Pool lessons

[Zues126]

I think people of all socioeconomic backgrounds cheat, lie, betray, get addicted to drugs and alcohol.
I dont agree that hardship keeps them in check. Lets not romantacize the working class. That argument in itself sounds a bit classist.

For sure all types of people can have these types of problems. My main point was that while anyone can blow up a family, if Donald Trump goes off the rails he could blow up the planet. In some ways more resources can mean more destruction. I'm not dying on the hill that people today are able to cause more destruction with their dysfunction than in the past, it was just an idea I was toying with.

I also dont blame society. I think ending marriage or committing acts that end marriages (cheating) is an individual decision. Its a choice each individual makes. And to blame it on society, absolves them of responsibility.

People are responsible for their decisions, but society defines the rules to the game.

For example, in society A 95% of adults are married and remain married. Extramarital sex is taboo. Affairs and divorce are condemned. Everyone is generally raised with this outlook. Society B, though, 50% of the adult population doesn't marry, 50% of those that do split up, singles continuously engage in extramarital sex, and affairs and divorce are commonplace. Each individual determines their own set of rules to play by and they can find plenty of support for whatever they feel like doing, be it divorce, affairs, etc. Now...in which society are you going to see more of these types of behavior?

You're right. Each individual makes their choice. But to me there is no question that there are going to be a lot of people that might have avoided these roads had they not been so readily available and so widely accepted and encouraged.

I'm not sure I "blame" society. I think I let go of any expectation of how I think the world ought to be to some degree. It was like hitting my head into a brick wall. The world isn't changing because I don't like it. So I just kind of shrugged and am mostly able to accept it for what it is. Then I just have to decide what choices I want to make within this weird landscape. I may not personally believe in these things, but it's not my world. In some ways there's nothing to blame society for, because by definition if the majority is ok with everything then nothing wrong really occurred. If there are no rules, can you break them?

Maybe that's not quite it, but it's late and that's the best I can explain it. People are flawed humans living in a weird world. I don't have to like it, but apparently this is how it's going to be. I'll just try to pass my beliefs on to my kids, but I'll also have to warn them that most people aren't playing by the same set of rules.

Do you support presidents like clinton and Trump who blatantly dismiss marriage? I believe jordan Peterson said he suppprted trump? Is that hypocritical and where is your stance on the hypocritical? Do you sweep it under the rug because you suppport their bigger ideologies?

I am not a Trump fan. I'm not sure if poor morals would eliminate a political candidate from contention in my mind or if I could just elect who I thought would do the best job. I'm not marrying the person, I just want them to do their job. When I was a manager I had employees and bosses that did things I didn't approve of, I left it at the office. I wouldn't be close with them, but it's pretty hard to wall off the majority of the population for acting in ways I disagree with. But there is a line I suppose that goes too far, and yeah, for me Trump has crossed it. Plus I haven't voted republican before.

As for Jordan Peterson, he's not a big Trump fan either. I think he flippantly said he would have walked into the voting booth with the intention of voting for Clinton, then saying the heck with it and voting for Trump. He believed in Hillary because she had the experience, but he was more opposed to her identity politics than he was to Trumps idiocy. Something like that. But again, I don't have to agree with him on every topic to find value in some of what he says.

On that note I wanted to share this with you guys. The first guy I found in a long time that views this similarly to me. OK, I can't do links but these are easily searchable on YouTube. Agree or not, I think they are interesting and not too long:

Jordan Peterson: The Real Reason To Get Divorced and Married
Jordan Peterson: Divorce May Ruin You

What I find amazing is that after he lays out a really good reason to stay married, the first question he gets (beginning of the 2nd video) is from someone in the audience argues that there are times when leaving a marriage is the only option. I laughed when I heard this. Typical. You can lay it on the table like "Here is why divorce doesn't work", and people immediately try to find the exception that they can use to justify their lack of commitment. I just shrug and say, yeah, you beat to that drum along with the rest of the world, see how it works for you.

I get it, there's a trade off between freedom and commitment. We live in a world where personal freedom is considered paramount. JP is a believer in voluntary enslavement in the form of commitment and responsibility.

He makes a case that in life there is suffering, and there are two strategies to try to handle that:

1. Try to avoid any commitments that could infringe on your freedom, then use your freedom to pursue pleasure and try to avoid discomfort. The problem is that you can't hide from suffering in life, it gets us all, and without anything meaningful to justify suffering the pain is even worse. And chasing pleasure is not the road to fulfillment.

2. Taking on responsibilities. This provides purpose and meaning. You will still suffer, but you'll have a reason to endure the suffering, your purpose. JP says "You want to have a meaningful life? Everything you do matters." He goes on to point out that is difficult, but the alternative is to forego the whole meaning thing.

My young pool playing friend believes in option 1. He avoids any commitments and responsibilities, and he's trying to amass enough wealth to have no financial obligations driving his behavior either. His dream is to be free to do whatever he wants, whenever he wants, with nothing limiting his choices. Without giving it much thought I think many people fall into assuming this is the optimal way to approach life. I think it's foolish and empty. And there is no way to outrun the suffering in life, so in the end it will get him just the same and he'll have nothing to hold on to. Potentially. It's not all or nothing and I wish him the best.

My best friend agrees. And it's a good thing to remember. There are days when we wish we were rich so we didn't have to deal with our jobs and problems, but then we remind ourselves and each other that we've taken on responsibilities that make us full. That the greener grass of a desert island somewhere isn't the answer. That we are blessed to have the weight we carry, because it's an honor to serve and give purpose to our suffering in this way.

I don't agree with JP on everything, but these are some of the things that resonated with me.

Thanks for posting Juju!