Affair, no feelings...is there hope? V

[sandi2]

The two boundaries I stated were the ones we had discussed--respect and transparency. The problem is that without her recommittal I don't really have the ability to enforce them since they were originally framed as requirements for a recommitted relationship going forward.

Let me see if I can clarify it a little. You don't have to have her commitment, in order for her to show respect. When she shows disrespect, you will call her out on it....and (depending on the disrespectful act) you will do something that basically has some type of consequences for her show of disrespect. That's why I was asking you what you did when you were in the theme park and she showed disrespect toward you. When you ignore her disrespectful actions (hiding to text her boyfriend) and her talking down to you or belittling you.....her feelings of disrespect will increase and she'll lose more attraction for you. Therefore, don't let her get away with disrespecting you.

When a couple has had some form of betrayal in their MR, transparency can be a means of strengthening the trust for the betrayed S, and help keep the cheating S on track while going through withdrawals. It's a way of holding her accountable, and invites you to see what she is doing. Any W who has nothing to hide, will gladly let her H take a look. Therefore, the spouse who was guilty of cheating, has to cooperate....to make transparency work. This is why there has to be an agreement about the transparency plan. She may have said she didn't have a problem with "no inappropriate relationships", but apparently, the part of her showing her text messages, fell through the cracks. If the cheater is not willing to be transparent, then you can bet they are still cheating. She can call it trash all day long, but it still spells an EA.

I believe you named respect and transparency as the two things you would need, in order to remain in the MR. Therefore, if she doesn't give you a "final answer", and the two of you continue living like a M couple......it is a win-win for her. She gets her cake with a heap of icing. Look at the vacation trip, that immediately followed the confrontation. Look at the two great fun filled days the two of you enjoyed together since returning home......living just like a normal M couple. Why would she be prompted to stop texting OM and be transparent, if she can have this nice MR without giving up her affair partner? See what I mean? She is continuing her EA while benefiting from the MR, too. She has had no consequences for her cheating. My question is why you've gone along with whatever she wanted....when she has left you dangling in the air without a "final answer" (as you call it)? I mean....what is your game plan? IMHO, you should have never agreed to go on a fun vacation when the MR is pending. Anyway, you are back home now, so what's next?

To be clear,44, this is your M....not mine. So, it is entirely up to you if you continue to put up with her cheating. I think you were originally hoping to build the respect and attraction back. (That was before the big talk after she returned from her trip.) Are you wanting to wait out the EA? I'm just concerned that she'll find a new OM when this one fizzles out. Her feelings for you will not return as long as she has some other guy giving her an emotional thrill. But, I won't repeat all this again, b/c we have gone over it in the past.

Threats to end the MR I just straight up ignore because they are outside of my limit of rationality. I would love to hear your thoughts on having stronger responses, because I feel if I actually open my mouth it just turns into a nasty argument.

She sees you dependent upon her, and she believes you are afraid of losing the MR. Threats to end the M, is a form of bullying. You cannot ignore a bully. Parents give the wrong message when they tell their kids to just ignore the school yard bully, b/c bullies become worse. You have to deal with them head on. If it were me, I'd call her bluff. Seems like it would be better than having her hold that threat over your head all the time.

How would I handle her threats of ending the M? I'd show her the door and tell her to get with it. But, that's just me. That's my personality, b/c I am not going to beg my spouse to like me or stay with me. I am not going to tolerate that type of treatment. If my spouse was threatening to end our M.....I'd personally walk him to the door and show him out, or I'd pack my bags and leave.

If she won't leave, and won't shut up, then you need to be prepared to leave the house. She brings up this thing about you should leave for a couple of months.......and it's just more bulling. It needs to stop. I don't think she'll ever desire you sexually, if she can control you with these threats. I believe her "not sure if she likes the new you" is b/c she sees you being more independent, and it's not as easy to "manage" you when you're acting like a grown-a$$ man.

FWIW, some men can put a shut down a lot of b.s. from their W, simply by using their authoritative voice. Do you know what I mean?

Originally Posted By: Sandi2

That was the perfect time to say, "If it is not what I think, then you'll have no problem letting me see your phone".

This was the point you should have held her accountable. She had said the day of confrontation she had no problem with "no private, inappropriate relationships". So, why did you allow this to just slide?

So what do I do when she squirms and deflects and denies? She will just fight me to the death and I don't know how to respond to that.

Well, you don't scuffle with her to get the phone. She has pretty much given herself away. You need to decide right now which hill you want to die on. If you say you are not going to stay in a M with a third party, inappropriate relationships, dishonesty, or whatever..... and she is not showing herself to be trustworthy, then it's time for you to take action. If you ask to see her phone (not after she deletes her messages) and she refuses, then you need to start taking steps to separate. I think you know it in your heart, but you had rather "ignore" it. It boils down to this......she is contacting her OM, so what are you going to do about it?

This is all exactly what I'm starting to realize and I am removing myself from that abuser role more everyday. I am no longer blaming myself for things or underestimating her. But I am concerned about becoming too self-righteous.

I am relieved to hear it. I have never seen anything in your posts that hinted at self-righteousness. You should know that I would have called your hand on it.

I will have to continue this in next post.