Any Advice 2

[25yearsmlc]

[quote=dirxml]25years

Respectfully, saving a marriage at all costs is IMO, a fools errand.



I do not believe in, nor does Div Busting - saving a marriage at all costs It is NOT the goal here, nor is it mine. I filed for divorce a year ago.

If there's a typo in my previous post, or anything that suggests I believe in saving marriages at all costs, please disregard.

In the Div Busting books there is a chapter on how to handle an impossible situation,

and or

when you just can't do it anymore.


-.

Insofar as saving the marriage, it sounds as if it is incumbent on him to win her back.




look, I know how much an affair ^^ can $uck. (Yeah, like I really do know). It's incredibly unfair and It's gut wrenching and

if it's an absolute deal breaker for someone - then the path is clear.

But for some people, affairs are not always deal breakers, and they can see context to it.

One night stands, or a spouse giving into temptation, versus long term deceit and planning, are just some factors to consider. So is how things were at home before the A.

There's also a philosophy about affairs, of Esther Perel that some folks follow, in which underlying reasons for affairs are explored and such. She has a TED Talk video and a book.

Maybe the first thing a spouse needs to do is decide IF IF IF they MIGHT be able to get past it.

As the Div Busting books say, any lasting reconciliation would require (as the books and MWD list) several elements for the LBS to believe in it.

But that's ^^^^getting ahead of ourselves.

GW wants the marriage to work out.

His wife does not. She's not here trying to save the marriage, and he is.


-. She should be doing everything in her power to prove to him that she wants this marriage.

yes she should.

But she's not.


GW certainly has a role in fixing his role in the marriage; what's her role?

Not sure if you have read the books or first came here to explore (which is fine). But the focus is - as I see it--

marriage is a relationship with 2 people.

By changing how one (i.e. us) of the people inside the marriage behaves, we can change the dynamic.

it's not about them, it's about us.

We are the focus of OUR work. Giving up the need or desire to change our spouse is a fundamental piece of this. It's hard as he11 to do.

Paradoxically we have found, generally better - not great- but better - odds at improving the marriage by working out ourselves and in time, seeing improvements in the marriage itself.



At this point, whether he wants to save it is meaningless if she is not interested.


Ah but this^^ is where DBing parts ways with what you're saying. GW only controls himself anyhow

if what he does is meaningless then he's powerless to do anything and may as well give up now and let others decide if he is allowed to be a happy man. And
there's no point in him doing his own work...after all, it's all totally about how wrong his wife is...

The focus of divorce busting is unlike most approaches b/c it says WE can do something about how we are treated and that begins solely within us.

It's not about saving the marriages so much as saving ourselves.

[25yearsmlc]

[quote=gw5263]I just needed to empty it all out. everything there is something i have wanted to say to her all along, but in her current altered mental state it will not matter or have the desired effect.


She went on a walk tonight to call him ( Between 5 and 7, Lol) and when she passed the house i was on the roof making repairs. Almost sounded like they were arguing. Welcome to real life sunshine. I am still detaching, however it appears he has cancelled his plans to come up next week.

Oh NO! Trouble in paradise?? Glad you didn't fall off the roof with that going on.


WW wants to take the kids on several day trips with us to the Zoo, fort knox, and lincolns birthplace. Might be an interesting week. Just have to be patient.

you mean all together, right? It's not easy.

Here is what my DB coach told me in my own situation - sorry for the length.

About 8 weeks before h was to leave for Alaska, he had a 4 day conference in a resort area. He asked me and our 2 d's to go with him. I could not believe he'd expect that.

I thought "no way". I balked.

I mean, why fake "happy family" when the axe was going to fall soon?
I could not imagine going and rewarding him, pretending, or letting him be in denial, ETC.

My DB coach said something very different.

1) If this is your last vacation together, why not make it a good memory for your daughters?

2) why not make it a good memory for HIM so he'd have something to MISS?

And

3) to NOT fight and NOT get angry. In sum, she said my anger, however justified, was not as important as my children having a good memory with their dad and me, together.

Thanks to my DB coach, I gave it some thought.

I figured, maybe I could probably repress my anger for 4 days...for FOUR days I could probably keep my negative feelings to myself and suppress my fears,

for my daughters and for the possibility that h would later regret things, and maybe that I might even enjoy myself.

I did not realize that I might actually begin to FEEL differently by behaving differently, but it's what happened.


Also, I'm embarrassed to admit that when I contemplated doing this, I comforted myself with the thought that I could "Still be angry at h later."

It was not actually going to cost me anything to be kind and warm, or at least, neutral, for four days...

As we were driving there, I recall thinking that h was getting a bit nerdy with his arcane scientific knowledge and telling the girls about some wild life we saw.

BUT I stopped myself and instead, CHOSE to see him in a new way. (A way I used to see him).

I realized that in reality, the girls were learning from their dad. And it's a good thing that h is educated and smart. Plus I was simply being fairer to h.

Why was I seeing him so negatively before? (B/C he'd hurt me!) Seeing him negatively felt like a protective thing to do.

But it was actually destructive to our m, and that's just one tiny example of how I had let my anger poison my behavior, and what I showed the kids.

Anyhow, I forced myself to "neutralize" anything negative I thought or felt. Sometimes, I was able to convert it into a positive.

It actually got easier after only a day or so. And pretty soon, H behaved in a more relaxed way. He got happier and more positive as well. We both had some laughs too. (And some romantic moments too, believe it or not. I know, I know. )


But the girls had a very good time with him and me. We went up a mountain and rode horses. We know we count that as a very good memory. And it was something h thought about, later on. It was about 6 months later when I guess his loneliness got to him, and his calls became daily events, sometimes more than once a day. I recall him discussing the trip and maybe going back there sometime.

Give yourself a day at a time with this approach, (or a "conversation at a time") and pat yourself on the back when it works.

** Turn your anger and your pain over to God and let HIM hold onto it for you.

This is awfully heavy to carry all the time, on your own.



I went out last night for a drive and didnt bother to tell her where i was going. Came home to everyone in bed at 9pm... She asked today where i went and i just said for a drive.

She appears to be having stress related issues lately. Pain and stiffness in the neck, unable to sleep well, physically ill a lot with stomach issues..... Guilt is a powerful thing. Could be that she might be beginning to realize whats going on here in the real world. Doubt it, but maybe.


Whether it's stress, or stress from guilt of fear or pained confusion, don't fret too much about what is in HER mind. Get out of her head. How are your GAL going?

[gw5263]

Im working on the GAL, having a little trouble due to my schedule. I workl twelve hour shifts with rotating weeks. One wee i work two days, the next is five. I work 7p to 7 A with an hour drive. I stay tired a lot.....lol but im working on them. the short week is easy, the long week is hell.

I am picking up both books tomorrow after work, DB and DR. Alread finishing up 5 love languages. So we will see...

Thanks 25 MLC!

[gw5263]

Quick question for any body out there. Or maybe just an observation or errant thought on my part.
My WW is having an emotional affair with this jerk three states away, as i have said. It has been a 7 month ordeal so far. She has seen him twice iun that time.
She said her main reason for emotionally disconnecting with me and connecting with him was that i neglected some emotional and physical needs that i did not fulfill for a few months.
So she started an affair with him to fulfill them , right?
Here's my question
Given the length of the A, and the fact that it is all over the phone, How are these needs being fulfilled by the OM at this point.
I get in the begining he said all the right things to her, but it just seems that facetiming, and calling and telling her he "Loves" her would be getting a little old without the displays she said she was needing, IE hugs, kisses, hand holding Etc. A little tough to do over the phone.... As well as the sexual component. It would seem that 7 months of words and promises over the phone would be getting a bit old, especially since she can only call between 5p and 7p. She still cannot get that aspect. If he is single, and if he was that into her it wouldnt really matter when she called. If it were me in his shoes, Id tell her to call whenever, and id be coming up here at least every other weekend. It only costs 120$ round trip...... I know he hasnt because she has not had the time due to work and home to be out and away from the house long enough. Just curious what an outsider might make of this observation. Dont read anything into it, like i said just curious. thanks guys!

[gw5263]

Icant help but think that this could unravel soon.\, since needs arent being met. Any thoughts on this?

[leahsue]

I think you are comforting yourself and rationalizing why this EA is not going to work for her. I agree with you that she is being short-changed by only being allowed to call him 5-7, etc. But evidently, for now, that is enough for her.

These spouses who leave..... with the exception of the few like Sandi who give us a glimpse into that mindset, I don't think we can possibly imagine, must less figure out their next moves or motivations or timeframes.

IMHO, you are giving her WAY too much rent-free time in your head and heart. No matter what you want to believe, her needs are being met right now by OM. Those two times they met physically- that could have been enough to light a fire that is fueled by the phone, facetime, etc. Don't underestimate the motivation that some people get, just from the memory of that physical time together, to allow themselves to believe what they have is real. We all know those R are a far cry from the ones we have with them, based on time, history and real commitment, but that does not mean they see that.

Replace all that "trying to make sense of it or figure out why this is working for her", for your OWN sake, and just accept that it is. Move your focus to you, and what you can do while she's checked out, to make yourself better, stronger and happier.

Her situation doesn't make sense to us, but then again, what story on here DOES make sense to us? We are on the side of this where logic, common sense, loyalty, etc. are important to us. Not always so for others.

PS- Try to avoid roof work during the 5-7 pm hours. Somehow I can see that situation either ending badly for you in a roll/fall off that roof, or making you a millionaire when you sell the scene to a film maker for a situation comedy.

[joejoe1]

GW,

I know you want know what your wife is thinking. Please trying to figure out her other relationship with OM. People are willing to go thru crazy things to be with someone. Look at what you are willing to accept.

You say what you are willing to, because she is your wife. Don't apply your principals to someone else's. Maybe your wife is enjoying the chase. Think about that. If she is enjoying chasing him, why can't she enjoy chasing you.

Stop worrying about this other relationship, I know it's hard. Put all the focus on you.

[LH19]

Icant help but think that this could unravel soon.\, since needs arent being met. Any thoughts on this?

GW,

Question 1: Am I reading that you are ok being plan B?

Question 2: What makes you think that if her A blows up she will want to come back to you? What would change in the M?

[gw5263]

No. im nowhere near ok being plan B. these were just some things floating around in my noggin that had me pondering, thats all. Basically trying to answer some things that popped in my head waiting for the books to arrive. I have them now, came today. I am going to dive into them and move along. I was just curious about some things, thats all. I have made several important changes already. The only one ive yet to be able to implement would be expressions of affection and physical contact. that is impossible right now in her current mindset. I have been and am working on all the rest. I quit drinking almost 100 days ago, and id like nothing more than to express how i feel, but it is a moot point at this time i think. Hwne she initiates a conversation i pay attention, dont interupt. I have taken classes to help me get finances in order and become more fiscally responsible. these were her complaints that she says led to all this mess.

[TBSakaJ9]

Continue doing the work GW, remember to not talk about what you have done to improve, show her with your actions. Over time she will notice then it is up to her to make the choice. Either way you win! Get your confidence back, your swagger that law enforcement mojo!!