How a treehouse can cost you your marriage 2

[MoveFrwd]

I was surprised to see that she did not remove her ring and that she is still sleeping in the Mstr bed w/ me

I dont understand. You said she should be living in the apartment, and yet you are still OK with her sleeping in the same bed as you? Which is it?

This a.m. kicked off close to a 5 hour convo... I will summarize as much of it was painfully repetitive... why I allowed it to go on so long, I don't know - I went against the solid advice I have received here.

I wonder at what point you will stop having these circular discussions by yourself. You say it's 'hard work' to her and point out what needs to be done. So why arent you following that? Frankly, I think you are doing more harm than good right now going at this alone.

W: So we need to talk, I'm nearing the deadline for my apartment.
M: Sure, I'm all ears, do you have any new thoughts about the sitch?
W: I think we jumped into this too early.
M: I agree, so now that we are here what now?
W: I kinda think I should move back to my apartment.
M: It's probably for the best.
W: I worry about the kids, they are so much better off when we are together as a family, it's better for everyone, even me and you. I was severely depressed when I was living at my apartment, I missed my kids, I missed you, I missed the times we had.
M: Sorry to hear it was so rough for you, I could see that you were not happy. I agree about it being best for everyone, and I know that is a completely viable option, I told you what I am willing to do to make that possible, you are the one saying you can not do the necessary things that are crucial for our MR.

I feel like this was the perfect end to the conversation. You restated your boundary pretty clearly without really passing judgment or pursuing.

W: I will not live in the past....blah, blah, blah......
M: do you realize the TRO is the worst thing anyone has ever done to me in my life, and then to have it done by the person I love the most, I could not fathom doing that to you.
W: Look, I can't say sorry right now, I told you why... I will promise you that will not happen again. (I did sense some sincerity in this comment). I just have a real problem w/ how and why it was brought up.... (some more of the same convo hat transpired last time)
M: Look, I hope this is not taken the wrong way, I'm not saying you have issues or anything like that, but maybe it would help if you saw an IC, you mentioned you experienced depression at the apartment, you could also bounce some of the issues we are having off the IC and get another point of view.

And then it all kinda goes off the rails. What is the point of all this (and the rest)?

M: Look at this point I am at peace w/ the sitch, its not how I wanted it to go, but here we are. I don't know what else to say and don't know that discussing it anymore is going to help, kinda feel like we are just trying to prove who is right.

And this again is really good......until you allow yourself to get sucked back into a huge discussion.

She went back into how she feels sex is to much of a priority for me... a bunch more of the same convo, what was different though, was this time she blatantly tried to use sex as leverage.

W: So do you really think if we went to MC and dragged up the past that would be best for home life? Are we going to come home after the MC sesh's and be all lovey dove on one another, think its going to be a good environment for the kids.
M: I already said it is not going to be easy, but I can tell that by your current view of it that its likely not going to be effective at this point. That being said, if you wanted to go with the intention of strengthening our MR, it would do just that.
W: You realize that if we were to go that would be a big set back, do you think I'm going to want to have sex w/ you, it would probably be a good six months before that happened. Do you think I want to have sex w/ you right now - no its going to be a while, I'm starting to have those feelings again, that I do not want to be intimate w/ you after all this.
M: Really six months? Were did you come up w/ that time line? You don't think I see what is going on here, you are using sex as a method to control, were is the intimacy in that. And as long as we are talking about control, you have been very controlling over the last year, I'm not going along w/ it anymore. (I wanted to say abusive but know that would of ignited her, last year our MC said her comments/actions were abusive, she went off the handle... little more was mentioned about it for two reasons - Her reaction to the comment, and my pride. I am a big strong man, admitting that I am taking abuse does not fall in line w/ that... perhaps if I insisted on addressing it back then it would not of metastasized in to what it is today.

Curious as to what sex means to you. While this woman is in this state and clearly still rebellious, what are your thoughts on sleeping with her?

I feel that there is some block, maybe a sense of vulnerability, something that is getting in the way, from intimacy, communication, to remorse.

There is. Her waywardness and rebelliousness (if thats a word).

Of course it does not excuse her actions, but the way she is during the daytime along with the possible long term effects of her traumatic childhood reason enough for me to be more patient?

Even if she knows of her deficits they would not be called out - but now that they are should I give her time to come to terms w/ this, to self analyze and want to truly heal?

Id say when in doubt, ALWAYS lean towards patience.

What do you think about her stance on the TRO? Like you said she is being honest, and again, to yours and my mind set it is shocking that she thinks this could justified, and if not justified then rug swept. Now that she is in the know as to what it is going take for our MR to heal from it, should I give her time to come to honest terms w/ it?

I notice in your communication with and about her, there is a lot of "Im right and she is wrong" slant to it. For example, you call what she needs as "honest terms". But it isnt that....you said she is being honest with you and herself. What you want is her empathy and understanding of YOUR terms and YOUR needs. She says she wont do it again, but those are only words. Your expectation is for her actions to back those words up. Her willingness to resolve unresolved issues, her attentiveness to your needs....those are the kind of actions that will SHOW you that she means what she says. When the words dont match the actions, it tends to be the actions we believe.

Thats why Im questioning you on some things above. Your words to us seem legit. But you are allowing her to continue sleeping in bed with you, you continue to engage in long discussions about your boundaries, etc. What are your goals? Do your actions back up the process to achieve them?