I'm glad everyone is responding so well to my question! I really think that understanding your own response is important, but understanding your SO's response is maybe a little more important. For instance, while my H and I may be having frequesnt sex, we may not be ML often enough for me to feel satisfied. Which actually kinda feeds back into the whole MB thing...if I feel we're only HS, then I feel it is an itch for him. Hmm...
Quote: Regarding your other problems, what do you mean it was only sex? Are you saying that his technique was really really bad?
LOL, goodness no! Sorry if I wasn't quite clear on that. And I guess since it was my question, I should answer it.
I would define HS as being just physical. Any quickies, any 'animal sex', anything that doesn't involve foreplay, just an 'i'm horny' and away we go. (Which, BTW, never comes from me.) It's more of a physical release than a time to bond together as a couple.
I would define ML as a more emotional act. I would agree that you don't neccessarily have to have intercourse in order to ML. But for me...it helps alot. ML for me includes foreplay, kissing, touching, petting my hair, rubbing, massaging, an emotional connection. ML doesn't have to be slow and sensual; it just needs to be about us together instead of just about physical pleasure.
Sometimes both partners may have different views. So, again, I think it's very important to understand the different views you and your partner may have.
Yes, I agree, both are vital to a M. I can't imagine how my H would feel if I absolutely refused to just HS. Being the LD spouse, I don't ever seem to need the physical release that he does. But part of a M is to give of yourself to your partner, and to do so in a loving way. Besides, I like knowing that sometimes I just turn him on so much that he can't stand it!
I know I keep saying this, but you definitely should read Passionate Marriage by David Schnarch. My C recommended it as the standard that most Cs are using. It covers this topic in a big way.
Anywhere is walking distance if you have the time
-Steven Wright
Quote: ...you definitely should read Passionate Marriage by David Schnarch.
I just decided to try looking for the book at my local library. Luckily, my library has a web service available - I was able to confirm that they HAVE a copy, that it is checked IN, and I put a HOLD on it - I'll be picking it up tomorrow! This should be an interesting read!
So many books to read! Hopefully I'll get to that one. My H and I have only been M1 (we're both 24), but it's always good to read other POVs and do some preventative maintenance. I wish I had found this board when we were going thru these things - it would have been a tremendous help.
What I have found as the lethal combo of books is....
1. Passionate Marriage by David Schnarch. I can't keep praising this enough because it really tackles the complexity of relationships, sexuality and their relationship to one another. PM is the first thing that actually worked in our sitch and will be the roadmap for the rest of our marriage. Man, if I could afford his Intensive Therapy, I would fly my W and myself there tomorrow.
2. Gottman's "Realtionship Cure" which is way more than marriage related. It's completely focused on how we communicate with one-another. While good communication might prevent divorce, it does nothing for "spicing" up the relationship though some (like my W) would say that a partner's communication skills can be a total turn off. It's also a great resource for communicating with your parents, co-workers, children, and friends. An excellent resource for a better understanding of yourself and others. The audio version is really nice.
3. The Sex Starved Marriage is worth reading because it pays for this site. It's very solution oriented but it appears that it works best when the LD spouse is "looking around the room for their libido" and want to get it back. Still buy it. But if you can only choose 1 to make your spouse read, then Passionate Marriage is probably a better choice. It gives you lots of things to talk about and will challenge both of you with some tough medicine.
Anywhere is walking distance if you have the time
-Steven Wright
My H and I started reading SSM together, but we don't really feel like it's speaking to us a whole lot. All of the sits in the book deal with older people or with people who have kids. Neither of those apply to us. The only things I really learned from the book are that a) my SD didn't just disappear, I need a little boost to get it going, and b) sometimes my H probably feels way different that what I think he does. I'm glad I read as far as I did, because I found this place. Everyone here (ESP you HD guys!) has helped me realize that my actions (or lack thereof) really influence his actions. You've helped me understand that it isn't always just about sex. When my H and I go for long periods of time (2 weeks+) without HS or ML, I feel so incredibly distant from him; I start to treat him pretty badly, avoiding him and getting very upset over nothing. I now understand that while it may take me that long to have those feelings, it may take him only a few days.
However...I was so ready to learn from SSM when I bought it; I was excited to start working on getting my SD back. But now that I've read it, I really don't feel like it was really worth it. (Other than, of course, finding this site and all you wonderful people! ) So I'm wondering...will PM hold anything useful for me and my H? You guys are the ones who encouraged me to just tell him that I need more ML than HS. (That conversation is worth its own thread!) So will PM help us in anyway? Now that we understand each other's needs...what can we gain from PM?
PM will give you insights into the psychological things that actually drive "real" desire and passion in a relationship and stresses the fact that "marriage" notoriously causes a "meet-in-the-middle" thing to occur where you ignore / hide your true self to become more integrated with your mate. And despite the idea of "soulmate" and "two becoming one", this is actually a bad thing.
Have you ever met someone from another part of the country who still has their regional accent? Have you ever met someone whose accent adapted to the region they moved to? Chances are that the person who still has their accent has "more personality" than the person who adapted...it's like a "strength of character" thing. This type of thing happens when we are married...we lose the "accent" that drew us together in the first place because we assimilate each others'.
So, I would say the most important concept in PM is "differentiation" which stresses the absolute importance of keeping your own identity outside the marriage so you can have something to bargain with inside the marriage. Too often, we give it all away right off the bat.
Understand that PM turns almost everything we "thought" we knew about relationships upside down. You will find yourself scratching your head at times and re-reading a section with a confused look on your face. Try to keep a very open mind. You guys might not have enough "years" yet to recognize the relationship dynamics described in PM but it will at least give you something to look for. I wish this had been required reading before I got married.
Anywhere is walking distance if you have the time
-Steven Wright
Fuzzy, As the LD (lower sex drive) wife in our marriage, the books I would have loved to have had when we first married would be 1. His Needs, Her Needs by Willard Harley (he's a very successful marriage therapist and this book is a bestseller)
2. Love Busters by Willard Harley (this book teaches the things that can damage or destroy romantic love in a marriage such as disrespectful judgments, dishonesty, etc.)
3. How to Be a Great Lover: Girlfriend to Girlfriend Totally Explicit Techniques by Lou Paget (author is a woman) and 4. How to Give Her Absolute Pleasure by Lou Paget (men asked her to write a book for them like the one she wrote for women).
Willard Harley has a website that includes a lot of the info in his books plus question and answer columns and articles (you don't have to buy his books from there, you can get them at almost any bookstore) -- http://www.marriagebuilders.com (there are clickable tabs at the top of the page, I'd start with " Basic Concepts " )
Harley, a psychologist, has a lot of success in saving marriages like Michele (traditional marriage counseling has a very high failure rate). He believes that you can strengthen and maintain romantic love, which encompasses more than sex, in marriages for the life of the marriage (he's been married for more than 40 years himself). He teaches that sex is most men's top emotional need in marriage whereas affection (hugs, kisses, "I love you's", holding hands, phone calls, etc.) is most women's top emotional need (he's identified 10 top emotional needs in marriage identified by his clients). Like Michele, he makes it very clear that sex is far more than "scratching an itch" for most husbands. His books are very easy to read and understand and he includes questions to help husbands and wives identify their own top emotional needs and information to help each spouse meet the emotional needs of the other.
He says in his book that for many women (and I'm one of them) affection is the main event whereas for most men sex is the main event. That's not to say that women don't need or want sex, and that men don't want affection, it's just we're different. Looking back on my marriage, I can see that when there was a lot of affection and I felt truly loved by my husband, that was like 24/7 foreplay, so sex was much more enjoyable (even what you'd classify as HS rather than ML) because the emotional connection with him was strong.
I recall reading an author somewhere who compared many men to lamps (on and off switch) and many women to irons (need time to warm up) when it comes to sex. That's a pretty accurate description of my marriage; but when my husband is regularly very affectionate, I feel as though I'm an iron that's turned on to "low heat" most of the time, and it takes much less time and effort to turn the heat up than starting from cold.
When I was in college, I heard the expression that men use love to get sex, and women use sex to get love. That's simplistic and perhaps cynical, but I think there's some truth to it that might be better expressed, using the terms HD and LD (meaning higher sex drive spouse and lower sex drive spouse) as many LD wives need affection (to feel loved) to want sex and many HD husbands need sex to feel loved.
As for Paget's books, they're simply the best sex manuals or guides I've ever found since starting with The Joy of Sex in college. She's a sex educator (she conducts seminars, but there's no nudity or live models there), and her books are warm, friendly, tasteful, but very frank and explicit. You won't find hundreds of kama sutra like positions, but you will find lots of information and ideas that will make you more confident and will help you and your husband learn a lot about each other's and your own bodies. As tempting as it may be to go straight to the techniques in her books, I'd highly recommend reading all the chapters because there's very good information on setting the mood, kissing, arousal, etc.
Even if you're on the right track, you'll get run over if you just sit there. Will Rogers
To love at all is to be vulnerable. Love anything, and your heart will certainly be wrung and possibly be broken. C. S. Lewis
ML for me includes foreplay, kissing, touching, petting my hair, rubbing, massaging, an emotional connection. ML doesn't have to be slow and sensual; it just needs to be about us together instead of just about physical pleasure. 
Hopefully I'll get to that one. My H and I have only been M1 (we're both 24), but it's always good to read other POVs and do some preventative maintenance. I wish I had found this board when we were going thru these things - it would have been a tremendous help. 