Advice on My Scenario Pt 12-Less Talk More Action

[OrangeK]

Link to Old Thread - http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2793431#Post2793431

[TBSakaJ9]

I will leave the "Why did she do this, or how could she do that" out of it because i know none of us know.

Yes, you will never know. I still have no idea in my sitch.

I struggle with NC because i have so much i never got to say and questions i never got answers to.

I understand, my EW didn't give me any answers either and the more I pressed the more pissed off she got. Even if the RO was not in place and you could press her/ask her the questions you still would not get the answers you are looking for.

1.) Ours is the only R she has ever had that did not begin with cheating and infidelity on her previous partner.

That's good.

2.) I made her feel "safe"

Great!

3.) Even though her heart may not have been in it as much as me, we shared pivitol life moments. 1st child, birth of said child, the baby stages, boht of our 1st weddings, much sentiment that she will never have again "for the first time" with someone else. I will always be those firsts.

Yes, those are memories. I share 2 kids and 17 years with my EW.

4.) how much i believe her behavior is born of deep rooted personality issues.

You are probably right.

5.) I know at some point she truly loved me. It may have been misguided love, but it was there, no different than it is for OM right now, but I am not OM and he is not ME. I am Dada, husband etc.

I am sure she did and you are correct.

Anger.
I am so hurt and furious, even 8mos later, and how grossly and blatantly i was betrayed and cast aside.

I understand so what are you doing about it? This is where moving forward comes in so you get out of the cycle and start to work out and process your anger.

Lonely - I was systematically starved of attention, affection, love and closeness over the course of 16 months. I am so hungry to feel wanted. Esp. by her, if i said i wouldnt grim ear to ear to hear her say she missed me right now id be lying. but i know she doesnt, and wont. I crave waht ive been denied. its shy she still has power over me.

These last two things you described are probably the two hardest. A good IC would do wonders, finding an outlet for your anger (for me it is weightlifting), and how to feel complete without it involving someone else.

Additionally working on your self-esteem would probably help also. What things can you do (outside of female gratification) to help you start to feel good about yourself again? I feel like we talk a lot about the past and you asking for explanations but you don't talk very much at all about the positive things in your life or what your doing to create positive things in your life. Once I started accomplishing some of my goals my self-esteem started to improve and once that happened the focus started to shift from my EW.

[OrangeK]

These last two things you described are probably the two hardest. A good IC would do wonders, finding an outlet for your anger (for me it is weightlifting), and how to feel complete without it involving someone else.

Additionally working on your self-esteem would probably help also. What things can you do (outside of female gratification) to help you start to feel good about yourself again? I feel like we talk a lot about the past and you asking for explanations but you don't talk very much at all about the positive things in your life or what your doing to create positive things in your life. Once I started accomplishing some of my goals my self-esteem started to improve and once that happened the focus started to shift from my EW.

Goals (in order of priority)
0 (highest Priority, ALWAYS): S3's stability and happiness

1: Get moved into my brothers house, as it will be rent free. Plan to save, pay off debt and get a new car while here.

2: Get all debts paid, financial situation stabilized, get a new car

3: Get my own place to live, where S3 can have his own room again, since WW leaving tore that away from him.

4: Continue the efforts i have been already doing in regards to excersize, diet, spirituality and education.

5: Hike and Climb

6: work towards getting a full time fire job, or at my friends plant making $$$$

7: Enjoy my new life with my new house, car, job, physique, and attitude.

[SteveLW]

To J9's last point, and since we can't link outside material, OK do a Google search on Good Guys To Great Men.

[TBSakaJ9]

Goals (in order of priority)
0 (highest Priority, ALWAYS): S3's stability and happiness

1: Get moved into my brothers house, as it will be rent free. Plan to save, pay off debt and get a new car while here.

2: Get all debts paid, financial situation stabilized, get a new car

3: Get my own place to live, where S3 can have his own room again, since WW leaving tore that away from him.

4: Continue the efforts i have been already doing in regards to excersize, diet, spirituality and education.

5: Hike and Climb

6: work towards getting a full time fire job, or at my friends plant making $$$$

7: Enjoy my new life with my new house, car, job, physique, and attitude.

Ok.....so this is a good start. Others might pick them apart because they are not listed out as SMART (Specific, Measureable, Attainable, Realistic and Timely) however good jumping point.

Now, let me start by saying this. YOU WILL STILL HAVE FEELINGS FOR YOUR WIFE. Those will not go away overnight and your emotions just won't disappear however the more you focus on your goals, the more you talk about them and focus on them, the more you stick to what Sandi's has laid out in her rules and the less you place all your focus on your W the shift will start to happen.

Focusing on your goals combined with your GAL activities will start to turn the ship. Combined with the support from the board and if you can get into a good IC all the better.

You have to start moving the focus from your W and her activities to you. If you don't, this cycle will continue.

You can still love her but your doing it from a distance. Don't forget she is in an A with another man, she does not deserve your attention or focus.

[Maika]

O - sorry I disappeared for a bit after our last exchange. I see that you have been given excellent pointers about what to do and what your focus should be on. I can't add any more to what they have said but just co-sign it.

For closure - let me add one thing.

Even if your W gives you some semblance of an answer why she did what she did, it will NOT be satisfactory to you. All the reasons my W gave me for BD were, IMHO, not good enough reasons for the separation and giving up on the MR.

For me the stakes were so high - the lives of little children are involved.

So, the answers will NEVER provide closure. Let go of that need to know WHY. It's a dead end.

[OrangeK]

Ok. Here goes a question that has been bothering me, it will be a speculative answer, and probably not the most productive question, but i have to ask it as i haven't because i knew id get a poor reaction if i did, but I'm asking anyway.

Its more mind reading, and speculation, but my goal is to get this all off my chest and out here so its vented and purged from my system. Bear with me.

Steve, something you said the other day has stuck in my head
"Hate is closer to love to apathy"

Based on the behaviors of WW's in general,

Despite what she may consciously think, i know she thinks she hates me, or doesn't love me. Deep down in the mind of WW, do they still value LBH over OM?

It seems they are more about the re writing of history then actual fact, which makes sense, they are avoiding the audacity of what they've done.

I consider my WW and how she was with her EX at the beginning of our relationship.

I feel like this is the cycle

She is In love with Guy #1 (her Ex)

She loses Limerence with Guy #1, and begins seeking elsewhere.

When she finds Guy #2 (the guy she dated briefly between me and her Ex, Guy #1) she begins the affair, and Guy #1 is devalued.

Then there is 6-8 Months of Guy #1 wonder WTF is going on while she is sneaking behind his back with Guy #2.

Guy #1 leaves or she leaves him.

She now uses Guy #2 to try and make Guy #1 Jealous and begin the pick me dance.

Guy #2 is a rebound, he is not recognized on social media or anything like that. He is a secret publicly.
GUy #2 doesnt last long and is discarded, he was only there to make Guy #1 jealous. (In the case between her EX and I Guy #2 lasted about 6 months)

Enter Guy #3 (me), She now claims to have healed and moved on from Guy #1, She tries to be friends with him and his new GF. This is now a year or more after R with Guy #1 ended.
She still continues to try and make Guy #1 jealous of Guy #3.
When Guy #1 doesnt do this, she pretends everything is fine and moves on with her life, perhaps temp checking Guy #1 from time to time.

Guy #3 becomes new public relationship, posted on Facebook and the whole 9 yards. (in my case, baby, marraige,honeymoon etc.)

Guy #3 becomes Guy #1. Limerence Fades again, Rinse and Repeat.

I have switched from Guy #3 to Guy #1 now.

OM is now in Guy #2 position. even over a year after seeing each-other, and 8 months after MY separation (where they have been totally free to develop their R) but she still hasn't recognized the R publicly at all. MIL and FIL have met OM i believe but that happened with Guy #2 last time too.
When she meets a new Guy #3 and I am in a New R this cycle will possibly kick up.

I think it likely this cycle takes a bit more time each run as the relationships are more serious and longer.

[OrangeK]

I cant get the puppy dog got caught eating a shoe look she game me the day after she had the affair (a month before i knew) whe nshe had been gone all night the night before, and wasnt home when S3 and i got up, so she was at home alone all day wondering where i was when she came home from F*****g OM that morning. When i got home at 4pm after taking S3 to the fair all day, she had been trying to get in touch with me like crazy all day. When i finally got home that day she gave me the aformentioned puppy look and asked for a big hug.

This is the day i should have disocvered DB.
If i had gone dark that day, things would have been a lot different.

I gotta stop with these "if i hads" and "what if i's"

[TBSakaJ9]

Yes...you have to stop. From my perspective they are done with the LBS and any value they have for the LBS is purely used for what benefits them.

[sandi2]

Sandi's rules that DON'T seem to apply due to Separation/Divorce/TRO:

If that's how you feel, then don't use them. They were written to a general audience of newcomers who arrive without any idea of how to get started.

24 - Be paitent - This seems directly contradictory from things you have told me,

No, telling you to be impatient would be directly contradictive. That may have been the way you interpreted the advice when I encouraged you to press forward and not just put your life on hold, waiting to see what she does. I do remember giving you the latter part of #24, which states, "When you pull back, it will draw them towards you". Maybe I messed up by not referring to it as a rule.

25 (no eye contact, no face to face talking), & 34

It says, "Listen carefully to what your spouse is really saying to you. Look them in the eyes when they talk to you. Do not interrupt them when they are speaking and stop what you may be working on to look at them when they talk. This shows them that you really care about what they are saying."

You say the rules conflict with your sitch. Is this an example? Because this applies to people who actually see and talk to one another! If you have a TRO, then the assumption is that you aren't going to be seeing each other face to face and making eye contact when she speaks.

33 - I CAN practice the "Don't give up hope" but several people have counciled against that, including you Sandi.

Now look, I tried to honestly answer what questions I could. I told you it was unlikely that she would suddenly show up at your door and be genuinely changed back into that girl you thought you M, and that it would probably take her getting professional help before she changed for the better. You plainly told me that you would not take her back.....and now you want to come back and say I gave contradicting advice?