Lost on how to save my marriage! 3

[25yearsmlc]

25,

I'm going to make an appointment to get seen about PTSD this up and coming week.

Good! It's a concrete goal, for you. You will give support AND get support.

So just for informative purposes, have you seen anyone about it, before now?

And when did you get back home? How many tours there did you do? Afghan or Iraq or both?

Do you have any guys from back there or any unit members around you now? What about phone numbers? Are you comfortable reaching out to check in with someone and asking for instance, how they handled sleep problems?

Like any group of people with common bonds, you can help & be helped by others in the same boat. Some will be behind you, and you'll recognize how you felt in your earlier moments back "then" and the feeling of still being in a foreign country with your alert" on high, even though you are back in the USA,

and the nightmares, startling at sudden movements, the heart racing and your focus shifting and then ---turns out, nearly all who leave the red zone do have these symptoms,

and just as resilience is like a muscle you can work on and strengthen, so it is with resilience.
I'm a big fan of support groups.



Myvwife felt Exactly like your husband made you and your children feel. I was making them fit in my world and never try to fit in theirs.

It was[b] quite a few events where I embarrassed her.

what did you say when she'd be upset about your behavior? Since you repeated it, was that b/c you justified it, did not care what she said Or drink again?


The worst one was in front of her father, where intold her she needs to get a job. It was a horrible moment.[/b]

Okay, I won't belabor the inappropriateness of the her Father being there for that type of talk. OUCH for her -that's a rough one.

Sounds like you resented something and took it out on her. IF YOU meant the remark

Only someone who does not "Get" what an effectively single stay at home mom, does, would think she does not have a job already. .A hard one, with no support at all when the h comes back...

Sure THERE are single moms who work, THERE are stay at home moms who can raise their kids& manage cars and homes and finances and social lives for their kids and their educations and sports and PTA and SEE THE CHILD GROW & KEEP HIM/HER SAFE BUT

with the military spouse

the trade off for a woman married to a military guy is that HE IS GONE FAR AWAY FOR LONG PERIODS OF TIME, on top of all else,

while she does all this^^ and he is far away and he may not come back at all, or not the same. That's a free floating angst she's dealing with too. Many Wives go to T while their h's are gone.

AND THEN< they GET TO MOVE AGAIN for HIS career and she will do most of the moving and adjusting and the kids will be sad and SHE will get to handle them, again...and again..AND IF SHE CAN FINALLY GET A JOB it won't up to her skill level b/c she's moved 5 times (we moved 9) and has to start over each time so she can never earn what she might have earned..

I know strong military couples in combat units and one happy one, the COL thanks his wife, considers her before any choices and they really do decide together. He would leave the Army if she asked him. Just knowing that is true, makes it a little easier to bear, for her.

So when you return from an oversees assignment as if your stress (which is real, I know) but your stress is not the only stress your family was enduring. Your young beautiful wife had no mate many nights, she was raising the kids without a co-parent,

and to tell her to get a job means a whole lot of things she does were unknown, overlooked or not valued by you. UGH...

Guess I won't beat a dead horse...


HOW TO SAY THE NEW VIEW TO HER --
If she says "too little too late"

you get that, but she misunderstood your point of sharing. We are referring to a big revelation in you . You are not saying these things to get her back (in theory)
[i]
but to to get something off your chest. A revelation of sorts.

You are saying a value of yours is now developed and some views of yours have shifted...a value of yours you needed to express to her, not as a tactic but as a revelation to you/her that she needs to know you have had.

And I hope it's true. And don't wait around for her to react, bc again, it's about you revealing something you have learned, THEN behaving consistent with this new realization
AND moving along...
NO expectations of her, just you sharing your opinion and move on...but then really GET IT AND LIVE IT --- okay?

And say compliments to your w in public, (she's smart, she did the whole house project/kids homework/painted a wall/sewed something/is creative/artistic/beautiful/a devoted mom/so funny/loving/well put together, great chef ETC

That could counter some of the damage that publicly humiliating your wife has dome.

And maybe telling her dad how you really feel and that you are embarrassed by your behaviors. You were, for lack of a better phrase, too angry when you returned and you are working on that. Just letting him know you do value his daughter. That if you had it all to do over again, there are many things you'd do differently.

NO expectations. You are not recruiting him as an ally, you are apologizing for embarrassing his daughter in front of him,

which must have sucked for both of them.
[/i]


I have been a lot more patient. I have been a lot more understanding as well.

She really wants me to feel what she had to go through the last seven years she keeps telling me this.

She has been opening a lot more lately. But I must be honest. I don't trust her. She hasnt shown me anything that she is talking to the OM. But I have a hard time just trusting the baby steps and her.

well your record of being a "self professed a$$hole/jerk" is longer than the EA

And she has a hard time trusting that your changes are real or lasting.

Why not go to Retrovaille?: I strongly urge you to look into it.

It does NOT require you to be Catholic or Christian and they can accept sliding scale payment usually.

We got a lot out of it. WE did not keep the after weekend program going which was a mistake. But the program weekend, and then follow up sessions, my free advice is to

DO THEM!!!!!!



This process takes super patience. That video you suggested 25, the lady said, "that sometimes the person who got cheated on is not the person with the most pain."

Indeed, it's not all about the betrayal of cheating and since this is an EA, it can mean she's in so much pain inside her marriage, she is lonely in her m,

she may not believe you can do what she's waited so long for you to do. She says you broke her -- with the constant criticism? Do you like your w?? Honestly do you?

You told her to "get a job!", in a way to humiliate her, I'm asking you, what your true emotions for your w, are. Do you want to work on loving her more?

Do you like your wife, or just want to stay m, or do you just want to win over OM?

It's a real question I'm not making light of, at all.

Well, let's hope you can help her heal.

I think My wife has a lot of pain and hurt. She told me I broke her.

ouch Must be hard for her to have endured and hard to tell you, and hard for you to hear.

Maybe you can help her heal.

[joejoe1]

25,

I truly love my wife. I absolutely like my wife.

I have been deployed 3 times. Once to Iraq, once to Afghanistan, and once to Kuwait. I really didn't take into account her contributions while being a single parent while I was deployed.

I have talked to a therapist and military Chaplian.

The military put us thru a lot of training, but they have no training for us on how to be a husband and father. I think it's a subject that needs to be taught for husband and wives that serve in the Military.

I called my father in law the pass weekend and apologized for my behavior that day, I told him I was a selfish man with selfish intentions that day. My wife told me that her father was disappointed at me that day and he lost respect for me as well. He accepted my apology. "Woo what tangle webs we weave."

We might be going out together today. I will keep in mine to compliment her in public. Thats a great idea.

I have to say, that I really hate this situation, but the honest truth is it has been a blessing. Inhave learned so much about myself, my wife and my boys. I have gain tools that I never would have without this wake up call. I have gotten back in church and has made Jesus and GOD a daily part of my life. I'm also more optimistic. I do have my down moments and days, but with this forum and Vets like you 25 I know I'm going to be alright. Oh, I'm smiling more and enjoying being around people.

I made huge mistakes in my marriage and I havr fully accepted that my wife don't have to take me back and it's 100 percent her choice. But I need her know I valued her and being a jerk and absent while there was the fool in me and ignorance. I also want her to see that I'm willing to fight and not just give up.

[AnotherStander]

The military put us thru a lot of training, but they have no training for us on how to be a husband and father. I think it's a subject that needs to be taught for husband and wives that serve in the Military.

AMEN!!! And not just to people in the military, but to EVERYONE. I was just talking to my daughter about this last night. We should have classes in high school that deal with how to be a great spouse and parent, and how to handle personal finances. How is it that we are taught history, science, math, etc. but not the skills that are MOST IMPORTANT OF ALL???? Nooo, we're just supposed to figure that out as we go! And unfortunately the only way we really learn those life skills is by screwing up and learning from our mistakes. Not the most efficient method!

I have to say, that I really hate this situation, but the honest truth is it has been a blessing. Inhave learned so much about myself, my wife and my boys. I have gain tools that I never would have without this wake up call. I have gotten back in church and has made Jesus and GOD a daily part of my life. I'm also more optimistic. I do have my down moments and days, but with this forum and Vets like you 25 I know I'm going to be alright. Oh, I'm smiling more and enjoying being around people.

That is a very healthy attitude to have about it. All any of us can do about it is learn, improve ourselves and keep moving forward!

[joejoe1]

AS,

I'm agree, we have stop teaching life skills in our schools. Our children are set up to think having a great career is the key to happiness and live is a magical entity that just happens. We are not taught that love takes work. Hard work. It's a job in it of itself.

[sandi2]

I've been catching up on your thread, and I'm so glad 25 has the military background.....as well as just being so knowledgeable about relationships.....to relate. I am surprised the military does not have some type of M support groups that addresses these issues.

I relate to your W having to be the bad guy with the kids, b/c daddy won't discipline them. I held a lot of resentment about it, and felt I was probably harder on them b/c I had no support. Plus, I was never the type who told the kids, "Wait until your father gets home", and it's a good thing I didn't wait on him.

Now that you are developing a stronger relationship with your boys, you can begin to help with some of the disciplining, too. You may consider choosing a good time where you can express appreciation for the job she's done. She should realize you are validating her, instead of taking over her job.

You may a good move by talking to your FIL. Did you apologize to your W, also? I learned too late to never do anything to embarrass, degrade or humiliate my spouse in front of his relatives....or mine. In fact, just don't do it in front of anyone, and you'll be much better off. Once it's out there in front of others, it can't be undone. And guess who comes off looking really bad.

You are in a period where you are gathering a lot of new information. You may not be able to apply everythingyou learn at one time, due to the fact of your timetable and your WW's timetable are out of sorts. However, there's still some things, just as we are talking about here. There are some other things you'd like to do but the timing isn't ready....but keep learning with the intentions of applying it when the time is right. I hope that makes sense.

I have seen H's pick up some new point or a neat phrase on the board.....some word catch or thought that was given to him for him...not his WW. But the H would repeat the phrase or point to his W....thinking it would impress her or give something to think about, and not get the response he wanted. It's b/c they were not meant for her. Just wanted to throw this caution your way while I was thinking about it. And btw, I am not referring to when the board gives you an example of how to word something specific to say to your W. Hope this isn't confusing you.

[joejoe1]

Sandi,

I get what you are saying with that last paragraph. Youbare saying we come and read a lot. But not every message is meant for every WW. If she doesn't respond, it's def not meant for her.

I have apologized to my wife as well, for embarrassing her.

I know I was a terrible husband. But I can't change the past. Now I'm moving forward. Fixing the destruction I have caused.

[25yearsmlc]

25,

I truly love my wife. I absolutely like my wife.
-
I have talked to a therapist and military Chaplian.

The military put us thru a lot of training, but they have no training for us on how to be a husband and father. I think it's a subject that needs to be taught for husband and wives that serve in the Military.

I called my father in law the pass weekend and apologized for my behavior that day, I told him I was a selfish man with selfish intentions that day. My wife told me that her father was disappointed at me that day and he lost respect for me as well. He accepted my apology. "Woo what tangle webs we weave."

We might be going out together today. I will keep in mine to compliment her in public. Thats a great idea.

I have to say, that I really hate this situation, but the honest truth is it has been a blessing. Inhave learned so much about myself, my wife and my boys. I have gain tools that I never would have without this wake up call. I have gotten back in church and has made Jesus and GOD a daily part of my life. I'm also more optimistic. I do have my down moments and days, but with this forum and Vets like you 25 I know I'm going to be alright. Oh, I'm smiling more and enjoying being around people.

I made huge mistakes in my marriage and I havr fully accepted that my wife don't have to take me back and it's 100 percent her choice. But I need her know I valued her and being a jerk and absent while there was the fool in me and ignorance. I also want her to see that I'm willing to fight and not just give up.

Joe, you took some major 2 x4's from me. That took the type of humility only a strong man has.

Your willingness to improve as a man of faith and honor may well be your bravest hardest work, and your greatest achievement in life.

Kudos.

[25yearsmlc]

PS

not to overwhelm you too much with too much detail, but when you compliment your w

put some thought into it. Not a "you look nice." Or "good dinner." Though those are positive, they often come off as fobbed off lines without thought.


I am not sure what she felt worst about herself or in terms of your criticisms, e.g. her intelligence or cooking, financial management, weight, or her mothering but I would start there.


JoeJoe - you have the classic DB challenge - of balancing your willingness to "become a man only a fool would leave" (and yes, owning your role in this mess),

against not pressuring your wife to end a fantasy existence with OM. Pressure and pursuit can backfire.

You will need to consistently apply something for enough time for it to be trusted, before monitoring for any results.

* (MWD uses the term "monitoring for results" and people over analyze and get confused. In my experience, the results are usually pretty obvious one way or another, if you give it enough time).

Now that we've cleared that up...

All women like being complimented for their mothering, esp if they have been the stay at home military wife. We need to be reminded of how valued we are and how valuable what WE do/did is.

No fighter pilot or military neurosurgeon can do their job consistently or over time, if they are worried that their families are in crisis or are lost to them.

The military knows this in theory but it's still sort of abstract. That is another reason there's more divorce in deployed soldiers' families. If you ever deploy again, involve your family in as much of the day to day (safe stuff, obviously)

that you can so that you don't feel like strangers when you return. Same for hearing what your w's AND Kids lives were like so you know your kids' bff's names, teacher's names favorite subjects, latest funny or scary show watched, etc.

These ^^ are things you can discuss now, too.

The military does attempt to give family support but you REALLY have to navigate the system to get a lot of help.

First I must ask you - do you want to retire from the military? How long do you have left ? I ask this b/c there may be career considerations to touch on later.

May I assume your skills are medical in origin? (H & i were both active duty in your present city). Those skills do transfer to the civilian world if need be or when the time comes. Which will make the transition easier for you.

Are there any classes or a degree your w would want to get into? Or a career training?

NOT That you have to push her towards working outside the home, (!) but if there is something other than her fantasy life that she could focus on, you can mention your support of it. The post 9-11 benefits Can include partial funding of family members schooling or the soldiers.

Careful Not to say this in a manipulative way, but so she knows the program exists in case she is interested.

You said you like your wife (and love her). Why not list a few things you like about her here,

and perhaps we can help you delineate how authentic compliments might sound?

[joejoe1]

25,

My compliments are basic. An you help with a few examples.

I have been in almost 16 and half years. Yes I plan on retiring. I'm military intelligence. So I can't really talk about my work with my wofe which complicates things more.

My wife wants to get her master's
She is a huge procrastinator. I gavr her 24 months of my post 9-11 GI bill 2 years ago. She still hasnt started college. She wants to work. She wants to start college, she just can never stay committed. I was helping trying to get some of the steps done. But it's her journey now. If she ask me for help I have no problem doing that.

I was working on my Master's in public administration, but I took a knee on that once BD hit. Couldnt concentrate.

My wife is a huge caring person. She loves helping people out and I truly love that about her. She is awesome with our boys. And she can walk into any room and make herself home. She's very creative, I mean really creative.

[sandi2]

I get what you are saying with that last paragraph. Youbare saying we come and read a lot. But not every message is meant for every WW. If she doesn't respond, it's def not meant for her.

It is not meant to be repeated to her. I can't remember if it is on your thread or elsewhere, where you were told that "you may want your W in your life, but don't need her". Then you repeated those words to her.

If she doesn't respond, it's def not meant for her.

You should not tell her what you gleam from the board. She is not the one here......you are. And stop telling her things to get a response. That's just not something you should be doing, unless otherwise specified by the poster in how to word something to your W.