Quote: ...today I'm a different person than I was yesterday. It's the weirdest thing and it feels "right on". Actually it feels like a dark cloud has lifted.
For me, at the moment I'm feeling a bit disoriented... like feeling like a foreigner in my own skin. You're definitely right about how it turns everything upside down, but I'm not sure I agree that it "completely invalidates almost everything you've already read and learned on this site". It's a radically different approach, yes, but I don't think it's necessarily incompatible with what's in Michele's books, I just think it goes a LOT farther. It goes right to the CORE. Careful, Dave, you don't want to get us banned from this site!!
For me, at the moment I'm feeling a bit disoriented... like feeling like a foreigner in my own skin. You're definitely right about how it turns everything upside down, but I'm not sure I agree that it "completely invalidates almost everything you've already read and learned on this site". It's a radically different approach, yes, but I don't think it's necessarily incompatible with what's in Michele's books, I just think it goes a LOT farther. It goes right to the CORE. Careful, Dave, you don't want to get us banned from this site!!
Ooops...you are right. I didn't mean to get so dramatic. Actually, yesterday on the way to the C, my W and I were talking about self-help books and mentioned that there are good insights in all of them. The dangerous books are the "male-vs-female" generalization books named after planets. These aren't self-help but rather self-validation, cop-out fodder.
What's really going to cook your noodle is when you read PM, then take the LL concept that "we naturally provide the love languages we want for ourselves", and then ask "WHY do we do this?". Reflected sense of self....hmmmm?
-Dave (whose brain is melting).
Anywhere is walking distance if you have the time
-Steven Wright
Dunno about 5LL, but I have been wondering what it's gonna be like reading TSSM after PM. I expect I'll find new meaning in it. I can tell you that I had the weird experience of hearing Dr. Phil's voice in my head while reading much of Chapter 11. That tells me that he says a lot of the same things Schnarch does, but in a different context and with a different emphasis...
Well guys, I'm waiting for my copy to arrive from Amazon. It seems to have had a very positive effect on you Dave given that not long ago your talk was mainly about getting away. I see my situation as similar to yours (and Tim's... and CeMar's... and hairdog's... etc.). Is it the sort of book that an LDW might benefit from? Not that mine has any desire to read a self help book. SD
Quote: Is it the sort of book that an LDW might benefit from?
Unequivocally, yes. Even if she doesn't read it. Does that sound cryptic? Keep in mind, I'm not quite finished the book yet, and each evening, I read more, and I learn more. Last night, I got far enough to begin to really understand the process. Chapter 13 deals with the process itself, in detail, including theory. It talks about the "Comfort Cycle" and the "Growth Cycle". It pictures these cycles as concentric circles, with the Comfort Cycle as the inner circle. The comfort cycle includes security, safety and stability, but also boredom, dissatisfaction, etc. The growth cycle includes self-confrontation, self-soothing, differentiation, GROWTH, and risk. The point is made that differentiation is always unilateral, even if both partners enter the growth cycle together. The growth cycle is entered when one or both partners become sufficiently uncomfortable with the status quo that the pain of remaining there is greater than the pain brought on by growth. The pain of growth includes loss, because always there is a choice between two things, and something must be left behind. If all goes well, then the thing that is left behind is the "old" self. In other words, truly knowing WHO YOU ARE, is really knowing WHO YOU ARE BECOMING. So the LDW doesn't actually have to read the book... the moment you go into the growth cycle, she will be pulled in almost by default. The reason is, that you will be acting or doing something different - you will not be reacting the same way to the same situations, and she will have to either confront herself and grow, or leave. That is the crux of it. Not all confrontations are quite that dramatic, of course, because not all issues are deal-breakers for the marriage, but whenever one partner differentiates, or grows a new self, the other must grow as well, or things become unstable. That is called reaching Critical Mass. You'll be amazed at some of the stories in the book, and the amount of courage displayed by even apparently very broken people, when faced with a true "critical mass" situation. The other point is that this is a lifelong process, you don't just do it once and you're done. In fact, the first time couples encounter this, there are usually a number of issues that must be dealt with, and they are dealt with in sequence, so they find themselves going back and forth rapidly between the growth and comfort cycles. Hope this is helpful...
Yikes theres a lot of stuff in there. I'm not sure I'm looking forward to this book! I have come across the concentric circles thing before when I was made redundant and went on a job seeking course. The guy said that the job I had was in my comfort zone and the comfort zone is like a desert island. Over the horizon is a much better job but I had to swim through the shark infested water to get it. This sounds similar. I still struggle to see how me changing my approach to anything will get me to my ultimate goal where my LDW speaks to me in my LLs (sex, physical touch and words of affirmation) with sufficient desire to make me feel happy, contented and loved when she has none of those LLs, skills or desires and never has had. SD
Keep in mind, SD, I haven't actually begun IMPLEMENTING this stuff yet. I'm still trying to integrate it, although I have to say I've totally surprised myself at how quickly I've gotten through the book and begun to understand it. I'm fully expecting to hit a wall when I begin trying this stuff, and then all my newfound knowledge will be definitely put to the test. I'm confident that when that DOES happen, I have a whole new set of tools to fall back on, and I can get through it. All week I've been posting a LOT of stuff here, for a couple of reasons. First, typing this stuff out helps me to solidify the knowledge for myself (it's one of my learning styles). I can even practice it and model it for myself to some extent by doing that. Secondly, the exchanges that have resulted have again allowed me to further think things through and integrate the material. Also, the kind of excitement this book generates by just reading it just has to go somewhere. W has not begun to see the changes in me just yet... they've all been internal so far, but very soon (probably within the next two days) she will begin seeing the New Me. Not all at once, of course, but it will definitely be there. I confess I'm not quite sure myself just where all the linkages are, but I'm confident I can discover them as I begin working on this stuff. I'll keep you posted. Keep the faith...
Gimme a chance, CeMar, lol! I've said in several posts already TODAY that I haven't put anything into practice yet... I haven't even discussed this book with W yet... That's coming...
