Here again part 9

[T384]

Cadence

I did have to laugh at your post so thank you. And Juju thank you for your kind words.

The boundary stuff with not coming here is difficult. Per the L he has every right to come and go here as he pleases. It is just as much his house as it is mine.

I don't have the $$$ for a 5k lawyer retainer on top of him not paying bills for the 90-120 days it would take. So I have to be very cautious of that.

Yes i would like to have him stop coming here and using this as a hotel b I just have to figure out how to do that so that it doesn't do more harm for me.

The other thing H said to me before I left was that I always know everything. Like when he said he was leaving just for space for a week or two and I said I'm not stupid H you've done this before I know this story and how it plays out. He said ya because you know everything.

I want to be done. I want to not care. I would rather him do his primping elsewhere. He's either here or not. It's not come and go based on your plans.

I just don't know that I should make my statement about me. Because he says it's always what I want.

[T384]

Juju - I'm trying to find me again. I feel I've lost myself. Being out with my friends and laughing and having fun is me. My friends all know me is the sarcastic outgoing life of the party and can talk to anyone.

Hi Dale,

I'm sorry to see you're here. Thank you so much for taking the time to post your story. I was wondering if your wife read DB until I read about the other man. She sounds like she was in a vulnerable place and Om just swooped right in. Im starting to try and do all those things. I don't know that H notices but I think the more I make myself feel better the easier it will get for me. Having a newborn certainly doesn't help my confidence.

I'm always super appreciative of a mans opinion. I do love all you ladies but it's nice to have both sides.

I just don't think he cares enough to notice me moving on. It would probably make him feel less guilty about what he's doing

[JujuB]

"Having a newborn certainly doesn't help my confidence"

Moving on does not need to mean getting to the the gym and meeting someone. It can also mean just enjoying every moment with your baby and boys. Confidence can also come from being a great mom to some incredible kids that need you right now. You are very blessed. Truly, you have everything anyone could want right now.

Everything else will fall into place when its ready.

[cadence]

Per the L he has every right to come and go here as he pleases. It is just as much his house as it is mine.

Are you sure? If so, could you not - when you make the schedule - tell H that you'd like some privacy? If he's left then you don't want him popping in and that you'd like adequate notice and ideally he should start taking the kids to where he's living.

This is what he wanted, so give it to him.

The other thing H said to me before I left was that I always know everything. Like when he said he was leaving just for space for a week or two and I said I'm not stupid H you've done this before I know this story and how it plays out. He said ya because you know everything.

In the other stories you've read, when the LBS tells the WH that they're doing the same thing they've done before, how did that turn out. Did the W ever stop and say "You know, you might be right." or did it just cause them to want to prove the LBS wrong? Because those feelings are real and lasting this time and they know exactly what they're doing?

I did this, T0. It was before I found DB. I said, "you're doing the same thing you did in 2014 and it's going to turn out the same way." ... Guess who did not agree with me? Nope, it's real this time. Really really real. The whole "my life is a mess and I'm unhappy and it's all her fault" was just a coincidence!

He even made reference to it in MC. "I made a mistake when I came back. I should have stayed away from her." ... OUCH.

Also, if H says you know everything, my guess was that was him telling you he did not appreciate your mind-reading. Inherently, it is disrespectful to try to tell someone you know them better than they know themselves. And it is an invalidating trap that I have fallen into myself, in the past. Now I know better.

I want to be done. I want to not care.

There's the D word! I'll let it slide, since you are referring to yourself this time. But I will remind you again, there are posts on this here forum where someone uses the D word and it just meant they felt like they wanted no more. But feelings change.

My guess is what you really want is detachment. So focus on finding that and not letting his actions impact you.

I just don't know that I should make my statement about me. Because he says it's always what I want.

And that was applicable when you were together.

If he's left, all bets are off. If you were not worried about what you wanted after being left, you'd be quite a doormat, wouldn't you? And, in general, people - especially waywards - aren't attracted to doormats.

He left, and you can be darned sure that you're worried about what you want. To do otherwise would be insanity.

[sandi2]

So my questions are -- what does that look like. I know you're probably sick of hearing it but until I am actually detached it is going to be faking it til I make it. I struggle with coming off as a bitch VS lovingly distancing. I know I will get to the point where I don't analyze every interaction and situation BUT I'm not there at this moment.

I know we use the term "lovingly" distancing, but I'm wondering if it's throwing you off just a bit. If you removed the word, "lovingly", and just think of distancing....would you have a better picture? Don't replace "lovingly" with anger, cold, pouty, or any of those type of negatives. Just think about distancing. Perhaps you need to work on plain ole distancing, before you can take on lovingly distancing, b/c of how you are so focused on what your H is thinking. (Just a thought).

Referring to my previous post of the female acting as if she's not interested........is a version of faking it. Something I heard growing up was "playing hard to get". Some people don't like it, but I honestly believe that is what the female is doing when she feels attraction for the male, but she does not reveal how much she would like to go out with him, or just be near him. Back in the day, if a female revealed too much of her feelings or acted too eager to get the male.......he would quickly retreat. It's his nature to pursue. He likes the challenge, and some will go to great lengths in getting the female. So, the female acts as if she is preoccupied with other things and not romatically interested in him. She lets him think he is chasing her, until she catches him. That's the name of the game. It may sound like a 1950ish movie theme......but I don't think nature is going to change some of this stuff. Although you are still legally M, acting as if you are not interested in being with a WS is as effective as it was before M. You don't have to be hateful.....just don't go out of your way to show how much you care. This is a 180 from what your feelings want to do.

Listen, we fake it all the time! We get up feeling half dead,, and get ourselves ready for work (after being up all night with the baby)......and fake it the rest of the day. We don't like some of our coworkers, customers, or patients, but we fake it with friendliness, patience, and politeness. We really aren't in the mood for sex, but we fake it...........? (Well, you know what I mean). In other words, instead of revealing our honest negative feelings.......we show another side we see as being professional and/or acceptable to those around us.

In showing a picture of how to act toward your WS during detachment,I really like the illustration of the checkout clerk. She gives you a friendly smile, may say something else in the way of small talk while she rings up the purchases, then tells you to have a nice day and she moves on to something else. It doesn't mean there is a relationship beyond the business transaction. You don't ask her personal questions. You take care of the transaction in a nice manner, and then you leave. Personal information, feelings, opinions, are not shared. It is a picture of how to act civil without crossing the line and getting personal or emotionally involved. Sometimes, we have to pretend we are this picture.

So as it is I don't call or text. The only text I initiated was regarding the baby's Dr appointment. Other then that no communication on my end. When he texts I wait an hour to respond normally and only respond if it's kid or bill related.

Good. One little suggestion, don't wait an hour every time.

As far as him coming here -- I started saying hi and I've made a point to head out and let him be with the kids. What the hell else am I supposed to do? I know to ask nothing of him his life or his plans BUT in the same sense I want some consistency for the kids.

I will bring up a schedule in the near future probably the next week or two just not right this minute.

Because...........? You still want him coming to stay overnight, although he doesn't help during the night and he comes and goes when he feels like it. It's really about your need to hold tightly to your end of that rope. Why can't he take the kids to where he is currently staying?

But how does he feel I'm moving on from him when we're still around. I'm not going away this weekend with the boys I have a test Monday but am planning a vacation away for us. We will probably go on the boat Sunday. IWILLnot be inviting H. But how do I formulate a response if he asks about joining us for something this weekend? Not saying he will --- but on the off chance he does. He already told me he had a baby shower for his boss daughter so he won't be around Saturday so I don't have to worry about that.

Well first, it's not when "we" (as in the boys & you) are around him, but rather when "you" are with him. He will always have the boys, but it doesn't mean he has you. Know what I mean? To answer your question, I believe it's in the attitude he sees in you. The tone of voice you use, your posture, the expression on your face, etc. You can sleep next to a person and be emotionally detached. Here's the thing that most LBS's do not get........the WS senses when their LBS is over them. The problem is that you are scared to death he will actually believe you just might be over him, in spite of you saying you are done. Most LBS's think they have to prove how badly they want to stay M to the WS. I haven't seen that approach work yet. The WS wants what they can't have, and as long as you are assuring him that he has you......he will look at what he can't have. Why? B/c he is wayward, and that's a big part of how his mindset works. You have to act as if he can't have you b/c you aren't interested (not b/c he won't straighten up). If he senses he could really be losing you forever.......there's a good chance it will open his eyes and help set his brain in the right order.

If he asks if he can come along on the boat, simply tell him, "This has been hard for all of us and I'm sure you can understand my feelings when I say I prefer you don't come along". Then quickly end the conversation. If he has the gall to ask you if he can go with you........I wouldn't be too concerned of what he thinks about your answer. He has given up the right to go along on family outings. (But don't tell him he gave up that right, b/c he has to see it lived).

Also-- is he wayward??? I don't know? I'm not sure of an active A although the fact that he's done this before and behaves similarly -- if it walks like a duck quacks like a duck then ...

Not that it matters in definition, but a person can be wayward without engaging in an affair. It begins with a wayward mindset. He is resentful, disrespecting, rejecting and rebelling against the life and the MR he had with you. That is the foundation of waywardness. He is going awry . You knew something was up when he started shaving his privates, and whether or not he has engaged in a PA.....we don't know. But he is in open rebellion, so I think some type of inappropriate behavior is probable. He may be into online stuff, or a number of other things, but there's something he wants to keep separated and secret from you. That is why MC didn't work. He has a secret agenda.

My advice is to stop chasing him, stop worrying about his thoughts of you, stop wearing your feelings on your sleeve, and drop the rope. I think you have to practice these things, in order to really detach.

[Tread]

TO,

Speaking as a man, I agree with Sandi. Detaching from your H will work. The moment he believes that you have lost interest, odds are that he will feel that you have replaced him. That thought alone will drive him crazy.

[Train]

X3.

[leahsue]

And for those of you who may remember, (and you have to be kind of OLD- but hey, it is what it is...) there's a song I grew up on and the repeating phrase is.... " a boy, chases a girl, until she catches him....", which fits very nicely into this tread of advice.

[leahsue]

thread, not tread

[skyhigh]

Agree 100% with Sandi and Cadence.
Stop overthinking, sorry for the 4'x4'.
You have have been giving advice I would have loved/dreamed to have when I caught him the first time. Those ladies have so much knowledge.
TO, we are here for you and we know you can do it.
Life is a journey, it's like hiking, you see the top of the mountain but it takes energy, detours, and pauses to reach it.
Ask your lawyer if leaving his spouse without money for the welfare of the kids can be used as "abuse".