealing with a WW on what works. But you are also right in that LBHs and LBWs have a lot to offer one another. Which is why I do try to chime in on LBW's threads too. Especially the ones that seem to be over accommodating to the WAHs/WHs. One of the thing that I think sets LBHs apart, in general (and there have been recent examples of the exceptions to this rule) is that LBHs tend to move on a bit quicker and easier than LBWs do. I think there are gender differences, but also societal pressures at play in that.
I agree with you on your bitterness paragraph, except I do think there is value in ranting. I think the point I was making overall is that we should be careful not to judge each other. If dillydaf needs to talk about how awful men are in a few posts to feel better about her sitch, I say go for it. I will not take it personally. We all are entited to a bit of ranting. Here or elsewhere. However, you are spot on with being careful to play the victim. "Poor me, I am an innocent victim of evil women's doings!" is certainly counterproductive. A, it is untrue, and B, no spouse, no matter how good they may have been as a partner, are innocent. And the more veteran posters here are usually good at calling out a LBS that starts to play the victim.
In general, I think we are all here trying to help and support one another. But I take some of the things that LBSs say in anger, bitterness and frustration with a huge grain of salt. IH I don't think, is misogynist. He is jilted, hurt, and not sure how to deal with the bitterness and anger that goes with all of that. Which is why I am a huge proponent of IC for the LBS.
Very good, and astute observations though dilly! I also wanted to point out that it is interesting how similar our situations were/are, yet in your sitch it was your H that walked away, while in my sitch it was my W that walked away. I think this speaks right to the heart of your original point to IH, which I concur with completely. And that is that walkaway disease is a genderless condition.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
I'm not surprised you're furious, Dilly - I would be too. And I don't think getting his key back from him is unreasonable. He doesn't live there. When he came for the weekend he treated you with disrespect (there's no need to set ground rules for this kind of thing in advance - you expect normal adult behaviour and those expectations of him cleaning up after himself were totally reasonable). It is your home. He has his own home that you aren't allowed into.
OK so this morning I texted him saying I'd need a key to his flat. He texted back no and then rang me. I said that I'd asked some people over there for dinner and was planning to leave a mess for him to clean up. He got really angry and spouted and then hung up. Then he ranted via text a few times and said he wouldn't meet up tonight. I said that was fine because I had a lot of thinking to do. I asked for my car key back and he said he'd bring it Sunday. Then I said and the house keys too and then he ranted again about how it's his house and his kids live there. And I pointed out that he didn't live here and he had disrepected me by asking friends over without checking with me and then leaving a mess. He said he didn't mean to disrespect me (that's his apology lol) and that he'd been sad thinking it was the last time he would stay here. Then he said he thought we were separated and he would tell the kids this Sunday (Father's day, the irony, how very selfish of him). Then he ranted a bit more about how it had been his home for 30 years and why couldn't I have listened to him for the last 5 years (interesting timeline). I said I was sorry he was upset and said he could ring me later when he had calmed down.
Phew. So I guess I have a free evening tonight.
Thoughts: I actually feel quite calm. I didn't when he was shouting but those texts I'm pretty much seeing as spewing.
I don't want to go through the hassle of legal stuff right now, not until this project is finished at the end of the year. I literally don't have time. I've kept thinking about moving house and the work involved is too much for me to fit in right now. But otherwise I feel like I'm making my peace with us being actually separated and perhaps D. This weekend has been a turning point in me deciding to make my own future instead of waiting around for him to decide. I was ok with waiting while things were warming up between us, but he kept turning them cold again, and I refuse to do laundry and clean up for someone who won't let me see his flat, that is just demeaning.
So, watch this space. I think he will get furious and do something impulsive. I will be calm and wait out the storm.
Fundamentally when he moved out I feel like he was just waiting for me to do something. He showed zero commitment to work on our R. He may have had difficulty letting go, but he hasn't made the effort to move towards me.
And another update. He rang me after he had calmed down and said he meant what he said in his texts. I said OK. Then he started talking and I suggested it would be better to meet face to face because I don't like discussing these things over the phone. He said OK. I said well we'd arranged to meet tonight so maybe we should just do that. He said yes but not the activity we'd planned. I said we'd booked and paid for it so we might as well (it doesn't take too long). He said it wasn't very conducive to a conversation. I said we could just put conversation to one side while we did it. He said he thought that's what we had been doing all this time. I said I thought we'd been out having fun. He ummed and erred and said maybe. I said we could make it a different night if that was better. He said he couldn't make any other night (so he has gone and filled up his evenings with work events yet again, so much for him wanting time and space to think then). So we left it that we will meet tonight and do the activity and then go for dinner and talk. Maybe a bit too soon for both of us. I don't know.
Any advice on how to behave tonight would be appreciated!!!
He's making no sense. He considers the relationship over, was sad that he was never planning to stay in the house again after last weekend but also wants a key to the house? He's going to tell the kids you're separated? Does he think that him living elsewhere for the best part of a year has gone unnoticed by them?
I wouldn't meet up with him, Dilly. He doesn't want to be married, and he's too scared to get divorced. You're not going to get any sense of out of him - your own action is going to move you out of this situation, he isn't going to grant it to you because he can't.
Yes of course the kids know he's not been living here, but I suppose it has been confusing to them because we've met up once a week and spent time together. So everyone is confused really. The key thing, who knows. I did say the kids both have keys so can let him in. They did go to his flat quite a lot the first few months but then ds2 refused to go saying it was boring and hard work getting there and ds1 got a job involving an early start Saturday so neither of them have been there for months. Perhaps he fears he won't see them at all if he doesn't come here. He might be right.
I think he will push for D if we meet tonight. He might be too scared to D and he definitely doesn't want to be married right now, but his pride will make him make D noises I think, if not actual movements towards D. I did say that I wasn't giving ultimatums or anything now but that I was unhappy about him disrespecting me. Maybe I was a bit too conciliatory.
