Her anger is definitely on the higher side lately. I have a bad habit of not backing off once I am angry. Don't like to fight but once pushed more than happy to engage.
Unfortunately that means I don't back of or give her space to cool off. She one of those types who stays mad and simmers for a while. Personally I get really angry then cool off pretty quickly. Still working on it. Now if I am getting angry I leave until I have cooled off.
I would like to save my marriage. Just I don't see that as possible based on things she said. Such as I want to have sex with other people because I am unhappy. I want a divorce so I am not cheating anymore. You are angry because you can't control me anymore.
At this point while I would like to trust my wife. I am not sure that is prudent. Also truthfully I really don't want to know. If I am an emotional wreck now that would probably destroy me.
About our marriage wow where to even start with that. Well we have been together for 10 years but only married for 3. She was my friends little sister and the relationship just kind of happened. She was 18 and I was 29. We used to watch movies together, go out shopping, eat and do everything together. Then she got pregnant and her mother found out. I was surprised by the pregnancy since we were using condoms and she was on birth control. Well any how her mother threw her out and she came to live with me.
At first we kept busy just getting ready for our son. Kind of flipped between adoption and keeping him. She had a full scholarship to a military college and really wanted to go. In the end she decided she wanted to keep our son. I am happy that she did. Unfortunately I didn't stop hanging out with our friends after he was born. Probably should have helped more as well. But I didn't I just focused on making money to pay the bills and keep a roof over our head.
Well one of our mutual friends decided he liked her and she started hanging out with him all the time. Of course me being me got jealous and made accusations. Which admittedly didn't help the problem. Any how after our birthday we started fighting more and I found her making plans to go to his house. So she moved out after that fight, took our son and stayed with her brother. Found out from the other guy that they had hooked up on at our birthday party. We ended up sending our son to her mothers for a month and tried to figure it out. After we picked him up she promptly took him and went back to her brothers and back to the other guy.
So I started drinking heavily and just trying to get her to leave me alone. She was always at my house during the day but she didn't want anything to do with me. It felt like I was a baby-sitter while she did what ever she wanted. Due to our fighting eventually our friends stopped talking to me.
Eventually the other guy found someone new and dropped her like a rock. So she came back to the house and asked if I would take her back. I was so happy I just said yes. A week later she went to boot camp. So I became a stay at home dad but kept drinking heavily. Honestly in the beginning I was a shitty father and never dealt with the hurt from the affair.
You and your wife have a complicated history...much like all of us here. Do you think your guilt over how you managed the birth of your son is shaping how you deal with your wife now?
In a way you are 'lucky' you've acknowledged there's work to be done and now you have the chance to be a better version of you. There are so many marriage partners who never make those changes and end up in miserable marriages and lives.
The only advice I will give (I'm a newbie too) is you don't deserve to be walked over. And you're doing the right thing walking away when you're angry...anger and knee jerk reacting to her disrespect won't help. But telling her you won't be disrespected in a calm voice will.
It's painful, this journey and good luck.
Me 50 H 48 S 23 S 21 D 19 Together 31 years Married 25 years Separated April 2009 Reconciled 2010 Separated September 2017
Yes I think guilt motivates a lot of my decisions lately. I also think her blaming me for her feelings isn't really fair.
I tell her she is solely responsible for her own happiness and choices. Which of course ends in her tearing into me.
Just bringing up the divorce and trying to work out in anything other than she wants ends a fight. Now she is saying she will give me 50 / 50 joint custody. But she is refusing to help pay for the household bills. She gets angry if I don't let her take my car to go to work and out at night.
A good example if the argument from the other morning. She said she needed my car for work. Then she said I won't be home tonight. So I told her she couldn't use my car. So she got angry said we can't talk and for me to leave. So I did. Went to work she called maybe 30 minutes later asking where I was. I told her I was at work. Promptly got told to f*** myself and how she can't depend on me.
So she came home and took the vehicle we use to take the kids to and from school. So I ended up letting my brother in law take my car to get the kids to and from school.
So last night we were both home. After apologizing for being hurtful and saying angry things. She asked how much money I had in the bank. She wanted to get drinks and stuff for everyone in the house. I ended up leaving and driving for 2 hours. My feelings were hurt by things she had said in the car. But she started texting where are you? After I had been gone for a while.
As to what I have done to remedy those. I started reading Men are from Mars and Women are from Venus. That way when she would speak I could understand where she was coming from. Unfortunately that seem to make things worse. Can you describe what you mean here? How does listening to what she is saying make things WORSE? Are you actually listening?
I have started seeing an hypno-therapist about the drinking. I used to drink to not deal with my emotional problems and I would check out. I don't do that anymore. So now I am an emotional wreck. Maybe you should be seeing someone so that you can figure out how to deal with your emotions....then you wouldnt have to drink. NOW is the WORST time to be an emotional wreck.
On the money thing I let her start making the decisions about how the money was spent and paying the bills. It was still my money but I let her actually pay the bills. This sounds so passive. "Im not doing a good job....so here, you do it instead." How about a middle ground where you LEARN how to do it better? OR you actually make some decisions together and work as a TEAM?
The kids thing we now have a schedule for our weekends. We do chores in the morning, activity then lunch and then another family activity while she is at work. Still get burned out and yell at them sometimes but working on it. This sounds good. You dont need to OVERDO it though, especially if they are young. Some relaxing time can be good. How are you involving yourself during these times? Just being present isnt good enough!
Not caring about what she wants we are at an impasse. I would give her anything in the world but the divorce. I don't mind changing just I can't be the only one. I realize that while I made my mistakes so does she. This isnt about HER...its about YOU. Have you read DR? YOU need to be the first one change. Without any expectations of her. Why dont/didnt you care about what she wants? And what does "not giving her a divorce" mean?
Not trusting her / friends has a lot to do with the 3 affairs. I couldn't cope with the affairs and past issues so I drank to deal with it. Plus I felt that I couldn't trust her not to do it again. Now if she wants to leave I don't question her about it beyond normal questions. Such as what time where are you going and when will you be home. So what was the healing process after the affairs? How did she earn back your trust? You say you 'couldnt trust her to not do it again' and then...she did it again...twice.
Yes I am actively listening. I don't always understand what she means. Asking questions to get more information leads into fighting and her saying I am not listening. As she likes to say if I don't understand then I didn't listen I just heard the words. Never mind I could repeat them back verbatim including context.
So I have been working harder on understanding what she is actually saying. We have three children and even though my marriage is over it can only help transition into co-parents.
I never had to drink. That was a choice I made. Albeit the wrong one time and time again. My emotions are starting to stabilize as I process through them. Caveat the constant fighting and blaming doesn't make it easy.
I do a good job paying the bills and balancing the budget. She just complains I use the money as a form of control. No we aren't talking and she treats her money like her own. She just expects me to pay the bills and move out as soon as I am able. So long as it does not leave me homeless. At this point I am wondering if that wouldn't be better.
As to the children, I am always doing things with them. Watching TV, drawing, coloring, homework etc. Recently it has been road trips to the various state parks and hiking etc. You get the idea.
I am changing for me. Therapy and communicating will only help me in the long run. Of her I don't have any real expectations never really have. Yes it is irritating as all heck to be blamed for everything though. When she says I don't care what she wants that normally comes after I told her no to something. A good example she told me she wanted a divorce. My immediate was response was absolutely not I don't believe in divorce. Not only that we owe it to our children to try and fix the situation. Response I don't care about her or what she wants. She wanted to take my car to go and stay with someone. I told her no she couldn't take my car overnight. Response she can't depend on me and I don't care what she wants.
There was no real healing process more of tried to drink away the hurt. And then get on with life. I am not sure she ever tried to earn my trust back. If you ask her she wouldn't make friends. She stopped drinking. But she would never open up and talk to me about problems. If I tried talking to her about them they ended in fighting. Which in turn led to more drinking.
Right now I work, go home and take care of kids. Her brother lives with us but once I am home he goes to his room and out for a moment for dinner. Outside of that I don't see him.
About all I get to do for myself lately is go for nightly drives and sleep in my car so I am not fighting with her.
Even today she is set to leave for military training. She isn't at home with our youngest daughter. She took the other car and left. So my youngest daughter is staying with my 18 year old daughter from my first marriage.
Until things are stabilized for the children there isn't much I can do for me. By time they go to bed I am passing out.
Yes I am actively listening. I don't always understand what she means. Asking questions to get more information leads into fighting and her saying I am not listening. As she likes to say if I don't understand then I didn't listen I just heard the words. Never mind I could repeat them back verbatim including context.
Maybe instead of asking questions, you think for a second to try to understand your self. Then maybe instead of repeating verbatim - you could say something like "Im not sure if Im following completely, but I think you are trying to say XXX - is that right?" or something to that effect. I think its absolutely possible to listen and not understand. Just try to show that you ARE listening.
Originally Posted By: Daystar
I never had to drink. That was a choice I made. Albeit the wrong one time and time again. My emotions are starting to stabilize as I process through them. Caveat the constant fighting and blaming doesn't make it easy.
But it doesnt sound like you are doing anything to teach you how to deal with your emotional stress. "Waiting for the emotions to stabilize" doesnt sound like a good long term strategy. What are you doing to help you remain calm during the fighting and blaming? From what I gather, it used to be alcohol...what now?
Originally Posted By: Daystar
I do a good job paying the bills and balancing the budget. She just complains I use the money as a form of control. No we aren't talking and she treats her money like her own. She just expects me to pay the bills and move out as soon as I am able. So long as it does not leave me homeless. At this point I am wondering if that wouldn't be better.
So youre letting her walk all over you financially? Whats yours is hers and whats hers is hers, huh? Why WOULDNT she want to keep that arrangement? And what incentive is there to NOT leave you homeless? She wants to stay or leave, then fine - but I dont think you should be paying for everything in the interim.
As to the children, I am always doing things with them. Watching TV, drawing, coloring, homework etc. Recently it has been road trips to the various state parks and hiking etc. You get the idea.
Originally Posted By: Daystar
I am changing for me. Therapy and communicating will only help me in the long run. Of her I don't have any real expectations never really have.
You said "I dont mind changing, but I cant be the only one." To me, that means you arent going to take a step unless she does too. Am I misunderstanding?
Originally Posted By: Daystar
A good example she told me she wanted a divorce. My immediate was response was absolutely not I don't believe in divorce. Not only that we owe it to our children to try and fix the situation. Response I don't care about her or what she wants.
It kind of sounds like you dont......
Originally Posted By: Daystar
There was no real healing process more of tried to drink away the hurt. And then get on with life. I am not sure she ever tried to earn my trust back. If you ask her she wouldn't make friends. She stopped drinking. But she would never open up and talk to me about problems. If I tried talking to her about them they ended in fighting. Which in turn led to more drinking.
This sounds like a recipe for disaster. Im not surprised you dont trust her. Do you really think you SHOULD trust her?
Originally Posted By: Daystar
Right now I work, go home and take care of kids. Her brother lives with us but once I am home he goes to his room and out for a moment for dinner. Outside of that I don't see him.
About all I get to do for myself lately is go for nightly drives and sleep in my car so I am not fighting with her.
Maybe it's time to use that spare time to occupy your mind instead of just driving. What kind of hobby would you like to have?
Originally Posted By: Daystar
Until things are stabilized for the children there isn't much I can do for me. By time they go to bed I am passing out.
Thats hogwash. Have you ever been in a plane? Whats the safety instruction? Attach your oxygen mask before helping others. If YOU are a wreck then their lives CANT be stabilized. It is CRUCIAL that you take time for yourself to GAL right now.
Most of my marriage I have given her exactly what she wanted. She wanted to live in Vegas, I told her I hated here but we came anyway. She wanted SUV she is driving, I told her it was too expensive. Yet she still has it. To many times in our relationship I caved in and gave her what she wanted because I was afraid she wouldn't love me if I didn't. Her idea of me not caring is when I don't do as I am told. Divorce subject was "I want a divorce. So you need to move out.", when I asked about the children "You can see them every other weekend and you will be paying child support.". When I told her I didn't have the money to get a place it wasn't her problem. That I needed to man up and figure it out.
Coping with the emotions, I spend a lot of time talking to people while I drive. It helps me process and clear my head. Also do meditation and hypnosis. Some days are better than others.
It can't be we are getting divorced. So I pay the bills and watch the kids while she goes out and does what ever. That is utter hogwash. I made it clear to her that if she wants to go out sleep around and stay out all night. She shouldn't be around the children at all. They deserve better than that. I deserve better than that.
On change, I said I can't be the only one to change. That is a factual statement. I am changing me for me. And I don't like how she treats me. How it seems like she wants her cake and to eat it too. I don't like being taken advantage of. It feels like this entire divorce talk is so she can do what she wants while I foot the bill.
I will continue therapy and getting better for me. Only in self-healing have I been able to see how screwed up our marriage had been for so so long.
Should I trust her? Not really. She obviously doesn't respect me. Honestly I wouldn't be surprised if this started because she decided she wanted someone else. Or had started sleeping with someone else.
So I want to save my marriage. I just don't know where to begin. I ordered the book from Amazon so it should be here on Tuesday.
Last night I went out with my brother who I hadn't seen in 24 years. First thing I have done for me in a very long time. It was nice a good meal and some sleep does the mind wonders.
So my W is right I don't trust her. The affairs complicate that but it is my choice not to even try. So pretty sure that would be a good step 1. Worst comes to worst she gets it back and loses it again. In which case I leave for me.
Pretty sure she feels unappreciated or unneeded since I make enough money to pay all of the bills. Plus the extra stuff for the kids and everyone. So going to stop doing that and have her pay half. Should be a decent step 2.
If I can get the fighting to stop. Since if she is open to date nights. If not I can just go out by myself and play pool or something. Time away from the house and responsibility seems to be good for me.
So I want to save my marriage. I just don't know where to begin.
OK...lets talk through this.
Originally Posted By: Daystar
Last night I went out with my brother who I hadn't seen in 24 years. First thing I have done for me in a very long time. It was nice a good meal and some sleep does the mind wonders.
Agree. Now what is your next GAL plan?
Originally Posted By: Daystar
So my W is right I don't trust her. The affairs complicate that but it is my choice not to even try. So pretty sure that would be a good step 1. Worst comes to worst she gets it back and loses it again. In which case I leave for me.
Wait...what? You think right now is a good time to START trusting her? Are you serious? Shes talking about separating and you want to start implicitly trusting her? That makes no sense.
Right now, you need to stop engaging and asking questions, because she is likely LYING to you at every turn.
I get it that you should be more trustING....but not to W right now. To friends, family, etc, sure.
Originally Posted By: Daystar
Pretty sure she feels unappreciated or unneeded since I make enough money to pay all of the bills. Plus the extra stuff for the kids and everyone. So going to stop doing that and have her pay half. Should be a decent step 2.
You are going to stop paying her bills to make her feel more appreciated? Huh?
Yes. You should have her pay for her share of the bills. BECAUSE she wants to SEPARATE. Because it isnt your job to pay for her party girl lifestyle.
Yu, on the other hand, should work to be more appreciatIVE. Again, not necessarily to HER, but as a general person. Friends, colleagues, family, etc.
Originally Posted By: Daystar
If I can get the fighting to stop. Since if she is open to date nights. If not I can just go out by myself and play pool or something. Time away from the house and responsibility seems to be good for me.
You get the fighting to stop by NOT FIGHTING with her. If she starts to escalate, then you say "Lets revisit this when you are calm and we can talk rationally." And then LEAVE. Let her yell at the air or the walls.
Regardless, NOW is NOT the time to be trying to date her. She said she wants to DIVORCE you. Why would you want to pressure her into spending MORE time with you?
