WW, wlc, Waw or What?

[25yearsmlc]

So, went to the doctor with D10 and we agreed to have her see a psychiatrist to figure out what is causing her issues. Maybe it’s just the divorce and the two homes that’s the conflict in her mind,

I can see why you'd want to believe this^^^ and why your w would not.

However, given the givens, I'd prepare for a longer treatment plan and something that might have been dormant before, and unveiled by the crisis of the marriage. Not caused by it, per se.
I have not heard of anyone hearing voices who did not have drugs in their system (obviously not your d) or a psychiatric disorder. My MIL had those symptoms and was periodically treated and hospitalized for it. It's treatable. I'm just saying not to assume it's all about the divorce. Hearing voices is not like having trouble sleeping.

Not to alarm you, just to say check it out fully and sooner rather than later.



but she is terrified of going to the doctor regarding her issue, so if she in fact was making up stories of hearing voices, they probably would have stopped by now. Alternatively, she would start to lie and say they were not there anymore. Therefore, it is probably real. We will see what happens.

Hopefully its just something temporary, but if it isnt, I'm sort of relieved that it triggered when she is so young and have loving concerned parents around (not that our loving concern would ever go away, but i could be more difficult to see her problems if she was off to college or something like that).

yes^^^^

XW have gone from not considering it anything serious, to being angry with me because i want to have D10 examined, to being upset that D10 would risk being diagnosed with something serious that wasn’t really very serious, to now agreeing to let her see a psychiatrist. Is that fog lifting? Or normal behavior? In fact, I haven’t seen any major foggy behavior from XW, at least not compared to other stories I read.


who knows? Lots of these questions are not answerable. But she's present for d10 now, right?


Are there anyone out there that had a non-foggy WS leave and eventually return? I have mentioned it before, but I’m slightly worried that XW isn’t a WW, but a WAW. That concerns me (I think a WW would be easier to “win back” than a WAW, I don’t know)…

I spent a whole lot of time wondering about MLC versus WAH (time I'll never get back) and realize now that since your course of action is the same, it's pointless to wonder.

I think Your real question is how much hope there is...

Labels aside, from what I can tell, your w is going to need the divorce and time "off" to reflect and face the damage, and feel both the ups and downs of her choices, to figure things out. Like a puzzle you cannot do for her.

My suggestion is to Release her to her "mission" and go on yours. I think part of her inner narrative is that she can come back to you "later" and pick up the pieces , along with "the kids are resilient."

I know a MLC H (or WAH or whatever) who said he left and he "knew" he was doing wrong but felt that he HAD to b/c he deserved to be happy and he wasn't happy where he was i life, and the m was the easiest thing to change in his mind...so he divorced his w

but in the back of his mind he felt that he could return to her and the kids in -5- or so years...if he wanted to...

it was only when she became truly detached, that he feared his back up plan was not so great. He realized suddenly that SHE MIGHT NOT WANT HIM BACK and the kids might not see him the same way - and they were aging - , that he faced himself and more or less snapped out of it.

I think that was a solid year or two after the split. And they are in piecing and it's harder than you think it might be, when all you want to do, at the moment is get your w and your old life back. So it's harder for you to say "wtf just happened? How am I going to trust my perceptions of w in the future?"

Also, I think you mentioned or asked about dating. I totally understand wanting to as I'm approaching that time as well. I always assumed I'd wait a year if something were to happen to H (like death, not divorce...)

H is overtly with his AP and naturally that bothers me for obvious reasons. But I also know that my moving on with my life is NOT proved by dating nor is my not dating, proof that I am stuck.

Frankly I'm more concerned with being fair to men I date, b/c I do feel dating might feel really reactive at the moment. Like too many comparisons, or triggers.

On the other hand, I miss the companionship and intimacy - and yet I'm also nervous about it too. NOT EASY to decide...maybe it'll just happen naturally.

I do think you need to act mysterious with your w as much as you can, however. Not at the expense of the kids (they need you to be their rock), but otherwise.



and "I HAVE to do this...".

Where does that leave you?


Also, did any of your waywards that eventually returned, live in a normal relationship with the other person. (you read all these crazy stories of weird relationships...)

not sure what you mean or are asking. Do the WAW's ever return to have decent m's again, with their former spouses OR the APs?

About 6-15% of marriages are between former spouses, btw. (Depending on who does the survey). They tend to fare better the 2nd time around and report more depth and contentment.

As for marriages that began as 2 extra marital affairs, they tend to have higher divorce rates...it's already 75% for 2nd marriages, and I think the ones that are based on affairs is just over 80%.

Is that what you are asking?

may I suggest that before you anticipate the problems associated with piecing, just be here now.

OR if it helps you, examine the reality of what it might mean and whether you KNOW anything. I do think you have a shot at your w wanting to return, but I don't know
what it would look like.

In my case, since this is the 2nd time around, I am not here as an LBSer. (though I admit a small part of me holds onto irrational thoughts of what an awakening would look like in H). I know he once said if the m ended, he'd "just win me back later"...which annoyed me then and annoys me now.

I filed for D. That's not to say I don't think about h often. Every day in fact. And I miss what we once had. A lot.

But as he is now, and has been for over a year, no I can say I do not miss him. I'm not saying that to console myself. I'm being painfully honest with myself.

Sometimes I think he's like a loving uncle who now has dementia. I cannot deal with who he is now, nor can I take his behavior personally. But I can recall what he once was like...but will not be again. I can love who he was, but not who he is.

I wonder how or why he could behave so badly towards me, how he could lose the r's he had with our children and me, (although I have to assume he believes that in time all will be forgotten & he'll feel like a good dad. His dad is on his 4th m, and h could not stand him for years but now, wants to get his approval big time...

b/c I cannot wrap my brain around someone who would let those r's fall apart I must assume he expects a later rapprochement.

OR Maybe a new replacement family will allow him to run/hide from the wreckage, permanently...)


You may feel otherwise. You have reason to.

Though I'm moderately concerned that you still feel your m was very good, ONLY b/c it makes it harder to know what you can do differently. (I actually feel it's better to pinpoint something for you to work on so that you don't feel powerless.)

I mean, I think it's good news to hear about what you can work on...it's empowering in a sense. Anyhow...


This below may help you, or it may crush you, but at some point you will need the analysis.

I try to contemplate the seismic shift in h that would be needed for a recon to happen.

it would mean my h would need to

1) see how badly he has acted AND to feel true remorse, not justification

2) to face the full wreckage he has created in his life and ours, which might mean retracting his insistence on how right/happy he is...


3) want to make amends (as opposed to silent, unexpressed regret or self pity)

5) be willing to start making amends to repair the r's

AND then

6) stay determined to keep at it, despite facing resistance from our kids and not having a guarantee of forgiveness and reward - b/c I think he'd want to KNOW we'd all forgive him in time, or he might not bother working very long at it...

When I see all these factors ^^^^ I realize how unlikely it is. Which hurts, but helps with acceptance, that this long long m is over...

But what if?? What if all^^^ that all happened??

well then, I let myself wonder about myself. MY wants and needs...would I ever really see him the same way? How could I? There are things I now know, that are impossible to unknow.

Would I ever feel loving and trusting enough to marry him, again? How would our children view me or him, then?

--- Even though I'm one to say "never say never!"...

Anyhow it's at those^^ moments when I realize, oh, my, it's over for good. It cannot be repaired or regained. It's shattered into too many pieces...

This^ is heartbreak.

I must change my trajectory in life - or remain mired in my pain forever. I have choices to make.

This is not what I planned or wanted. But it's also not death. And I have children who need to see me happy and healthy and not as a victim.

I need to be happy and healthy and I deserve to be happy and loved and valued.

This is the only chance I can show them what it means to be deeply & wrongly hurt, and to then rebuild a good, joyful life anyway... This is the only life I have and I'm in my 2nd half, as it is.

Time to make myself get out of my head and start making choices without h in mind.