No affair(?), no feelings...is there hope? Part II

[44tries]

You are conditioned to give her the precise answer to her questions. It will be an effort for you to be mindful about giving vague responses. She totally over killed with her constant calls. In this case, you could laugh at her. Seriously, start laughing in her face, instead of behind her back. But now listen........laughing at her and turning around and doing what she orders is not cool. Laugh at her and don't do what she is demanding.

WW: "Where are you"?
You: "Just out and about".
WW: "You weren't here when I got home, and you didn't tell me you were going out"!
You: (chuckle) "Why did we have a date"? "Besides, I figured you would need your
hour".
WW: "It's been more than an hour, and I don't have any dinner"!
You: "Oh, go ahead and fix something for yourself. Don't wait for me".
WW: "Tell me what time will you be home".
You: "Hummm........not sure".
WW: "Well I need to know! What are you doing"?
You: (chuckles and ignores her second question) "Why, do you have a surprise"?
WW: "Are you drunk"?!
You: "Not yet".
WW: "Are you with somebody"?
You: (chuckle) "Not yet".
WW: "(really getting angry). "You had better tell me what you are doing and you had
better be on your way home, if you know what's good for you mister"!
You: (laugh). "Don't wait up. I have to go now". (disconnects the call and turns off the
the phone).

I gave more last night, but I'm trying to keep this post shorter. Oh, BTW, when she says she doesn't know what she wants to eat......just reply with, "Well, if you don't know, I'm sure I don't".

Oo boy, Sandi. I'm glad I'm a guy that's not afraid of a challenge. I can't even imagine having a conversation like that with my W, but I am going to try! Thank you for including such specific examples, it really helps.

Don't be afraid to laugh in her face and walk away from her. When you reach the point you can laugh at her and not worry about her reaction.......you will be growing b@lls. Will she be angry? She'll probably be furious, b/c you are putting her in her place.....and she'll struggle to get power. She'll say things like, "I'm still your W and I have a right to know your plans and when you will be home". Look at her and say............"Wait, I'm a little confused here. Is this the part we act like a married couple......when you are drilling me about my personal life"? "If so, maybe you should tell me the part we act like a separated couple.....other than when it's bedtime".

She will get really angry, but that's fine. It means she is struggling to get power. If she starts demanding or ordering you, tell her, "I think you are confused. You are the one in the military, not me. You are not my commanding officer.". Then walk away. If she follows, just keep your cool, and laugh when she is rediclous. She can get glad in the same rags she got mad.

She is making up the rules to this game as she goes.......and you are going to change the entire game plan.

Okay, I am going to trust you that her getting mad is not a bad thing. You've made it very clear here that that is what I should expect and it means I'm doing it right.

But be prepared for something like this............

WW: (she may put on a sad face or mad face, expect either) "Well, I had been thinking we could resolve things and the reason I got upset that you weren't here is b/c I was anxious to talk to you about us sleeping together again. But now, I know you really don't love me, and will let me worry something has happened to you before you'd tell me anything.............yada, yada, yada. Now I know this M will never work, so I might as well file for a divorce. I'm not going to stay with a man who won't cooperate, is hateful and mistreats me..... and keeps secrets from his W"!

You: "If that's what you think you need to do, I won't stand in your way".

WW: "So, you want a divorce"!

You: "Oh, is this about what I want? That's rich". (chuckle)

However, you do not engage in a R talk. Tell her you aren't in the mood, or act disinterested and don't respond. Start watch TV, or go for a walk, or go to the bedroom and close the door.

Wow. I will admit this is going to be really tough. It might take me a few trial runs, but I think I can get there soon. I know I can do it now that I know not to totally panic at this response.

You know this her manipulating you to do her work, right? If gives her a sense of control and power over you. She was testing you to see if she was back at the wheel of this vehicle.

This is what I figured.

You: "I think I need to tell you something".
WW: "Okay.....what it is"?
You: "You are really unattractive when you moan & groan about how bad you feel and how you wanted to do all these chores but just couldn't". "It's actually a turn-off".

She may go off on you, or start bawling. Don't respond, juscow all away, or go into your room and close the door in her face. Don't apologize, no matter what she says or does! This is you calling her out on this type of crap. Whatever you do, don't do any of those chores! If you do, then her manipulation worked. You are going to stop being a nice-guy that she can work.

I did not give in and help her with any of the chores yesterday, so I think I can do this Next time she whines I will call her out. I have already started calling her out on her passive-aggressiveness. Now she makes jokes to me about it.

What a wuss! . Yeah, she works you real good. Butters you up like a turkey......,and you fall for the accommodation every time. But this is going to stop, right?

Yes

She can initiate conversation and hang out with you........as long as she is not doing it to manipulate you into doing something for her. See, it's as if she's playing trade out. She's sort of nice for a few minutes, then asks you what you are going to eat and if you'll fix some for her. That is rotten manipulation!

Understood.

Do you see how things changed when you were out? You come home and she's the one following you and initiating conversations, when it's usually the other way around. I'd say that's a good 180, right there!

Yes! It's amazing. To be honest, I'm feeling very positive. Which is good and all, but I'm really trying to make sure I tell myself to turn that wayyyyy down and know the road is looong. It's going to sound very strange, but in some ways the A is a blessing because without that I would probably be totally blinded.

Anyway, yes, it's producing great results and that really motivates me to keep going and have the confidence that you are right and I shouldn't be afraid if I make her mad or "rock the boat" on our good terms.

Work on becoming unconditioned to giving her quick, precise answers when she is being nosy. You do not share your agenda with her........okay? When she decides to end contact with OM, and stops keeping her own secrets, and starts sleeping with you like M couples should.......in other words, starts showing you respect and admiration.......then you can begin giving more precise answers to her questions about your agenda.

This makes complete sense. What if she thinks I'm playing games? My first thought if I actually imagine becoming all intentionally vague and evasive is that she is going to think I'm doing some manipulative tactic. If that doesn't matter, then I won't worry about it.

I don't think you will ever be able to be as accommodating again, b/c she is a "user". She has a sense of entitlement. You have made it much, much worse by catering to her, and hanging on to every word, and by showing how hungry you are to talk. You have to break that entitlement and make sure it never returns. Otherwise, she'll never be attracted to you. I'm not saying that after reconciling you can never do a few things for her........if she returns the favors. I just think the over accommodating killed her attraction for you, and now she feels entitled and expects you to cater to her. That's not how a MR should work.

I like your additions to the "No More" rules. You are going to make big changes, and you are going to love it.

I couldn't agree more. I am so relieved to finally understand the problem and I know I will never be able to go back. Even with the limited progress I have made, I feel more empowered and in control than I ever have before. Again, I don't want to get too excited, but I am allowing myself to be as excited as I want about the fact that I am learning and growing so much. Can't wait to keep going.


Today was a pretty good day and I didn't have too much trouble sticking to the rules. I did hang out with W at work for a bit (per her request) because I was already on base for an event. It was a great time; she was very playful and she didn't want me to leave. Her work is a good setting because the dynamic of her asking me for things isn't there. Her texting with OM has also noticeably decreased in the past few days, but I certainly have not forgotten about him and know he will probably flare up at any moment. Overall, I'm enjoying the positive day and viewing it as a nice "up" on the never ending rollercoaster.

One question--what do I do if W starts trying to join my GAL? She made a comment today that implied she might try to join my workout group, which I ignored, but also kind of freaked me out. And she thought I was suffocating...