First of all if you are going to argue with everyone. Please do it on your own thread and stop hijacking Ballast's thread.
Secondly, Please simply consider this.
Several people are telling you the same thing, and you are the one telling all of them (us) that we are wrong. When that happens in other situations in real life, it is 99.9% of the time that the 1 person claiming several other people are wrong, is in fact the one who is wrong.
Choose your own path and methodology with DBing. I can ensure you the path you discuss is a path to ruination of your MR. You want to know why i know?
I did the exact stuff you are talking about, all of it. I am on the FAST TRACK to full blown Divorce, My WW and I are in complete NC, i have a TRO against me and there is NO HOPE of recovery of MR for me.
On your own head sir.
But seriously, leave Ballasts thread alone unless you are discussing HIS sitch, go post on yours please.
OrangeK, I am not hijacking ballast's post, but giving an overview of the WAW vs WW. You are free to discuss in my thread as well. I have no issues. Again yours is a WW situation. its a bit more complex than mine. So its a different perspective. Anyways, move on to my thread, we can continue discussion there if you would like to.
M(35) F(35) T(6) M(6) BD 10/25/2017 S 3/12/2018 LRT 4/3 D Served 4/30 D Signed (Me) 5/1 D filed with Court 5/21 D Final 7/6 Moving on with life and doing lot of GAL since 7/6 :-)
Maika - I am not trying to be argumentative or giving wrong inputs. I agree that I am a newcomer and may not be as experienced as many of the forum members like you are. All I can say is every stitch is different. The timelines for NC/Dark are different. Spouse expectations for a MR is different. In all cases the spouse is wanting to leave. Some may reconcile and many usually never. Because this depends on the mindset and the actual MR and how it went through all the time. NC/ going dark is a very subjective approach. Lets assume for discussion purposes, if you had a fight with your wife and you went dark for 6 months, when you contact her back, she will usually remember the last state you left her with the argument and miseries and she will question you on that. However, during those 6 months, if you confidently approach her with NO expectations, listen and empathize her and hear her heart, that builds / bridges the communication. All i say is keep No expectations, just listen to her. You dont need to do NC / Dark for long time. Be confident in every approach without being needy. If she says get out after a fight respect her feelings and go and don't cling on. My wife was asking for space, and she felt that in house space was not enough. Hence she moved out. Now she is feeling lonely and deserted. Yes she is still angry with me. But at the same time, she feels i abandoned and ignored her. That is a small sign which shows she had enough space - "do something". Now that is the tricky part on how the LBH can handle. He can do something by going further dark / NC or he can emotionally connect with her and empathize her feelings. All i can tell you is that at this time the WAW had no idea what she wants and still in a dilemma. By you being confident and show what you can do to bridge the gap, it shows your strength as a man of courage. Your WAW will appreciate it inside of her although she may scream at you outside. If you listen to her shouts and her scream and become afraid and give up, your WAW thinks that you don't want her. Allow her heart to release the frustration. Who knows may be she can open up more or may be never. You all have criticized me on the other post of being needy, selfish, stubborn and all this. Yes I may have all these qualities. But without these qualities, I still have the courage to stay strong and expect the worst. I really don't care if anyone wants to listen to my advice as a newcomer. But I can tell you one thing. No one is more better than understanding his/her own situation than you. I may give you 100s of advices, but you know your stitch best. I know my stitch best and so does ballast his. So despite all the suggestions in this forum, One thing stands out. You do what is best for your stitch based on your current circumstances and be strong and confident!
SOrry Nutcrac but this is all very dangerous territory. The vets here call what you are suggesting and what you are doing in your own sitch as the illusion of action.
WAWs/WWs want space. You have to give it them. In my own sitch I didn't make any headway until I let go to get her back. We are now in piecing and R. Detachment is about giving space. It is about doing the opposite of what your instincts tell you.
Doing nothing is sometimes the best thing to do! I've told others in these sitches, pressure and pursuit will result 99.5% of the time in the WAW/WW running the other direction. Only when you remove all pressure and pursuit, and only when you start detaching will they start taking steps toward you. But even DBing right only gives you a 50/50 chance, and it takes time!
Where LBS go wrong is in getting impatient, giving up DBing, pursuing and pressuring. This pushes the WAS/WS away faster than anything. Especially when you DB'd well and started making progress.
Also: "Your WAW will appreciate it inside of her" this is simply not true. Pursuit and pressure does not make her appreciate it inside, outside, over or under or anywhere else.
Steve85,
I respect your advice, I have taken many of your suggestions and even applied it. I have also seen that you strongly believe in Sandi2's techniques. For example you are simply assuming my WAW is a WW. This is not the case! She is true to herself and I know her well. You should really go back and read many of Sandi2's post for my situation and how her suggestions and her opinion is different from you and many other experts in this forum.
Agreed sometimes doing nothing is the best thing to do. However, Will you do it forever?
I am doing none of the negative things here. I am not giving up DBing, I am not pursuing her, nor pressuring her. In regards to the withdrawal decision, I am standing my ground. And I am just changing the process of going into limited contact vs being dark. I expect to maintain friendly contact and try to build the emotional connect. But however I don't expect to be friends with her forever!
SHowing up at her place with sweets is pursuit AND pressure. Sorry, but I won't hijack this thread.
I will respond to false statements you make then in other people's threads:
"I want to be very clear with my position here - I AM NOT AGAINST DBing. ALL I AM SAYING IS THE STRATEGY FOR DBing SHOULD BE DIFFERENT FOR WW vs WAW. ALSO I AM NOT SAYING PURSUING FULLY IS THE WAY TO GO. YOU NEED TO GET THAT INTO YOUR THICK HEAD. "
This is wrong. The overall approach to WAW and WW is the SAME. Detach. 180s. GAL. Be the best spouse you can be. NONE OF THAT CHANGES!!!!
There are a few differences. WWs need tougher love. They need to be kicked out of the MBR if they are cheating. You do not validate their feelings if their feelings are disrepectful.
Other than that the approach is THE EXACT SAME.
I do not assume a WAW is a WW. I've said dozens of times on this board that not all WAWs are WW!! However, WWs come in many different flavors, and sandi2 will corroborate that herself. Many are in EAs and PAs. Others are into partying and acting like they are half of their age. Others are full on GGW.
But regardless. Detachment. 180s. GAL. Be the best you can be. And when the situation demands it (like when a WAW LEAVES the marital house), LRT!!
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
So up front..WOW! When I started Pt5 of my sitch I said I hoped I could make that part last a bit longer than the ones previous...LOL guess not!
Let me say that I appreciate the comments of all and the passion with which they were said. We are ALL here for the same reason, I don't have any "hijack" feelings :-) . If anything discussed in my thread helps others in their's so much the better.
As for my sitch...nothing new. I do not know if there's an OM/EA/PA. Period. The last time I asked her to work with me on the MR was back in late Apr. For the past few weeks I've had my ring back on and honestly just living my life as if she was dead. I go out, have fun and try to keep moving on. We do not see each other now as we exchange our D via the day care center. Perhaps once a week or so I'll receive from her a text on this or that topic regarding divorce and I'll reply in time and be purely business. This weekend I'll have our D and I'm looking forward to that.
She left saying she was unhappy/no feelings. Only once do I think I've received from her an "inner thought" sentence regarding the MR when she said "I'm very sad that we just couldn't make it work". I have received some anger texts the last few weeks but those seem to be subsiding. The best I know now is that she is full on with divorce planning and that "we both know Ballast has moved on" Zero idea on what she's thinking/feeling. As best I can tell she speaks to basically no one about our MR.
So I continue to focus on me moving forward and pretend as if she is dead to me. Where I am right now in my sitch makes me feel like I'm in a car driving out west...miles and miles of straight road, day after day passing along until she can file OR something happens before that. I keep hopes and prayers for us. I have moments of high pain when I think of things I could have done better/ways I could have been a better husband. I never did not love her nor lose feelings or anything like that. She and my D were/are the center of my world. I can't explain/rationalize to myself why I did not maintain the honeymoon period for her that she so rightly deserves and I'm paralyzed with sadness at times when I feel like all that I could/have improved on, I'll never have the chance to give to her. I feel like all folks, men and women deserve at least that ONE chance. I hope someday I get at least that...but it is completely and entirely in her hands as to whether or not I do.
"but it is completely and entirely in her hands as to whether or not I do."
EXACTLY. And it is completely and entirely in her hands no matter what you say or do. This is what sooooo many LBHs get wrong.
You will not talk her back to the MR. You will not romance her back. You will not nice her back. You will not pursue her back.
The only thing you can do is continue to give her space and let her wonder what you are doing. ballast the fact that she thinks you have moved on is to your advantage. She will either wake up or she won't.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
ballast- We all miss our spouses. We all have bad days. We all will make errors. It is up to us on how we handle these setbacks. On your bad days be mindful of your emotions. Practice self care -be kind to yourself but try not to dwell on the negatives. Try to bounce back by staying busy doing things you LOVE. This is probably the hardest thing we will go thru. Blessings on your journey!
M51 w50 T-20Yrs M-16Yrs S15- mad at W for not trying and giving up 1 Awesum dog BD 10/31/17 separate rooms 02/08/18 wife moved out 05/17/18
Wlf apologies as I can see that being selfish as I know we all do. Had a great day actually, no errors. We were to have started on a vacation yesterday to our special place that we both love so much and both were excited to go back to. Simply was living through the pain late last night and needed a virtual pillow to safely exhale my thoughts into.
Fighting depression...had a GREAT weekend with D, always terribly sad though to "give her back"...children should have both parents everyday...I know I'm completely unrealistic in saying that...just speaking what we all desire to be true.
Actually had some polite exchanges with W regarding D and some household stuff, she seemed wanting to speak even if purely non-R. I replied politely throughout.
4+ months now...hope of any kind is horribly hard to believe in...I guess others have gone longer...I know "the gift of time"...just journaling through present feelngs...
Ballast, sounds like you are doing fine, there is certainly nothing fun about going through this and sometimes just putting one foot in front of the other is all we can think about. Very tough not having D all the time but it gets better, I promise. You'll learn to make the most of the time you do have together, and to fill the time you don't have her with personal activities.
Regarding the convo with W, if she wants to keep talking then it's OK to chat and listen. Just avoid any R talk. Friendly neighbor!
