If and when there is any remorse and a change of direction i think it will be pretty obvious.
This is where Neffer jumps in to say something like, "When she wants you, YOU WILL KNOW." Steve85 is out hunting so he missed his chance to say it this time.
I'm no expert but I would not consider anything except actions. Saying things like "can we start on being us again?" etc is just that, useless words. Think back to times when you have first started any relationship, think of the actions the other person took to express interest in you, to show you that they wanted you. Not entirely up to speed on your sitch but if you did any pursuit and pleading after BD think of that but for the other side of the fence. If and when there is any remorse and a change of direction i think it will be pretty obvious.
W was my first R. We met on an online dating site and everything just clicked. There were things she liked about me. My personality (getting that back), my humor (getting that back), my conviction to my beliefs (getting that back), and my sweetness (maybe too nice?).
So I feel like I’m digging back into the past to find my roots. If it worked for my W, it can work again. For W, or someone else.
AS, was the conversation we just had a major temp check that I failed? I mean I saw some signs and tried not to take the bait, but obviously I have more work to do.
Not at all. A lot of LBS's think every little thing is a success or failure, but it's not really the case. It took a long time to end up where you are and it takes a long time to turn it around. Think of a huge ship, if it wants to go the opposite direction that turn could take a significant amount of time. There may be little waves or big waves that bump the ship during the turn, but you've just got to hold that wheel over and be patient.
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BD is the equivalent of the beginning of a deep wound.
Well that's a gross analogy, but it's not off the mark
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I was told repeatedly by IC that W is not a "bitch" and the pain she is causing is not because she is malicious or evil, even if it feels that way.
True. Sometimes that's hard to accept, but WAS's are almost always going through some terrible internal struggles and really wrestle with themselves over what they are doing. They are already beating themselves up, so if we try to convince them they are wrong and selfish we're just making it worse and making ourselves a target. But if we treat them with respect and LOVINGLY detach, then they have no choice but to continue wrestling with those internal demons instead of us. That's what DB'ing is.
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What actions she will demonstrate if she is truly remorseful? I will not trust her if she says "sorry" or "Can we start on being us again?" or any other variant (trust nothing she says).
Some pretty much beg and plead to come back. Others warm back up slowly. But in all cases they will let you know. I have NEVER ONCE heard of someone asking their WAS if they had changed their mind and had the WAS said "you know what, I have, I didn't know if I should say something because you seemed so done, but let's give it a try." That NEVER happens. What does happen is the WAS will INITIATE that convo. THAT is when you know.
W attempted to log onto my computer but failed. Thank goodness I changed my password. Because when I logged in, I forgot to close my browser window and the forum popped up. (Checked event logs...she tried to log on twice and failed. There were no other attempts).
W took D4 to OM's house yesterday without me knowing. D4 told me when she got in trouble that W took D4 to OM's bed to calm her down, etc. I kept cool and said I thought we were going to talk about it before she pulls stuff like this. I told her we need to talk about this but not right now and let her go about her evening.
I'm getting anxious about the chat because I know it's going to go to "she likes him, she needs to see a happy R, etc."
I was doing so well. I just want to...I don't know. I feel disrespected. I want her to hit the ground hard.
It is also obvious that I am not detached and ready to forgive.
Whoa almost had an OPSEC failure there Pain!!! Glad you changed that.
Don't bother to tell your W she can't take your daughter to OM's house. You have no control over that. Why bother? What's going to happen when you have this convo? I'll tell you: you're going to come off as controlling and she's not going to listen to you.
And even IF your W agrees to this to your face, what are you going to do when you find out she brought D4 over there again?
Move on to something more productive.
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
Whoa almost had an OPSEC failure there Pain!!! Glad you changed that.
Don't bother to tell your W she can't take your daughter to OM's house. You have no control over that. Why bother? What's going to happen when you have this convo? I'll tell you: you're going to come off as controlling and she's not going to listen to you.
And even IF your W agrees to this to your face, what are you going to do when you find out she brought D4 over there again?
Move on to something more productive.
Makes sense. I'll swallow my pride and grit my teeth through it.
And yeah...me too. I almost had a meltdown last night, but fortunately the skills I'm learning at my job is coming in handy out of work .
The anxiety attacks need to stop. I need to meditate more. And I need to accept that things will take as long as they need to work out. Maybe I'm still focusing on the negative, but even I would have to agree with you all that I have made very good progress since I first posted here. I am beginning to understand the marathon part in all of this. I still don't like it, but I have accepted that this will be the norm for the near future.
Very little contact with W. Since I went distant, W has reached out to me less and mostly stopped sniffing. But there are some times (some) that I may get a little over-enthusiastic response form W. Does not mean anything to me anymore. I would like to think that I am making progress in my detaching since I let go of the small signs nonsense. But I go back and think of our contact before I discovered the e-mails (28 days tomorrow) and wonder if W was really warming up to me or if she was playing me.I guess I will never know, will I? I am tempted to try to cast out the line again but I also know that would be considered pursuit. I still feel that I am detaching correctly now, and living by the "no expectations" rule that is standard for LBS.
Busy-ish weekend planned with D4 and I. I'm canning some apple pie jam and maybe do something fun with D4. To be honest, I am starting to really dislike weekends. Then again, it's been like that since BD all year. Why should this coming weekend be any different?
I go back and forth about seeking a casual R. I know I posted on this topic before and the consensus I got was that it was a very bad idea. Still, I wonder if I will have the willpower to take the higher road if the opportunity for sex was bouncing right in front of me.
Pain, It might not be for everyone but one thing I don't see mentioned on here much is seeking some medication to help with the anxiety. I myself was against it but finally caved and went to the doctor. I was put on a very low dose of anti anxiety meds and they have helped me a great deal with sleep and getting through the day in a calmer state. I really had no choice since the sitch was starting to impact work and every other aspect of my life. If you are having a hard time with anxiety and meditation etc. isn't helping a doctors visit might be a wise idea.
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