[s]No[/s] affair, no feelings...is there hope? III

[44tries]

I don't think they were "harsh" at all. The WW needs for the H to be firm, decisive, and strong when she is pulling this kind of stuff. That is not what a nice guy wants to do. He wants to validate! Validating is right up his alley.

I am happy to hear you thought I did well. I am not panicking about all her responses (thanks, detachment). But I will admit I was a little worried I hadn't done it right. You are spot on though, the fact she said "I'm sorry"...I literally said HA! when I read it. To answer your question, it has been a long time since I've heard an apology. It is SO obvious, all of her attempts. Now I just see desperation and immaturity. And she is starting to show her cards...but I will not underestimate. Yes, we nice guys do need to fight the validation urges when it is clearly not a situation of "true" feelings.

I agree with your previous post, I think I am getting her right where I want her. Internally, I am very close to that place too, where I just want to put that final nail in and tell her I know everything. The main problem is still the housing. You said I had mentioned I could go to a hotel...yes I can temporarily, but not indefinitely. If this can no longer be my home, it's a big deal. Not saying it can't happen but if I make that gamble and "lose", I will be living out of a suitcase somewhere. To your point about her paying the rent...technically the military pays the rent. I know that's her "job" but it's a bit different than a civilian situation. Part of that money is entitled to me--she gets more than she would on her own. By military law, the house is as much mine as it is hers. If she were to kick me out, it is my understanding that she would be on the hook for paying me a significant amount of money for my own housing while we are still married. The military is pretty good about protecting spouses because we do have to sacrifice a lot...something that is frustrating when she is entitled and it contributes to the world revolving around "her". Her career will always come first. Anyway, I digress...

"Because clearly I am out of line." I will respond soon...

Can you not see how that is manipulative? Why do you feel you have to give her a response. Yesterday when your phone was out and she wasn't hearing from you......she was trying everything. When she ran out of manipulative things to say, then tried "I'm sorry".

Yes, I see it. I guess I didn't have to respond. I didn't for a couple hours and she messaged again "okay have a good night" (I am getting pretty confident about not responding because she seems to not be able to handle it). But I did tell her it was her demanding questions that were out of line. She said "You have no idea how it made me feel." I know this is more manipulation, but I don't even know the heck she is saying. I said "how what made you feel?" She said "nothing doesn't matter." Okay, NOW i am not responding My days of going fishing are long over.

Was that the usual pattern in the R dynamics? You would beg her to not be mad? Then it put her up even higher on her throne of entitlement.

I was being a bit hyperbolic...but the pattern was definitely her getting "mad" no matter who was right or wrong and knowing I would "chase". I did NOT like her to be mad (NGS) and I would always want to keep talking trying to resolve things. It certainly contributes to the entire entitlement issue, nonetheless.

So why do you want to rescue her? She's not scared you won't talk to her. She's scared she just might lose some control over you.......now that you seem to have something growing between your legs.

I didn't say that I did...I don't think. You're right, ultimately it's about control. But if I won't talk to her, she doesn't have much control...that's all I meant.

Careful, Mr. Nice Guy. You are giving her a lot of credit for thinking logically.

Fair enough, good reminder.

Careful..........

Being careful

You just said she was hindered logistically. So, be careful where this is taking you, 44.

Now about not knowing the status of the A or OM. How long has it been since they contacted each other......that you know or suspect? It hasn't been too long ago you caught her in her room in the very wee hours of the morning talking with, assumingly, OM......and she freaked. and then later, she was texting, while turning where you couldn't see........and wanting you to cater to her.

Absolutely. It could totally be logistical. And "it" isn't even necessarily a thing. I have no clue how long it has been. I wouldn't bet a dime the answer isn't "5 minutes". I'm just saying the only gauge I have had (seeing her physically texting or being constantly online) is reading differently than before. Half of that (seeing physically) isn't currently in play. So with a half-blind gauge that could no longer even be useful (she could have gotten a whole separate account/app/phone for all I know)...I am certainly not implying or thinking it means anything at all.

Anyway........don't cave to her, imagining she is thinking something or feeling a certain way. She is wayward, and I haven't met a newbie yet (with NGS) that didn't underestimate his WW's mindset and selfish intent. Don't reassure her......and don't try to rescue her. She needs to go through this experience. You may not get another opportunity quite this easy. This could be the beginning of turning this ship around.

Wholeheartedly noted. I think it is impossible for me to truly grasp and not underestimate, so I am doing it by force. It feels like brainwashing myself to believe that 2+2=5 but I'm sticking to it. I will not jump in the water. I don't want to ruin this opportunity or momentum I have.

On the confrontation front, you said "if I don't feel ready" I can do radio silence. Do you think I could have the confrontation before she gets home? As in, it doesn't have to be in person? I know we agreed it shouldn't be over text and I stand by that, although I admit it would be easiest to control my responses that way. If I did it over the phone, and it would be just as effective, I think some of that control still applies. Worst case, I can always hang up if you know what I mean. There has been a lot of great discussion about how the confrontation should and shouldn't go and I think it's all gold. I want my plan to be rock solid, and ensure I don't make any mistakes. My main concerns are figuring out the logistical issues I discussed before, and being absolutely certain I have emotional composure and am prepared for all possible responses.

I know the road ahead will be brutally difficult no matter what happens. It is very sobering to read stories like Mowgli's (which I so appreciate!) and Steve's and internalize what the reality of recon looks like. Dealing with the mourning period over the loss of OM is not something I would have considered off the top of my head. My W needs to be willing to move mountains or I'm not interested. I am at the place where I know what I deserve and am prepared to walk away (emotionally, at least ) if she is not even close to being it. Doodler also brings painful reality into play...knowing there is so much risk it all happens again and again...heavy stuff.