Newbie In Need Of Guidance #2

[rminer]

She is unhappy in the marriage and on some level wants to leave it. At the same time, she doesn't want to be the bad guy and be responsible for breaking up the family, so she's looking for any excuse to pin that responsibility on you. If you're the bad guy she doesn't need to be.

I agree that I am in a no win situation at this point. I'm currently looking to turn the tables a bit and see if I can improve my standing in her eyes. There are times I can still see in her eyes or hear in her voice that she still cares at some level. How deep that is buried is another question, but I still think there is hope. I just need to find the path there.

I know most here will say that I am grasping at straws, but I've known this woman virtually all of my life and intimately for 33 years. I know the look in her eyes and tone of her voice when she is showing true care for me. It is still there occasionally, but as I said, can I bring it to the surface?

The only ones she will be able to make me out to be the bad guy to are her "friends" and herself. I have had conversations with all of my kids the past week except S8 and all of them are on my side. That is a terrible way to put it, but that is the way it was said to me. S23 said that if this ends in D, my W will be "dead to me." Scary thing is, he means it. This kid does not BS about anything.

I think she is starting to see the kids gravitate towards me, so I am hoping she will eventually see the loss and rethink what she is doing. No guarantees though.

Therefore, when you do nice things for her, she likes that you're addressed past complaints, but at the same time she resents that you're not playing your role as the bad guy.

I refuse to play the bad guy, at least in a mean spirited or vindictive way. My kids will see that I am doing everything possible to save this M. If it comes to us separating or D, I want everyone involved to understand who was the one who chose this course.

If you don't play to her historic complaints, then she resents you for your ongoing shortcomings (in her eyes) but appreciates that you're validating her decision to leave.

See the trap there? You can't win.

I see the trap. You are right I can't win at this battle, but I have to at least try to find a way to win the war (reconcile).

You focus, ideally, will be this:

1) Understand and articulate (to yourself) her *long term* complaints. If you don't feel you have a grasp on them, let's explore it. If you do truly feel you understand what she was upset about long term, what made her resentful, then proceed.

Let's explore a little bit then.

Most of her complaints that she has vocalized since this all started in November have been centered on how I don't make her feel loved, wanted or desired, I don’t listen to her and we don’t do anything with each other. I can see how she would think this if what the DR book says is true. We show love the way WE want to be loved and this is exactly how I believe we have been showing our love for each other.

I tell her and make physical contact to show my love. I touch her in certain ways and make suggestive comments to show I want and desire her.

She doesn't do these things much, but she did do things FOR me to show her love. It used to bother me that she didn't tell me she loved me spontaneously or give me hugs much. I finally realized this just wasn't her way and accepted it. It never dawned on me that this is how she wanted me to show my love too. Don't get me wrong, I did things for her, but the things I did were not always visible to her or unexpected.

She says I don't listen to her. This is BS, but not in her eyes. I listen, but as sandi said, I am not listening with my heart and letting her know I understand, at least not in a way that she recognizes. I can see this. Many things she says sound like complaints not only to me, but to the whole family. The WAY she says things have made it easy to overlook her needs and her tendency to justify wants as needs have contributed too. Some of the complaints are out of my/our control or simply not doable. Even though I have explained, by not listening with my heart and validating, I have fallen in to this trap.

She says we never do things together/spend time together and that we only do it when she arranges it. This is partially true. Her ideas and my ideas are different on this subject. She likes going out and doing things. So do I. We certainly don’t do it enough. The issue with this is that she will go do things with the kids and not invite me, or invite me at the last second when I am filthy from working and then say that I don't want to go. This comes from when I was building the house. At that time I was very focused on the house and this was mostly true. Since then I have asked her to tell me ahead of time so I can make plans to go, but she rarely does. When she does do this I go the vast majority of the time.

She will also spend the "extra" money on her and the kids, leaving nothing for us to go out with. We have talked about this many times, but she doesn't seem to understand there is not an unlimited supply.

She is very much a “live in the now” sort of person and doesn’t give much thought about how what she does now will affect the future. When I suggest things that don’t cost money, she isn’t all that interested.

She does do most of the planning, so she does have a valid point when she says she arranges things.

2) Evaluate the complaints.

She does have some very valid complaints. I can’t disagree there. Before coming here I would have, but since then I have looked at how I do things and can see where she is coming from. I don’t always agree, but I could handle it differently.

Do you think I am starting to get the picture? If so, how do I change them now?

According to the program, I am not supposed to ask for dates, do things for her that a H would do or tell her I love her/hug her. Communication is for the most part superficial, but I am trying to get her to open up a bit by the way I phrase questions.

What would be your suggestion at this point?