Advice on my Scenario Pt. 15-Lighthouse Guardsman

[TBSakaJ9]

So you don't know what your W is going through but even if she doesn't have any of that: is that really someone you want to be with? As long as she is a good mom to S3 the two of you can go your own ways and SOMEONE will notice you and appreciate you for who you are. This is not easy....

I agree this is not easy. It takes time and effort to get to this point. When you first get BD'd you are at your lowest and you can't imagine ever being with another woman. Over time though you start to make a shift and then you start to accept that maybe your MR was not that great after all. That maybe your spouse wasn't the best partner to begin with. Own your side of the fence, your mistakes, but don't accept 100% of the blame for your MR failing.

I found out today that my EW introduced her BF to my girls. I told her I was disappointed and frustrated that she didn't tell me but that overall I was cool. She did apologize, etc. but I know she will always operate in their best interests. That even though I am moving forward I will be there if she ever gets in a bad spot. I have accepted that she no longer wants nothing to do with me and it is obvious she is in love with her BF. As long as she is a good parent and co-parent to my D's then that is all I can ask.

I do believe she still cares for me, I know it is still inside of her but other than that she is done. I can accept that. At the end of the day you don't want to be with someone who doesn't want to be with you.

[OrangeK]

My .02 cents on the whole lying about the pregnancy?

You say she is a master manipulator. However, the only person who believed her was you. It seems as if everyone else saw through her. You defended her. So, she was only good at manipulating you.

Of course, because you loved her and didt want to believe anything bad. The question is why did you believe her and no one else and defend her to the bone?

A lot of people did not mention the pregnancy, and their suspicions of it until after BD and Affair. That being said, to answer your question, I believed her because she built my trust up, she went out of her way to make sure i knew she was there for me more than anyone else. Her Love Bombing was THAT effective. She knew ahead of time I wanted love, its part of why she selected me. She expressed strong emotion in regards to the first pregnancy, and was very convincing with her story of the BC Pills, and what OB/GYN had told her to do. Who was i to gainsay the word of her OBGYN? The only people that had brought it up to me during the pregnancy was my brother and a few close friends. She had already strongly triangulated my brother and I against each-other, so i took his suspicions as spite. My close friends mentioned it once, then i explained the story she had given me, and they took my/our word for it and never brought it up again. "Oh well not my business" kind of thing.
Her and I even joked around about how "Hyper Fertile" i must have been to beat the 0.02% of BC Pill Failure. I went around for months joking about that, and was parroting the BC Pill Story to anyone who would ask about the pregnancy. I found out later that she had been excitedly telling her friends about feeling him move several months before i saw the bump and found out, she knew the whole time.

I can speak from personal experience. There were other women exH lied to me about when we were dating. My friends knew he was lying. Everyone knew. But all I had to hear him say was I didnt do it. That was enough for me! WHy? Well, therapy and facing reality told me why. Because I was just about in the most awful place in my life when I met him. I couldnt bear to lose him. So I believed what I wanted to. I wouldnt have told you that back then, but I know I did it now.

Similar situation, except that for me, she came in to my life when i was at a lonely spot, and came in like the most loving, amazing, caring, sexual and beautiful woman i could have ever imagined. I fell SO HARD SO FAST, as was her plan and design.
You could have shown me HARD EVIDENCE she was a murderer and I wouldn't have believed it. I was SO wrapped up in being infatuated and madly in love i was blind to reality, this persisted even through my suspicions leading up to Affair exposure, I REFUSED to believe she could be cheating, lying, etc.
Which is why i was SO RAW and BLINDSIDED when the WHOLE truth finally came out.

Usually there is a reason why we trust those who arent trustworthy. Why we choose to believe them when those we love and are close to us tell us otherwise. And maybe our gut tells us not to trust either. But we do it because....

See above.

What made you trust her more than your family and friends who didn't believe her after knowing her for a short time?

Again, see above.
it only took her 3 months or so to convince me she had my best interests at heart and understood me better than anyone else in my life.

Were you terrified to lose her? if so, then why?

Losing her didnt even cross my mind, consciously. I was 110% convinced, right up until October Affair Exposure (even through all of 2017 when my Gut KNEW Something was very off, i couldn't identify what it was though. she was just growing distant, cold and quiet, in reality she was growing to despise me, and eventually feel like she was cheating on OM with me) that she would never cheat, lie or otherwise mistreat me. I thought we would be married, and in love forever, we had only been married less than a year, i was still on cloud 99.
Once i knew she was slipping away, i WAS terrified, sometimes i still am.
I believe i am co-dependent to a potentially self harming level.
I still feel like less than 100% as a single man.
I had been searching for love, and she knew it, and part of why she chose me. I was lonely. From age 18-23 i had another relationship with a pretty toxic person, and was left very abruptly by her as well, and i had a hard time bouncing back from that much more minor breakup. I thrive when I am being loved, and i know i need to work on this. I should be thriving regardless of my relationship status.
I am a romantic, I love to love, and be loved.
I used to look forward to doting on her so much, i loved doing it.
Eventually her lack of object constancy spelled doom to our MR, no matter how much i would have poured admiration and attention on her. Once she detected any flaws and saw me as an imperfect human, it became a reflection of her very flawed self image, an i was all the sudden painted black, flawed, broken, boring and wrong.

This is where you begin to be honest with yourself. Being brutually honest with myself was the hardest part of this process but very relieving when you put the pieces together.


Instead of wasting so much energy trying to figure out why she did what she did, you would be much better served trying to figure out why you did what you did. Why you jumped in so fast, why you trusted her so explicitly when she really didnt give you any reason to. Why you defended her so hard when your family could see right through her.

I think you'll find some personal honesty and explanations to this above.

time to get to the bottom of why Orange K does what he does instead of why she does what she does.

I am co-dependent, probably some self esteem issues myself, i am empathic and easy to become trusting, vulnerable to letting my guard down too early with someone who is showing me intense love.
I allowed these traits to blind me to red flags, not see the manipulation and triangulation that was taking place, and place my trust in untrustworthy sources.
This painful, marathon of hell has taught me SO MUCH about myself, what i deserve, what i dont, and what my strengths and weaknesses are.

These are all topics i will be discussing with a new IC when i get one.

[OrangeK]

As to the nerd in you...I have always felt that the Jedi were too rigid and that a code mixing the Jedi and Sith is the right way to live. (and going completely off topic for a second which is why I LOVED the Last Jedi as it seems to hint at some of that).

I agree, Grey Jedi all day. The Jedi are too Dogmatic.

[Ginger1]

See, this triangulation and susceptibility the love bombing isn't so much her, it is YOU. Sure, she chose you as a target, because you would easily fall into it.

So, in the scheme of things, the most important knowledge you can gain is the power to get to the bottom of why you were so susceptible to this. To work on those issues so it doesn't happen again. So you can be comfortable enough as not being a part of couple and provide some of your own happiness and fulmilment as a man. To not fall so hard before you really get to know someone. To see the love bombing as a serious red flag.

The work going forward is all in you. Time is completed wasted getting answers for why she is the way she is. Or why she did what she did.

Take this as the greatest opportunity for growth and strength as an individual.

[OrangeK]

See, this triangulation and susceptibility the love bombing isn't so much her, it is YOU. Sure, she chose you as a target, because you would easily fall into it.

Somewhat Disagree, Please look up the Narcissistic Abuse Cycle.
I am susceptible to it for sure, but her methods were pre-planned, deliberate, calculated and precisely executed.
I do not feel as though my (at the time unknown) susceptibility, empathy and openness gives anyone the excuse, or justification to exploit those usually positive personality traits.
She Chose me, Love-bombed me, got my mentally addicted to the endorphin release and peptides, then slowly the devalue set in, then BAM discard time.
I have identifiable personality traits such as empathy, compassion, and being a hopeless co-dependent romantic that SHE IDENTIFIED as reasons to target me as a viable source of emotional validation. She is now thriving off of the negative attention a contentious divorce, which allows her to play the victim to her whole new social circle.
What she planned and did is NOT my fault, she simply took advantage of my good nature, which in some ways makes me vulnerable to the type of mistreatment she survives on. She NEEDS it.

So, in the scheme of things, the most important knowledge you can gain is the power to get to the bottom of why you were so susceptible to this. To work on those issues so it doesn't happen again. So you can be comfortable enough as not being a part of couple and provide some of your own happiness and fulfillment as a man. To not fall so hard before you really get to know someone. To see the love bombing as a serious red flag.

Oh agreed 100%. I think in my previous post I identify MY flaws that made me susceptible to this.
A Narcissist doesn't ever see a need to change or flaws in themselves. Its amazing how they have such a flawed and damaged self image and self esteem but, yet at the same time are SO arrogant to believe they are flawless, perfect and deserving of God-like praise.

I wish i had known then what i know now (obviously), because at the time, the Love Bombing was not a red flag as it should have been. I was so hungry for that type of love, that level of devotion (false though it may have been) and that level of attention, i ATE IT UP.
NEVER AGAIN.

The work going forward is all in you. Time is completed wasted getting answers for why she is the way she is. Or why she did what she did.

Take this as the greatest opportunity for growth and strength as an individual.

I agree, and honestly it has dawned on me in the last few days that I DO have all the answers ive been seeking. They are all built into what i have learned about her personality disorder. Therein lies the explanations for all she has done to me, and others. Her wiring is actually pretty simple, she has and will repeat the same behaviors. It all boils down to 2 things really.
1.) The False self and the Real Self. The Mask and the Face Behind it. She projects this image of perfection, beauty, compassion and cuteness into the world, as her Mask, to hid the self-loathing, guilty, jealous, paranoid and vindictive personality who is constantly struggling with a fear of abandonment, exposure and humiliation. It really must be an exhausting, awful way to live. I TRULY pity her, and hope to the Heavens she eventually sees a need to get real, professional help.
2.) The need for attention. Due to the deficiencies listed above, she is in constant need of both positive and negative attention.
She needs at least 1 person in her life to Mirror who she Wants to be and Projects being into the world, and another for her to treat as scapegoat, and project her negativity and flaws upon. Once the person in position A has been revealed to her to be IMPERFECT (as ALL humans are), she sees them as deficient and deplorable, and they are moved into position B, while the search for a new Position A commences. Once this is found, the cycle begins again.

Its all in my hands, she is shoehorned into her patterns, My only objective is to move away, emotionally, and complete detachment.
Focus on myself and S3.
She is behind me, and im never looking back again.

Its all finally fitting together, and falling in place.

[OrangeK]

SO i had meeting with L last night.
Here are some good points that were made.

He said "For getting this far by yourself, you have done a good job with all this"

He believes that we could argue for better child support setups.

He said that we have an advantage with some of the things WW has done such as co-sleep with OM and S3, and her being dishonest about where she is staying with S3. He mentioned filing a form to have her verbally answer all these types of questions under oath and that this is the stage a lot of divorces get decided because the "guilty party" ends up getting very squeamish and nervous when asked to substantiate their lies under oath. He said this would be when we go in for a new settlement regarding child support. He also mentioned that the several times WW has invited me ti violate the TRO, and the times she has claimed ignorance regarding the TRO is helpful also. It shows she isnt actually in fear of me, and has had several opportunities to educate herself and request a copy of the TRO from the court and has not done so.

He also instructed me on how i can get more detailed information regarding the criminal history of FIL and the details of what he did that caused him and WW to not be able to see his other daughter. He did bad things, this i already know, but the police reports will show it in much more detail.

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Unrelated, Yesterday also included two interesting interactions with WW. One was through my sister in law, regarding the 50% of the Dr. Bill She still has not paid me back for. The other was between her and I, in regards to the 6th time i have asked to clarify what plans we are making for S3 on week of July 4th as the daycare is closed all week.
If you recall her reaction to this was "Can your parents take him for a week, and Mom, do you have any days off you can take to watch him? I dont want to miss any work"

Convo between SIL and WW:

SIL: Hi WW, I Know OrangeK had reached out to you regarding the check for your half of S3's Dr. Appointment. I would just like to be aware of when i can expect that, i belive its been a couple of weeks now. Hope you're Well, Thank you!!

WW: Hi SIL, I apologize, OrangeK hadnt told me you helped him pay that until a couple of days ago. Ive been waiting on new checks as i ran out, He told me to send him a check for the payment, so you will have to get it from him. He should have it in the mail in the next couple of days. Sorry i would have sent it directly to you if i had known that.

SIL: No worries@not a problem for me to get it from OrangeK. I just wanted to make sure we were on the same page as its been a while since S3 went to the Dr. Thanks For Following Up!

WW: Of COurse! If i had been on the same page as you guys from the start, i would have just sent it directly to you, sorry.

SIL: I understand, no need to apologize. Where it goes isnt as much of an concern as it being delivered in a timely fashion. So i appreciate you getting that out. OrangeK is aware he should see it in the next few days Have a good rest of the day!

(it should be worth noting she told ME, she had already put it in the mail a few days ago.)
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Convo between WW and I

I have asked about 5 times over the last week and a half about how we are scheduling July 4th week with no daycare for S3.
She has ignored me each time i asked.

Yesterday 2:30pm.
Me: Please let me know about what dates you would like S3 to go up to my parents house, i need to make plans with my mother regarding when you or I will be dropping him off and picking him up with her that week.

WW: NO REPLY

5:21pm
ME: I am sending S3 up to my parents house on June 30th. You can meet up with them halfway to their house on July 7th At the travel plaza we have met them at before. Please just get in touch with my mom when its close to that day so you guys can choose a time to meet up.

5:22pm (notice how she ignored me ASKING about it for 7 days, but when she hears something she doesnt like, i get a reply WITHIN THE Minuet)
WW:Well i was going to text you and makes plans for this once I wasnt busy and we could actually go over the schedule together, but thank you for making those plans without me and telling me where i need to be and when. *"OK" hand symbol Emoji* (her favorite sarcastic emoji)

6:21pm - WW: I will be in touch with your mom that week to make plans before Saturday. It will most likely be a morning/earlier in the day pickup.

I chose not to reply to these as the seemed like they would turn into an argument if I did. She didn't like being told where and when things would happen, even though i asked her "What dates would work for you" several times.


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When i told my Mother the above conversation her reply was this.

My Mom: Dad just said....."She'll pick him up when we make plans that work for everyone, the world does revolve around her."

Im not going to be a jerk, and will be accommodating, but she is not going to dictate to me, ever.

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So much passive aggressive bologna.

I am really finding detaching these last few days easy.
Shes making it easy for me not to want anything to do with her.

[OrangeK]

Just filed request to get the full police reports from FIL's arrest.

[Vanilla]

My thoughts

Love bombing is a particular stage of the sweet cycle and those who haven't been in that cycle can't understand it. The love bomber mirrors the love bombed, they are feeding back who they are to the love bombed target. You are as a target effectively falling in love with yourself.

The predator does this because they can and it works. As a target you come already primed from an earlier dysfunctional R, carrying a neon sign saying 'only predators need apply'.

This is your second R of this type, so the only way of dropping that sign is to explore yourself and become. Being self aware and understanding the dynamics is important to preventing this again or being sucked back in.

I like your L and I like his strategy, just an aside the question in court issue is great. My L did that on the G living with his landlady! in Italy and her assets. They did ask me questions on my new R they were sure I was having with a gay guy in his 70s. Hilarious. There alternate was a client for whom I do tax returns for him, daughter and wife. A wonderful happily M man who has an orthodox religious belief.

I have one thing I wanted to say and I have waited to say it until your sitch is more stable. It's this. Please get a paternity test, am I saying this because I believe that the little guy is not your son? No. It's because I believe he is your son and getting that confirmed now will cut any games in that direction. Proving it later may be tough if things go nasty.

You are an awesome dad Orange.

You have come a long way since arriving here.

V

[OrangeK]

Thank you Vanilla. You have been paramount in my advancement.

That post is a great one to lead me into the weekend, I really appreciate it.

WW is just making herself look worse for court, and VERY effectively making me happy she left me. I was suffering in an abusive R and i didnt even know. Now i have the tools to make sure it never happens again.

[OrangeK]

Feeling great about life. Seriously something happened in the last week or two.

IS this the "Ah-ha" moment?

1.) I have realized how long I was actually UNHAPPY with WW, i would have told you I was as happy as could be this time last year, but I wasnt. I was miserable. I can even recognize that i was blaming my misery on external factors, money, work, friends, when the real source of my unhappiness was my WIFE. The one person i thought at the time was perfect and blameless, who was already cheating on me.

2.) Wow. The energy you exude into the world really is what comes back. Since i have stopped wallowing in pity, all aspects of my life have improved.

3.) I have still had teeny flashes of something resembling missing her, but its not HER i miss, its just the feelings she produced when she was giving me the crumbs of attention.

4.) my largest bastion of negative emotion at this point is pity. I feel so bad she has to live her life like this.
I mentioned my "Fear" of her staying with OM forever, firstly, i am almost certain this wont happen. I am a man of science, she has established CONSISTENT patterns, the laws of probability and odds are very much against her. Secondly, If it were to, i know it would be an unfulfilling relationship based on a foundation of lies and misdirection. OM is a cheater, WW is a cheater. They deserve one another.
I know that the marriage WW and I could have had if she had the emotional maturity and correct personality traits to allow her to truly LOVE, it would have been an amazing MR.
However due to her condition, not only is she very very ill equipped to maintain an emotional and intimate relationship, the same traits cause her to have no ambition, no drive, she wont stick to any goal for long, she is lazy around the house, and creates problems where they dont need to be. Its all very self destructive, counter productive and sad.

I will wait, quietly and patiently, as i move on with my life, and hope that one day she will seek help.
I will be willing to help her when that time comes. She is my sons mother, and what we did share once, was for a time, even if doomed, loving and fun. We shared important life milestones. We made a child, we got married, we went on vacations, we went on a honeymoon. We planned and dreamed together, Maybe one day she will remember that and open up and tell me what went wrong. Maybe not. Either way, I wont abandon her to the wolves in her own mind, but she has to start fighting them off herself first.

I listed a lot of goals for myself, its time to focus on those.

I need to get back on a firetruck. Soon.

I think i am heading into the mountains tonight for a solo sunrise hike.
Its time, I've been wanting to for ages.

I'm gonna leave the last threads of my pain up there, absorb the beauty of nature and marvel at my insignificance in comparison to the world at large. Fill up on clean, morning air, and descend to truly start my new life.

I do NOT think it is a coincidence i have had these epiphanies right as Summer Solstice shows up. It is a time for new life, new love, growth and beauty.

"In the depths of Winter i finally learned that in me was an invincible Summer"
Albert Camus