We were from East Asian (so please forgive me for the poor English writing). We have been in love since 2007. We came to US in 2009 as students, and both started working a couple of years ago. We have a 4-year old son. We are both 31 years old.
What happened (BD) During 2017, I was under a tremendous amount of work pressure and have been working very late in the house. So sometimes I sleep in a separate bedroom (a big mistake). In the mid-Dec of 2017, she told me she no longer loves me and does not want to sleep in the same bedroom with me anymore even if I want to. At the beginning, I under-reacted to this. We even negotiated terms such as we can have sex once a week etc. I then started reviewing our marriage and realized how terrible I have been as a husband and father. I solely focused on work and basically ignored all their needs. I took her for granted, for years. I provide the family very well financially but nothing more. So I started making some changes such as spending more time with them, doing some household chores. She welcomed all my changes but didn't agree to get back to normal, i.e., sleeping with me together in the same bed.
On Feb 14, 2018, I took her to a very nice restaurant with a well-prepared gift and we talked a lot. We came back very happily, and she kissed me saying she wanted to see if there are any sparkles. But unfortunately, she said still no. It hit me hard. I finally lost my control a week later and we had some fierce arguments. I was begging in tears and telling her how much pain I was in, basically I was doing everything that I should not do (I realized this after I discovered this website). Of course, it only made things worse. One day she texted me and want to stop the sex. She said she is willing to work on the marriage but she doesn't enjoy having sex with me as she felt she was used as a sex tool (this feeling come out repeatedly). I agreed at the time, but it really hurt me a lot. A couple of days later I lost my control again and said if she wanted to take it seriously then we should acknowledge her parents about this. Her parents have been playing a very important role in life. She was strongly against it. She told before that if her parents know about this, we will not have any chance of future. But we talked to her parents anyway because we were in the extreme emotions. Deep inside, I had some hope that her parents may be able to convince her otherwise. It didn't work. Her mother even came here from abroad to visit us for several weeks and help us to amend things. Nothing good came out of it, other than she agrees to no divorce, at least before our S4 gets old enough. She was under a lot pressure from her family. I knew this but I was hoping that the pressure could make her give up the idea of separation and get things back to normal.
Of course that made things worse. She started exhibiting some signs of depression. She becomes cold to me, to her parents and even to our son. She told me she wants out, she doesn't want to be a mother, a wife and just wants live alone with no one bothering her and no responsibility. She wants to move out and leave our S4 to me. She started playing online video games more intensively after work, which was something I brought her in. We used to play a lot together when we were in school. It's way of escaping for her. She gets easily irritated, especially for our son. She once asked me if she is sick because she gets so easily annoyed when S4 doesn't listen to her. But she loves our boy so much, and we both know it. She admits having the child has permanently changed our R, and that has contributed a lot to the status quo. She told me multiple times that our son is such a great boy but she is not a good mother and I am not a good father. At some point I even thought it was postpartum depression that is in play.
EA or PA There is absolutely no chance of PA. We moved to this place a year ago, and we barely know anyone. She is a very quiet person and almost has no social interactions other than some other moms from daycare (typical for Asian females). I suspected if there is an EA. I snooped her phone and the online game account. I found there is a player trying to pursue her but she didn't respond. I confronted her and she said it's just a player. I asked her to delete this player's contact and she did. I asked a few more times later on about the details, and she didn't offer any explanation and saying there is really nothing to say about it. I asked if she is in love with any other person, and if that is the case, she can have whatever she wants and I will let her go. She denies it. But since then, she started locking her bedroom door, even though she is sleeping upstairs and I am in downstairs. I asked her about this. She tells me it's complicated, mostly because of feeling insecure. She is scared that if I lose control again and would have arguments with her. She in couple of occasions would go out to stay in a hotel. She read books or watch some soap episodes. It was an escape for her, from me and our son. I asked what she can get out of this. She said a peace of mind, not thinking about anything.
Her State of Mind She has a lot resentment for me. There seems to be a lot of painful memories in the past that she can't let go. She says she never regretted our marriage and she was truly in love with me, but now she is not. She said I was not treating her nicely in the past, and now I regret it, but there won't be any chances. She says her functionality of being a wife and mother has died (she meant mentally). One of the biggest complaint is that she felt she was treated as a sex tool. Whenever I needed, I will chase her around, but I leave her alone when I was not. She felt she was a housekeeper, a nanny, and a sex tool. I acknowledged all this, although not my intentions, but this is indeed how she felt. She would sometimes send me a text (during the work) about something I've said in the past that might hurt her feelings. For example, one day she sent me a photo of a flower in her office and saying that I mentioned a few times that the flower was not pretty when she bought it, but it looks quite pretty now in her office.
In Summary she doesn't feel love for me anymore. The mistakes I've made in this process have pushed her even further. She wants to leave me, but she doesn't know what to do with the child. My biggest question, of course, is how to save our MR. More specifically, I don't know what I am dealing with. Should I take the approach of the WAW or WW? I should definitely do 180s, but I am not sure if I should detach. The cause of all this is because I didn't pay enough attention to her and she felt I was distant and didn't love her. I have done so many wrong things, but she hasn't taken any actions yet. I feel I still have some chance to save my MR. She loved me so much and has sacrificed a lot for me in the past, it's time for me to love her back. Could you please help?
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support). Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down. Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL). DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
I should add that we are both relatively mentally immature. We've been in school for so many years. She has been a naive girl, and even now some words out of her mouth are still very childish. I guess I can say the same to myself.
H: 31 W:31 M: 6 T: 10 S: 4 BD: 12/2017 In house separation: 12/2017
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka that I totally agree with.
Originally Posted By: Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
There are other techniques in DR aside from the 180/LRT style. It sounds like you need to do some serious work on effectively communicating with her and reconnecting emotionally.
She does not feel like a person from the way you described things. You need to find ways to show her how much you respect her as a woman, not just a wife and mother.
Work on yourself regardless. Listen to her complaints and take a good look at yourself and decide if you are happy with the man you are, and if not, start working on those things that you are not happy about.
Do not expect a quick fix to this. You must be patient and disciplined. Do not get into arguments. No trying to reason, no begging, no crying. Just try and be her friend right now as much as you can. Listen more than talk. Agree where you can, try and show understanding where you cannot.
M: 40 W: 37 T: 20 MR: 13 S13, S9, S4 BD: 1/29/18 Sep: 4/23/18 (I moved out) 8/24/18 I come home, she moves out
If you want to get out of the hole, drop the shovel.
Thank you @hongaku so much for the advice. I think the point you made on " You need to find ways to show her how much you respect her as a woman, not just a wife and mother." is super important. But how do I do this? I mean I respect her inside, but if she doesn't feel that way, what I can do to show her? I guess it's silly to ask for specifics, but this process really destroyed a lot of my confidence. I no longer know if I am doing the right or wrong this.
H: 31 W:31 M: 6 T: 10 S: 4 BD: 12/2017 In house separation: 12/2017
I have found the books Connecting Through Yes and I Hear You to be good resources for learning some useful communication and connection strategies.
My suggestion is I as I said to be her friend as much as possible, listening to her and validating her feelings with agreement when possible and at least understanding if she says something you do not agree with (to show her you respect her thoughts and feelings). Doing this instead of arguing or disagreeing is a good place to start. Try not to put pressure on her for reassurances about the relationship, do not tell her you love her right now.
M: 40 W: 37 T: 20 MR: 13 S13, S9, S4 BD: 1/29/18 Sep: 4/23/18 (I moved out) 8/24/18 I come home, she moves out
If you want to get out of the hole, drop the shovel.
I feel my situation is slightly different from many stories I read from here. In my case, I think I deserved it. Although her way of showing this to me is a bit extreme in my opinion, I indeed failed her to be a caring husband and father. I put my work in the priority relative to the family. She complained in the past but I didn't listen or didn't think it was serious. Now she is done with me. I am full of guilt when I think about the past, and I can't stop thinking about it. When I look through our chat history from the IM app, I can see how much she loved while I was putting work before her.
H: 31 W:31 M: 6 T: 10 S: 4 BD: 12/2017 In house separation: 12/2017
You cannot change the past, do not dwell on it too much. Learn from it, but self-blame will not help you move forward. Maybe she is done, maybe she is not. Do not take everything she says 100% seriously right now as far as when she says things that are absolute negatives like that.
M: 40 W: 37 T: 20 MR: 13 S13, S9, S4 BD: 1/29/18 Sep: 4/23/18 (I moved out) 8/24/18 I come home, she moves out
If you want to get out of the hole, drop the shovel.
Can't agree more on that. It's just sometimes very hard to overcome these feelings.
I will be going for a trip for a month with the child. Hope this can give her more space and time, and help me to stop pursing. Should I keep the contact at the minimal when I am away?
H: 31 W:31 M: 6 T: 10 S: 4 BD: 12/2017 In house separation: 12/2017
