Friends: Season 2--The air has cleared

[SadBurl]

Guys this has been so enlightening

My H NEVER responded to my crazymaking. He doesn't like to argue, so he would just walk away. This would make me crazier! I would follow him and yell more. He would still ignore this. Finally, I would calm down, and usually cry and say I was sorry. We would then have sex. Yes, Briget, make-up sex is awesome! Now, for years I did this. The payoff was that I got the closeness I was looking for in the end.

Pamela this is me to a T. All I wanted was for H to fight back, a huge loud row, instead of just sitting there quietly saying nothing. The less he said the more i cracked. Eventually tears, hysterics, shouting and then the guilt, the tears, the I'm so sorry please forgive me etc etc etc. And then although I got closeness I had the horrible feeling of dread and well nothing.

If I had been someone looking from the outside I would have thought commit that woman.

Since joining BB I have learned that this aint the way (Yes Ive learned something ). I realise H needs more pyschological space than me. If I make a point then I need to walk away and let him come to me. Overwise I need to move on. This is not easy and I really have to force myself to deal with this sitch but I'm hoping that with time it will just come naturally.

I wish H could read this thread and see that I'm not pyschotic and that there is a way through this.

Joanne

PS Probably too late being on the other side of the pond but GO BETSY!!!!!!!!

[slowly]

It's Saturday afternoon here in sunny England, and I feel strong enough to tackle Meredith's steps. The discussion on crazymaking has been wonderful, but 12 years with the nuns (went to Catholic school) has nurtured an over developed sense of responsibility, and love for homework


Step 1: Acknowledge the addiction!
My name is Slowly, and I am a crazymaker

Step 2: Identify when you crazymake and why
I caught myself first at work, where in order to prove how valuable I was to the organisation, I'd let things develop into a crisis, then bust a gut to fix the sitch. In the past week, I've come to the realisation that to provoke any reaction from my passive/aggressive H, I've been crazymaking for YEARS, but more so since he confessed to a PA

Step 3: Accepting your behaviors (and your spouse's return behaviors) for what they ARE and not what they SEEM.
Hmmm, tough one. Am I so lacking in self esteem that I need the manufactured sitch to create validation? Ugh. At home, mostly my crazymaking provokes NO response from H, which then triggers a nasty cycle of attention seeking, and him feeling cornered. BAD, BAD, BAD

Step 4: Discover ways to achieve your crazymaking goals without crazymaking
Things at work are sorted. I stopped this crisis-creation a couple of years ago, confident that my contributions are accepted without me having to re-establish them every day At home, my self confidence is frankly at an all time low, so I need to exert extraordinary energies to not seek validation. sigh.

Step 5: Maintaining your own happiness in a state of rough or calm independently
Working on this. Have come a long way in the past 6 weeks, but still very much work-in-progress

Feedback welcome, folks. Slowly

[eddy]

Hi Betsey, Ive never posted to you before but I see your posts all over. You are an inspiration to us all. You always seem to have the right things to say. I am really impressed with your gift of compassion as well as your gift of gab. With that said, Did he beat your pants off?

I have been lurking around your thread and see your unconditional love and devotion to Mr. Wonderful and can only think he has to come to his senses sooner or later. Just wanted to say, keep up the good work. God Bless, Eddy

[CMNM]

I wish H could read this thread and see that I'm not pyschotic and that there is a way through this

Amen, sister!

I would have printed it all off and given it to mine, but he would never sit and read it all anyway!
So, I just keep on fighting the urge to stir up trouble.

Perhaps I'll have a huge party when I've been crazymaking sober for a full year!

Only 5 months to go.....

[karen812]

Hi Friends!
How are you? Go Betsey!!!

I didn't make any Crazy last night or this morn!! H and I went out to eat-he made me pick, so it was an "adventure." There's a saying-"it's always an adventure w/Karen." I have led some people on some wild rides. good tho...so, we went to a new rest. My food was absolutely gross! I mean, I've had bad meals before, but this was awful. So, we had to laff and I sent it back and got poppers (figure-they're frozen, they can't mess those up.) Went to winery, had a bottle and played buck euchre. Still struggling for some convo, but it seems that if I am patient and not **pressuring**, eventually, he talks more. Went to sleep, his back was hurting. Id'd looking at my c-making recipe, but decided to turn the oven off.

This morn. was patient, and well came from him! Ok, this works!!! I really tried to de-personalize and be compassionate about him being tired/sore. (His job wears him out).

Slowly, why the low self-esteem at home? You may have been over this before, so forgive me, but what can you do to make yourself feel better? Sometimes for me if something is bothering me about the house ie huge attacking dust bunnies on the wood floors, it helps just to tackle the job. Are things weighing on you? I'm glad you are doing better at your job!!

How do you corner your h?

Hope everyone has a great weekend! I already feel like I am more accountable to you as far as not c-making and biting my tongue. It was so hard not to ask the "are you ok?" questions, but I did it & it appeared that he felt more relaxed after a while.

karen812

[TotallyShocked]

Betsey;

I just wanted to stop by and say how much I appreciate your posts to me. Your words are insightful and you paint a very vivid picture with your phrases. You help me understand and have faith - thank you.

Now to participate in this conversation a bit on crazymaking. I think I am a mini-crazymaker. Because I'm a very emotional person our fights (of which there have been few) but they would escalate into me getting emotionally upset and finally asking if I should just leave and P shutting down completely so that she can't say what she wants or needs. I recognize that I do that because I just want her to say that she loves me - but it results in my not listening to her. Hmmm - more about my not listening very well. I recognize the problem now and hope I get the opportunity to put it into practice.

This a great thread and you are all wonderful people.
Totally

[Underdog]

Hi all,

Warning: Long post!

I wasn't going to log in today because I have scheduled a "BLOB-BLAH-BETSEY" day. And the hockey game is on, but since we're up 1-0, I figured I'd stop by for a quick visit.

Let's get the good stuff over with first. I'm now down 19 lbs. and have 14 to go before I'm back to my svelte, Phoebe-like image. I still don't feel well, but what the heck.

Last night went well. I could tell that Mr. Wonderful was a little apprehensive, but since I was effervescent (read: Bob accompanied me), he was loathe to hang out in the unenthusiastic mode.

D10 chose Life. She can be a poor sport, so her dad and I just looked at her and she quipped, "I promise to be a good winner or a good loser." Okay, then. I decided to put on some music, so I put on a real fave of ours: Little River Band. Usually Mr. W. sings along, but this time, he did not.

He won the first game. Then I put on Randy Travis' best hits, saying to D10: This one is for dad. He smiled, but did not sing along to his favorite tunes. Hmmm. I won the second game.

Oddly enough, it was D10 who wanted to quit and to head back to the apartment. Note to me: offer to kick her butt. Everyone was upbeat, though (including me, because it was nice to have my family home on a Friday night--for a change--even for a couple hours). He smiled at me and said, "Great idea! Thanks for asking--it was really fun."

All's well that ends well.

Now I want to address all the great posts since last night. Slowly, you are making some great progress with your Crazymaking steps. Eddy, thanks for visiting. I always enjoy reading your posts to Merrick!

Pam, hope your house full of teenage boys wasn't as nuts as it sounds! I go a little crazy with a house full of 10 year old girls, but to tell you the truth, I love it! The more, the merrier!

Totally, I'm glad you found some pearls for yourself. Let me tell you, there isn't a family member or friend of mine who have not commented on my patience. My picture used to be next to the word IMPATIONECE in the dictionary, and I've surprised everyone by learning it. It was hard, but I'm so much happier now. It's also been a tremendous support in thwarting any desire to be a crazymaker.

I wasn't going to post about my stuff earlier this week, because I didn't want a multitude of people telling me this is a baby step. My reason is that I realize it is NOT a baby step. I KNOW Mr. Wonderful loves me, to the best of his ability. But that might not be enough in the end.

Holding On--the rest of this story is for you, hoping that you can get to this point too. Because for the first time in a really, really long time, I am really, really happy. And I mean this from the bottom of my heart.

Tuesday afternoon, while the girls were in RE class, I called Mr. Wonderful at the office from my cell in the car. I needed to let him know some financial stuff happening with the foundation and the golf tournament. HE made the segue into a much more personal and emotional conversation.

He cleared his throat and said quietly, "Ah, Bets, has the IRS refund shown up in your checking account yet?" Shocked, I said, "Um, I don't think so. What do you mean?"

MW: "Didn't you see on the form you signed that I had requested the refund go directly to you?"

Me: "No."

MW: "Oh, no wonder you never commented on it. Well, I think it will be showing up any time now. I want to talk about it with you."

Me: Starting to cry. "Why did you do this? I assumed we would talk about this, and I don't want you to go without?"

MW: "Bets, do I look like I'm malnourished or financially strapped? I can tell you that I'm doing fine, and I really think you should get it since you've been keeping us afloat and everything working right. But I will ask you to use some of it for a couple things."

Me: "Thank you. Okay. Like what?"

MW: "Well, if you noticed, there is a contract on the counter to repaint the exterior of the house. It needs it. Launched into all the zillion reasons why we should do this.

Me: "K, don't worry. I KNOW it needs it. I started seeing things that bothered me last year. Okay."

MW: "I also want you to put some of it into the account for the special needs trust. Other than that, the balance is yours to spend as you like."

Me: Tearing up again. "I want to thank you for being generous the entire time we've been separated. It means so much to me that you haven't acted like a prick. And believe me, I know very well that you could have been one."

MW: Choked up himself. "Well, I never wanted to hurt you, Bets. Really. The fact is, YOU could have been a real bitch since this started, and I should be the one to thank you for being so patient and kind."

We ended up talking about other things before hanging up. I realized some very important things at this very moment:

1. Mr. Wonderful loves me to his best ability.
2. It might not be enough, because this is about his willingness to confront his own demons.
3. We will be friends, no matter what path he chooses for himself.
4. Our old R is completely dead. I am NOT sad about this, because it signals the most important aspect of my next item.
5. Our new R from here forward is new. We truly ARE different people now. And I accept that this must happen regardless of his decision.

I know many of you were disheartened at the thought of me forcing him to make a decision. Although I won't send my venting letter, I have issued an ultimatum in the form of three questions. The last one is asking him when I can expect an answer from him on his decision.

Some things must be encouraged in order to heal. Like a pimple. Instead of putting bandaids on it to cover it up, or continuing to lather them with medication, sometimes it's just best to let them erupt and heal, so they can just go away.

That's how I see my own life right now.

And I know that whatever happens, I will be just fine. I don't feel desolate or desperate anymore. Hopeful, for sure, but not expecting. I really believe that this is the best place to be in a process that has been agonizing and filled with anxiety and desperation.

Have a great weekend, friends.

Betsey

[holdingon]

Thank you, Betsey... I want to get there, too.

[fox_in_socks]

Hey there. Phoebe/Betsey (I like having two of you to talk to). Just wanted to thank you for being so good to me on my new thread and to cheer you on. The reason I'm actually on this board is that I so deeply respect people like you who have made actual behavioral changes. I'd like to make some, too.

I realize that if I keep listening to the right folk and asking for help, then I'll get to give some too.

What I wanted to comment directly on was that you seem so grounded -- working from a place of centered strength rather than reacting to what Mr. W does. Maybe in time I'll get my own feet planted, too.

Thanks

Fox in Socks

[KutieKat]

betsey

i am so very proud of you for arriving where you have...because you see, you have arrived here in peace. when there is no anger, when there is no animosity or resentment, there can be clear thinking.

you have realized that this is indeed your husbands journey and there is nothing you can do to change things. there is comfort in finally realizing that.

the choice is yours.

something my sister said to me while i was in california (who absolutely hates my husband) - she said "kitti, i know now that whatever happens between the two of you that you will remain friends and that is the most healthy thing that can happen to two people in your situation.

i happen to agree with that. when it all comes out in the wash, can you two remain friends? looks like it. that will indeed help you two heal and move on

that is a good thing for you, for him, and for your children

do you feel at peace? it sure sounds like it