Can I really do this #3

[hoosjim]

Absolutely true. My W's bff (and my W, while she was in the throes of WW-dom) constantly repeated the mantra "you know, the kids are really being awesome, they are really taking this so great", as she and her H split, divorced, she told the kids about the A (code word "New Friend") that bff was having, and then moved the herself and the kids 1000 miles away. The truth, however, was that the kids were downright miserable, in one case clinically depressed, angry... in a word: completely effed up. But W's bff didn't care as long as she could repeat the mantra that let her feel guilt free.

It really is like they have a script they all read from.

[hongaku]

Just keep on doing you, JS. Sounds like you are on the right track and doing the right things. Patience and resolve.

[hoosjim]

Thanks for the feedback guys!
I am hesitantly optimistic.

She hasn't mentioned anything about it and neither have I, nor will I. It was a moment. Whether it was looking back, guilt, missing "us", or whatever that caused that moment, I am glad I was awake when and got to experience it on my side. She kind of crawled back in a hole yesterday and when I got home she said something like "woke up in a bad mood and it hasn't gotten any better with the kids today". Acknowledged her feelings, went on my run and on with my evening. I realize this is a long process and there will be many, many bumps, set backs and crazy emotional things happen before this can even remotely get better so I am settling in for the duration.

JS, I really, really hope and pray that this is a positive sign. Just keep paying attention to your DB-ing and remember that there may be positive signs, your W may actually let down her gaurd, draw closer for a brief spell... and then pull back again, especially if you make a big deal about it or, in fact, even mention it. I saw this my WW over the course of nearly a year and half so many times i can't even begin to tell you. Even if it is something they know you saw, heard, or experienced, the WW can very well and quite likely will deny it ever happened or put some negative spin on it.

Keep DB-ing. You need to make her come to you.

[Davide]

You need to make her come to you.

Isn't it more that you need to be open and wait until she WANTS to come to you?

I dont think we can make WASes do anything.

That said, this does seem like a positive sign. I wish you all the best and hope that it continues progressing in a good direction.

[hoosjim]

Isn't it more that you need to be open and wait until she WANTS to come to you?

You say potato...

But, yes, i suppose the word "make" is somewhat antithetical to the DB mindset. You can't control someone else you can only control you. But i think we're saying the same thing.

[Dtrmned]

I totally believe W was temp checking me a few times yesterday afternoon and evening.

#1
W: Man, my back really hurts, I called the dr and waiting to hear from him. It feels like if i bend over its going to snap in two.
Me: Hate that you are in pain. I hope the dr. calls you back soon and figures it out.

Kind of just went on doing what I was doing which was going through the mail. She got up and did her little lean and stretch right in front of me with a couple of moans and groans. I didn't pay attention nor say a word. Eventually, finished the mail and left the room.

Wife had said a while ago that she didn't want me commenting or helping with her health issues any longer. She thought I was too intrusive. These are long going chronic issues that are dealt with on a day by day basis and it does determine her mood, what she can do, and what everyone else could do (in the past).

Just some more info prior to next temp..
She is on her phone a lot. She does not talk to anyone that often, but texts and/or chats a lot. She has been on this path for several years as her health has declined, she finds it easier to communicate this way as she can shelter away with the text/chat through her issues and choose when to respond. Prior to the health she was WAY more outgoing and social.
She is very protective of her phone. Doesn't like anyone to touch it, etc. She has always been this way. I don't know why, but she is. There have been times over the years that I have used her phone and even been using it to search, take pictures, etc. So during those times I never saw anything to point towards something going wrong. Never been an issue. Practicing the detaching and DB'ing parts of don't worry about what she is doing presently whether you are there or not she is going to do it, I have followed that rule and not been concerned or anything regarding with whom and how often she is communicating.

ok, so #2
W was just sitting on the chair across the room reading and picked up her phone. She just started chatting that she was texting one of our D's friends Mom and then kept telling me each time they went back and forth as to what they were saying. A little weird as this just came out of nowhere and the subject was not pertinent to anything that was going on with either kid.


#3
Not sure if this is a temp check, or her just covering her ass. So, I believe my WW is also looking head on and deeply into an MLC. Examining her "quality of life" is my life where I want it to be, could it be different, what if? Watching shows that depict a fantasy lifestyle. You know the type. The perception of reality through television where no one really works, looks amazing, has no problems (other than the plot line this week), eats anything they want, are constantly vacationing at some exotic locale, eating at a fancy restaurant or at their lush mansion with butlers, maids, etc. So I also believe that she is living a little vicariously through my D and her friends. She laughs with them, talks boys, etc. I love that they are this close and my D can say anything to her Mom. I want to be sure they always have that kind of communication. I do believe my W is getting some "lost youth" through this and feeding along with her fantasy. Just my opinion as an observer on this.

So, she texts me as I'm going to get our D and says that she screwed up and shared something that one of my D's friends had told her with the friend's mom. Turns out that this was a bad issue between other Mom and D and now there would be trouble. W was concerned that she had broken a confidence with D and her friend by telling Mom. I assured her that she did the right thing. I asked if our D was in that situation if she would want another parent to tell her and she said yes. I responded that you did what a responsible parent would do so you are good. So the temp check came next (I believe) she wanted to be sure that I was going to keep this secret from our D and her friend that she is the one that told her Mom. I said I absolutely would as I wouldn't want to damage her communication and relationship with our D or her friend.

I only mention the third as it was a little strange and she had doubled back 3-4 times to be sure I was going to "not tell" on her. She was also complaining about how the kids are driving her crazy. I think I mentioned a couple of week ago that it takes about a week after the kids are out of school for them to get on her nerves. Everyone getting used to the new schedule. This time, it happened after day 1. 3 weeks ago the last day of school was a Thursday so Friday was their first full day out. I got home and she was VERY frustrated and stated how they were already driving her nuts. I validated this and realized within myself that she just doesn't like having her space invaded. Even more so with what is going on. The peace she had in the few hours while they were at school gave and fed into her fantasy. Now it is in front of her 24/7. I validated her feelings again, and moved on.

Other than that, it was a very pleasant evening. More conversations with my W that I have had in a week. I always ended them and steered them back to the topic when she veered.

I have no idea where this is going to go. I could get a call or text tomorrow saying she filed or made a mediation appointment. That I can handle and am prepared for. I just don't know what to do if she goes the other way. What happens if she wander over to my side of the bed one night and wants to get physical? Is this a temp check or a way for her to hold on to me? We have spoken on physical intimacy prior and I have made it clear that as long as there is no one else in the picture, that I am good with us having a physical relationship as we are husband and wife. I also let her know that if this did occur that it would and will not change our situation. I wanted to be clear that I didn't view sex as the savior for our relationship and if we did have an intimate encounter, that it doesn't mean that "we are good" or that we have moved to a different place in our relationship. This was a few months ago and we haven't spoken about it since and we also have not had any "encounters" either.

But I am very perplexed as to what I would do and what I should do.
I know this is just speculation, but I need to be prepared for anything. I love my W very much. Prior to all of this, even for 20 years, we have had an amazing and on going very satisfying sex life. I miss it. I do know for my W, because of what happened in her childhood, that she has a huge difficulty overcoming a lot of these issues to allow herself to be with someone. Even after our time together she still has a lot to deal with from what happened WAY before me. BUT when she is in a good place, it means so much knowing who she is and that it means a lot with her wanting to be with me. So I am asking, if this happens, what should I do?

I know, way too soon and the D could be filed today. Who knows what today brings and yea, maybe I am dreaming a little bit.

Looking forward to responses...

[hongaku]

I would say that sexual intimacy in your current sitch is letting her eat cake. Giving her the benefits of marriage without needing to be committed or faithful to you. I would advise against any sort of sexual activity until legitimate talk of and steps towards reconciliation is on the table.

[SteveLW]

"o I also believe that she is living a little vicariously through my D and her friends. She laughs with them, talks boys, etc. I love that they are this close and my D can say anything to her Mom. I want to be sure they always have that kind of communication. I do believe my W is getting some "lost youth" through this and feeding along with her fantasy. Just my opinion as an observer on this."

Funny you mention this. During my W's most wayward period, she had gotten into the habit of, when picking up my D from school, of having 3-4 of my D's friends pile into her car and doing a lot of chatting with exactly what you said. Laugh, talked boys, etc.

Of course if you read my sitch this all exploded after we started piecing because my D and her friend started to act out. My W was heartbroken. And she realized she needed to become a parent again, not a friend. This included phonecalls to the 3-4 friends mothers, some were supportive, at least one was dismissive.

Note, my W was clear with my D that her behavior was inappropriate and that she was contacting the other moms to discuss it with them.

The point, you may think this behavior is helping your W and D's relationship, but moms are supposed to be parents first, and friends second. I am not sure your keeping this secret is the best thing for that. I think she probably needs to come to this realization herself, but I am not sure you enabling it is the right approach either.

[SteveLW]

I would say that sexual intimacy in your current sitch is letting her eat cake. Giving her the benefits of marriage without needing to be committed or faithful to you. I would advise against any sort of sexual activity until legitimate talk of and steps towards reconciliation is on the table.

I disagree with this. I think the DB rule is that it is okay to engage as long as A) there is no PA, and B) that the LBS doesn't expect it to mean anything other than a physical act.

IE, don't endanger your health if she is sleeping with someone else, and have zero expectations or meaning based on it.

[Dtrmned]

Steve and Hongaku thank you for weighing in.

Steve, i don't know if I am enabling my W by keeping in confidence between what parents are speaking about. When I think about it, I actually think this was a very unselfish act on my W's part. She was coming back from the "friend" side with my D and her friends and sharing parent to parent information about the teenagers and hoping we all can work together to make them better people and away from making huge mistakes.

Nothing against your opinion Hongaku and I do appreciate it and yes, she may be cake eating a little IF that situation arises, but I believe I am going to side with Steve. Everything I have read regarding DB is that as long as there is no PA (W, outside of moving the kids around has not been by herself except for a few hours Sunday morning since the kids got out of school. Hardly enough time to set something up and when we got home she was wearing the same clothes, no hair done, no make up, etc so really no reason to believe a PA is happening). Knowing my wife, IF she were to attempt this it would be HUGE for her as she would be "putting herself out there" again to me.
Sex is huge in a MR, it is not the end all get all, but intimacy in all its aspects is of vital importance.

These last few posts, again, may be for nothing and I may be deluding myself, so I am just wondering inside my head and maybe dreaming just a bit. But I appreciate everyone here, the feedback and support!