Great post and I do agree with much of what you are saying. Sure, there are many unmet needs in a lot of M's, but I think what I was trying to tell Wsh is that he is not all to blame.
Sure there are things he could have done to fulfill his W's needs, but nothing he done/did deserved to be cheated on. It was a conscience decision his W made so for her to place the blame on him is hurtful and irresponsible. [color:#3366FF] I did say, in bold print - that Affairs are always wrong, but they are not all alike.
In Wsh's case, while he says he has owned his issues, when he posts here, it ends up more about her bad choices, which none of us can fix or address. She is not here trying to save the m.
I'm trying to shed light on how pointless it is to keep saying that his wife was wrong. No one is arguing that she was right. Explaining how she might have seen her m and made her choices is not making her right and him wrong.
My other point is that it's empowering for us to have things in US to work on, it's not a criticism, it's an observation...which was a painful insight for me to come to.
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To betray a spouse by having an A is the most selfish and inconsiderate act someone can do to the person they chose to love. It is all about them at that point. The resentment they have towards their spouse is still no reason to cheat. They should leave before taking such actions. Okayyyy
Who is in favor of an affair? How does this^^^ help?
How does this^^ help an LBSer to become who we say we wants to become?
I know you are just trying to shed some light on why an A can occur and not actually condoning a spouse having one. I'm glad you get this..
I will also read Sandi's post in regards to the mindset of a woman and what brought her to the decision of having an A.
I can't do justice to Sandi's insights or wisdom. She's here posting anyway. With that being said I still will not allow my W to tell me her A is all my fault. Period. You can certainly refuse to believe her, but you have no control over her beliefs or actions.
I was here...as an LBSer. For a long time...
When I challenged my h's choices, which I still think were selfish, I got nowhere.
I hope someone can benefit from what I learned b/c there was a whole lot of well reasoned and well articulated arguments I used, to no avail. And we had children to consider too... The fundamental premise of DBing is to do what works and to work on us.
without taking these^^ fundamentals in, (for real) we will fail at DBing.
It is her fault and I don't think Wsh should believe it is all his fault as well. Okayyy
who said it was "all his fault"? I was careful with my word choice. Gosh, I hate to beat a dead horse, but
My point was that by focussing on the affair and blaming her, WSH gives up all his power and doesn't grow. Hence the comment that by finding flaws in ourselves, we are empowered. I really believe If a MC told me - or if I believed - that I had been a flawless perfect wife, that nothing I had down was wrong or in error, I would have felt temporarily vindicated.
And THEN, I'd have been hit with despair b/c I would know that nothing I could ever do in any marriage would give me peace, or security. I'd be powerless, always a victim. ..
They can say what they want to justify their actions, but at the end of the day...no one can make you do anything.
Correct!
So it is up to the LBser to do what the LBSer can to become who they want to become. It is not up to the WAS to "make us" feel or do something.
My goal for someone here (once they are out of shock), is almost always to redirect the LBSer to their own path, which is all they control.
I do this for a reason.
we all have to Do what we need to do to change for ourselves...and paradoxically, to increase the recon chances. This is a site for people who want to save their m's--- and the WAS is not here. .
Look, I spent more than my first year here, blaming and fuming at my h. I was furious and deeply hurt, and spent SO MUCH TIME asking WHY??? There was no OP that I knew of- though you could argue that Alaska was his mistress. To this day I think h was "Wrong" to leave me and our daughters, to pursue a place/job/singledom or whatever. I had to accept things I did not understand, let alone agree with.
it's a year I'll never get back. I gave that year up to my anger and victimhood. I did that.
Some of us decide that we don't want to reconcile, or that we can't, or that it's not going to happen anyhow, and so we want to just survive this and then to move on and maybe even flourish.
After giving this^^ years of thought,
I strongly believe it's Not helpful to the LBSer to worry about the WAS much. I think those who flourish most after this, are those who stay on their paths, without focusing on blaming their spouses OR Themselves, in total.
We have to keep redirecting ourselves away from the negatives of someone who isn't ever here...and onto our own paths. "From this day forward"...not saying we should ignore the past b/c how else will we learn what to do with ourselves AND to pick up on cues from our spouses we may have mishandled or not noticed...
When people are reeling, it may be too early to hear this.
But to repeat for emphasis, Affairs are wrong. But not all affairs are alike.
No one thinks they are fine.
And FTR - No, I did not cheat. So I'm not coming from a place of personal bias.
*But I've noticed a theme here. When people want to change to save their m's b/c they realize they've missed the mark in some important ways...and they begin a brave look within, they begin to dig deep and to really grow...(b/c pain can be the touchstone for growth) but then BAM! The LBSer finds out about OPs.
Suddenly their own work comes to a halt! Suddenly, the entirety of their marital problems are ALL due to the horrible selfish completely inexplicable affair....and that's just not productive. And it's rarely accurate.
I think it's counter productive. It think we can get stuck there. I think that is dangerous to our growth and to our marriages and yes, to our happiness and our children's.
Counter productive b/c when we direct our anger (however justified!) at the WAS
they flee faster, not riddled with guilt - but resentful. Sometimes they don't think they'd have had the affair in the first place, if it were not for their flawed spouse.
It's important to understand their perspective without assuming we are being blamed.
Some of this^^^ is just about empathy. While the LBSers say the cheating spouse or WAS totally lack empathy, isn't that exactly what we are showing by rote condemnation and treating all affairs and WAS's exactly alike?
The WAS says they would not have left or cheated if their LBSer had not been wrong
and the LSBer says the WAS is wrong for cheating, no matter what the LBSer did.
Isn't a part of this^^ just plain old scorekeeping - by both?
Life is short. Let's try not to get stuck.
M: 57 H: 60 M: 35 yrs S30,D28,D19 H off to Alaska 2006 Recon 7/07- 8/08 *2016* X = "ALASKA 2.0" GROUND HOG DAY I File D 10/16 OW DIV 2/26/2018 X marries OW 5/2016
