He said that he does that because whenever he sees me it just deteriorated into an argument about the OW. He suggests thats all I want to talk about. I pointed out to him that I haven't mentioned her for 6 weeks when I said that was it and that I wasn't taking part in the drama anymore. He then proceeded to mention her 3 times in the conversation that ensued.
Google perception bias.
Originally Posted by Yorkie
I am quite stunned by the extent to which history is being rewritten and how he wishes to view our 30 years together. I did say that I knew his M.O and out of sight out of mind wasn't going to quite cut it after 30 years. To hear him talk I was the worst wife ever and he's suffered all of that time because I've always had my way. This is the only time that he's stood up for himself apparently.
From what I can see they all re-write history. They need the past to justify their behavior. Today I found the anniversary card my H gave me last year (2 months before BD) and it said "To my darling wife, thank you for another wonderful year. I love you now more than ever". 2.5 months after giving me that card we were in MC and he spewed all sorts of garbage - I pressured him into the R (not true), he was high when he asked me to marry him (true - but he could have backed out in the 2 years btw engagement and marriage), we eloped so it all felt rushed (not true - it was his idea) and that we didn't plan any of the children (true, but they were loved from the moment we found out we were pregnant).
It was hard to take. I felt like he was corrupting every good memory we had. But, one day they will wake up and see the damage for what it was. I suspect that for you, that wake up call will be too late. I hope it is not for me.
Originally Posted by Yorkie
My H is a lawyer and has always said that we don't need to be paying lawyers when it is relatively straight forward. Well if he thinks that I am taking his word for it then he is a bigger fool than I took him for.
My H tried the same tactic with me, even went so far as to say I was wasting the children's inheritance if I went to a lawyer. I think he forgot who he married. I think your H is the same.
PS - thank you for your input to my thread. Comparatively I sound like a whiney teenager.
Anyone offer any advice about our meeting on Monday? I sense a shift in his attitude towards me and it is definitely worse. I think this is since I stopped contact and being 'concerned' about how he was doing. I have an awful feeling that it has backfired on me even though I am most definitely stronger than I was and can see that I will survive life without him.
I have to accept that he appears to have finally decided that he wants out of the marriage. He tells me that he has got over his meltdown and depression and feels in a happier and more settled place. So why the need to be nasty and still looking to lay blame at my door.
Do I remain detached at the meeting and just listen to what he proposes about formalising the S and ultimate D? Or do I make attempts to find out what is going on in his head to create this shift of attitude and try and have an honest conversation about how we interact in the future. I can't do that unless I understand why he is being like this.
I just have a feeling that there is still something getting in the way - he is bearing a grudge against me for something and we are not being totally honest yet which we will need to be if we are going to be civil.
Is it easier for him to hate me, even though he has decided that he is happier without me.
It was only 6 weeks ago that he told me that he had chosen me and the family and that he would always love me. This is now going too fast for me to process. I'd just started to GAL and find me.
Do I tell him that it is going to fast for me? Or do I just try some delaying tactics? Or do I just accept the writing on the wall and let things move forward as they are.
I feel like I'm backed into a corner and fighting for my life. Do I tell him?
ps yesterday when setting the meeting up and the resulting argument he twice said 'No chance at a reconciliation then' I am pretty sure it was said with sarcasm, or he was mocking my desire for reconciliation. I simply said that there always had been a chance of reconciliation.
I have to accept that he appears to have finally decided that he wants out of the marriage. He tells me that he has got over his meltdown and depression and feels in a happier and more settled place. So why the need to be nasty and still looking to lay blame at my door.
To pre-empt the vets (I assume that it is too early in the morning on their side of the pond) ... "Believe nothing they say and only half of what they do." Actions speak louder than words.
He is not happier and he is not in a more settled place.
It is anger that drives him. Between BD and moving out (and for a l long time after), my H was angry at me for showing weakness "I thought you were stronger than this", he was angry at me for showing strength "You have no emotions". I am sure even the sound of my voice made him angry (I stopped talking, which made him ... yep ... you guess it ... angry). Looking back, I think it was pure projection. He was angry at himself for giving up and I was a constant reminder that he had given up.
You are not faultless (none of us are) but this anger you see now, that is not your fault.
Originally Posted by Yorkie
Do I remain detached at the meeting and just listen to what he proposes about formalising the S and ultimate D? Or do I make attempts to find out what is going on in his head to create this shift of attitude and try and have an honest conversation about how we interact in the future. I can't do that unless I understand why he is being like this.
You cannot create a shift in attitude. He is resolute. Until he can see past his own [censored] nothing you do will change his mind. He would still have gone this course if you had begged and pleaded instead of detached. He has a shiny OW waiting in the wings and once the novelty has worn off and it is 'normal' relationship (with responsibilities, compromise, bills) then and only then will he realise what he has given up. Doesn't mean he will come back. But he will be finally thinking straight.
I would read Cadets thread on validation before going to the meeting. I would say (just once) that you do not want this and you think that the marriage can be saved. Then I would listen and validate, and even when he is throwing the worst kind of [censored] stuff at you, I would (though I probably wouldn't be able to) try and remain calm. I wouldn't agree to anything there ("I need time to absorb this before making any decisions") .
I have had a read through the validation techniques but I'm pretty sure they won't be needed. Knowing him, he has gone into pure business mode and will remove all emotion from the conversation. He suggested that I forward an agenda!! I could tell from his tone that I will now be treated in the way that he treats people that he really despises. Or he'll turn on the charming, kind voice that he reserves for his female middle aged divorcing clients (and yes OW was a client when she went through her 1st divorce)
I know I have to drop all my expectations, but i guess I am looking for some acknowledgement from him that he also feels the magnitude and sadness of this situation after 30 years together.
Wrong I know, for me to feel that, but I do. I was starting to do well, but I'm not ready for this now.
I am pretty good at the business email. I took the same route as you think your H will take with my correspondence with H when he moved out. When I am feeling hurt I go to what I know. It is self preservation.
Dear H,
I hope you are enjoying your holiday. I wish to bring to your attention to ... blah blah blah
Kind regards, FS
Looking back, I was such a [censored]
If you are looking for signs of regret then you wont see any. H cried when he was away (he was away a lot because if his job). He told his sister that I was all he thought about. It just went round and round in his head and he couldnt shut it off. But he hid this from me. All he said at the time was he didnt know why he felt the way he did and it would be so much easier if he was seeing someone ... because it would be a tangible reason to leave.
... which brings me to your sitch ...
Your H has a tangible reason. Your H has OW. You say she was a client? So, your H gets to live out his knight in shining armour fantasy. He doesnt have time for regrets. He can see his happy ever after. Its in his grasp. If only his wife of 30 years wasnt in the way. But life is not a fairy tale. He will learn this when the shine comes off, when real life begins. I know its [censored], but if you are looking for regrets right now, you wont find them.They'll come but I have a feeling that you will be far too happy living your life to care.
You are an incredibly strong, articulate woman who is worth ten knights in shining armour. Time to remember who you are.
Thank you for your kind words FS, I will remember them when I'm feeling low. The irony is that the OW is playing hard to get. When she approached him 2 years ago she said 'i'm not looking for another husband just want to have some fun and I think you might be it' She's said that she doesn't want him full time, but it would be nice to have companionship when she wants it. She also told me that she doesn't think it's got a long term future and it might not be exciting enough but she likes him a lot and he is her 'comfort blanket' and fixes her problems for her.
He knows all this and obviously feels that he is such a good catch that she will change her mind. She is very needy; 2 small children, mental health issues including self harming and a drink problem. A couple of months before the affair was revealed he told me how unhappy he was and that he didn't think I needed him anymore and he didn't know where he fitted in my life anymore. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out what he went looking for.
I put him on a pedestal for much of our married life and that started to change when the boys grew and my career took off. I can't see me putting him on a pedestal now so if that is what he is looking for then there is no chance for us really.
When we meet tomorrow I'm going to keep telling myself 'I grew as a person and you didn't want to grow with me. That's your loss' If I keep saying it in my head then it may prevent me becoming emotional.
p.s just painted a room in the house in the brightest yellow you can imagine. He would hate it!!
Good for you Yorkie!! Your comment about the yellow room made me laugh outloud. Thank you for that.
I agree with everything FS said. His anger is all projection. He knows what he is doing is wrong. He wants you to justify it by being a b***h. Do no give him that! Just be your strong, graceful and dignified self. Do not get drawn into a defensive tit-for-tat argument. Validate as much as you can. If he is a total jerk, tell him that today was obviously not a great time to meet and take your leave of the situation. Do NOT agree to anything. Tell him you need time to think [and consult a lawyer]. Don’t let him bully you into anything.
The OW sounds like a definite affair down. He will come to realize that in time and like FS said, hopefully you won’t care. However, I know how much time 30 years is and that is a lot of history to just close the door forever. Keep GAL. You will be happy you did regardless of the outcome.
Hoping beyond hope that your meeting goes reasonably well. (((HUGS)))
I redecorated the MBR when H moved out. The center piece is a (mustard) yellow end of bed sofa thingy. It sounds horrible, but it isn't. The MBR now looks like something you'd find in a boutique hotel in the middle of the desert. A sanctuary from the craziness of the world.
When he saw it H said - "It's not to my taste ... but as long as you like it". He was very much in his 'passive aggressive t**t" stage then.
Good luck in your meeting. You won't need it though. You've got this.
Meeting went well in terms of pleasantness and civility. The first thing he asked was how I was - the 1st time in 5 months. We talked pleasantries about the dog and the kids. I feel we engaged and had a connection. We moved onto business and there was no pressure from him, just a laying out of facts for us to consider. He asked what I thought and I said that I needed time to process as he had been thinking about this situation for a long time but I'd only had a matter of weeks. He said don't hurry, this was just a preliminary meeting. As we'd managed to keep it civil, we agreed that he could come back to the house for things when he wanted to and didn't need to give me notice necessarily, but he said he would out of courtesy. He also said that having been in each others company without fighting, he felt able to come to the house when I was there and help sort the house out.
So, there doesn't appear to be any difference in his stance to want out, but a difference in his attitude to me. I did wonder if all was not well in paradise. So, what do I want?
I don't know. I felt a connection, felt empathy for him, felt tender towards him and a rather bleak future that he faces. I felt no physical attraction at all. I acknowledge that his head seemed better and his eyes were less crazy, he talked calmly and sensibly but he looked 10 years older than his 58 years. He looked frail and unwell.
I so wanted to say 'is this really what we both want' but I absolutely didn't thanks to DB. I came home and could feel myself wanting to reach out and text him to say it had been good to talk etc etc but I didn't thanks to DB. I started to think ' this is a good sign reach out and grab it with both hands', but I didn't thanks to DB.
I don't know what this is that I feel. I do think there is unfinished business between us. My head tells me to move on; that it may all be manipulation on his part; that I'm clinging onto something that isn't there; but my heart is not so sure.
I'm glad calmer heads prevailed during your meeting (it is strange calling it that). I understand the ambivalence you feel. In my interactions with H, his calm demeanor throws me. I want to see some emotion, some regret, some sign that he hurts as much as I do. But then I remember, in his eyes, I too am calm. I suspect that this throws him as well. I sometimes throw in a comment I know would normally upset him - just to see that flick of jealousy in his eyes.
You are stronger than me though.
You demonstrated great dignity. If the D goes ahead, your H will remember you are a person of character. That life with you is not an episode of Jeremy Kyle. Juxtapose that with the crazy drama of the OW (with her self harm and drink problem). One day he will remember that the grass is greener under you.
You will have (re)gained his respect yesterday. There can be no relationship (M or otherwise) without respect.
