Wow what a difference a day makes? Seems like the thread has lulled to a murmur. Is Monica on one of her cleaning sprees? Is Phoebe giving a message? Is Rachel just looking hot as ever flaunting it at the coffee shop?
Betesy, I just wanted to say thanks for your support. I learn lots about myself and lots about life from your inspiration on my thread and here on yours.
We have talked about all of this and you know where I stand. I completely support you. You deserve to have all that you desire. No one knows him better than you and no one knows you and your children better than you. This is your decision, no one elses.
That being said, all on the BB just love you and want you to succeed. There are many positives here, MOSTLY HIM NOT PUSHING FOR PAPERS. The everyday interaction is great.
Before you send a letter, let me ask you a question. A friend of mine asked me, what if you just acted the part of withdrawing, detaching, and moving on with your life instead of communicating your intention to her? I know you had done this in the past with the family vacation and it worked to some extent. Would he ever feel the real threat of loss? Now I don't think this would work for me because of our communication problems all along, but I'm not so sure.
You are doing just fine! I think it is great that you are pouring your heart out to your H and telling him how you feel and the "Deal Breakers" as well. There comes a point in your life when enough is enough.
Many of us are in the same sitch as you and I truly believe that "Actions" speak louder than words. If he is on the fence, go over and kick him off by doing things that show you are moving on. It does work, it has worked for me in the past with my W. They come back running, but you better be ready to not fold. Make sure that when he does come back, he faces his demmons and don't let him into your life until the two of you are "Healed".
We all believe in you, you can do it and you know what? We are the strong ones. I too thought like you, I though that my W was the rock and I leaned on her too much. She wasn't strong enough. It took me this entire year to figure out that I am the rock of our R. I always sold myslef short. I hope that you don't sell yourself short.
Man, I've never heard of a fish called Caprice. Must be some Rocky Mountain Oyster reference Merrick.
Oh and by the way, I changed my name cause I had to out this thread to my W's L during our depositions. LOL It's the only name I could come up with fast enough when I rushed home to change it.
CB PS If you don't know who I am, we had a roof top rendevous a few weeks ago. LOL
I believe that dreams are more powerful than facts,that laughter is the only cure for grief. And I believe that love is stronger than death
Hi Betsy and Pam, I thought I would come over and say hi.I'm having computer problems so I can't get on as much as I like.
But I wanted to thank you for coming to my thread and holding my hand for the day.I'm all better now.I got the new old me back.I noticed I bounce back faster.I think it is because of my friends on the board.
LaterFriends. Briget
The grass is always greener over the septic tank... Erma Bombeck
Treat hate with Love... DR. Martin Luther King
The lists of things to consider has had me thinking (considering).
Betsy,
I just want to reiterate that I came to this point in my relationship. Husband was stalling out of fear. He knew he didn't want to lose me, but was scared to come home.
I told him, "At this point, I don't feel like my life would change all that much if we got divorced. You and I have so little interaction in each others lives. I'm ready, whichever way you decide. But you must decide."
And he did.
I told him recently that I was torn. I felt sad for all the time we were separated...but that I felt like it was good for us. And that I was having a difficult time reconciling those conflicting feelings.
He smiled. Said he understood. And said, "That time away from you made me cherish you more."
Conflict resolved.
Just to make sure my opinion is absolutely clear to all who read this.
I think giving this sort of push to choose one way or the other, only is in your interest if you have been doing some solid DBing for several months.
If you have not given your Walk Away a new image of you, a better, stronger, happier image...then forcing them to make a decision will only backfire.
On behalf of my roomies, I'm checking in. But briefly, because I am swamped here at work and am the only person in the office today.
CB--I'm still laughing at your clue. Thank goodness I remember some basic Italian--did I tell you I had 2 years of it in college? I'll check in with you over at your place.
Briget--I'll pass a plate of cookies and a cup of coffee your way. After all, doesn't Monica do that sort of thing? The only problem here in our 'hood is that Meredith and I are both shoo-in's for Monica. Pam is much more Rachel. I suppose I could attempt to be Phoebe if Meredith really wants me to--it's a stretch, but I might be able to brush up on my acting skills. Anyway, I'm glad to see that your spirits have improved from earlier this week.
Seattle and PIB--Big hugs to you both. After reading Wild at Heart, I'm holding on to the letter. Not because I don't think I should (quite the contrary) but because I plan on discussing this with him after MC session tonight.
The message of the book was startingly clear and it was like receiving a bolt of awareness from above. The gist of the book is that society emasculates men in many ways. The first arrow to a man's heart is thrown by his own father. And if the mother has not figured this out, contributes to further emasculation. Mr. Wonderful could be the poster boy for this book's examples.
I'm not going to enumerate the myriad bullet points of evidence to support this theory, but the topic of emasculation has come up in every round of counseling since we have been engaged.
The author also goes on to say that men need something to fight for. And that a man never goes to a woman for strength, but to offer it.
I realize that Mr. Wonderful has NEVER fought for me: he's thrown me into situations where I've had to be the strong one and pick a course for myself (and consequently him and our family). And then he's felt low and resentful of me. So while I got stronger, he kept walking away from the fight--letting me fend for myself while he walked away with his tail between his legs and his masculinity questioned.
No wonder I have felt so unworthy and unloved.
This set up has been terrifying for me and ever present. And I realize that it's STILL the case. He's waiting for me to step up to the plate and make a decision so we can continue this same dance. And I'm not going to allow that to happen.
MC told me last August that in order for Mr. W. to get off the fence, he was going to have to push some buttons and make him angry. At that time, we were both scared he would get pissed off enough to quit MC altogether. Well, he did without confrontation, so what do we have to lose?
To summarize: HE must be the one to make a choice. Either way will require a fight for him. Either way will help him come to terms with his masculinity issue. He will have to fight feelings of worthlessness, failure and disappointment if he chooses to divorce me. If he fights for me, he will have to work very hard at pulling himself back together again.
Frankly, I feel at this point as though the former is the best resolution for me. I'm tired of being thrown into circumstances where I keep having to learn strength. The stronger I become, the weaker he gets. And guess what? Either choice he makes will result in me getting stronger.
The question is: will he resent me for it anyway?
I know that he will phone me tonight after the C session and ask me about it. I'm going to let him know that the purpose of going back is not to save the M but for C to counsel me as he guides Mr. Wonderful to making a decision.
Since I'm going to have to be the one to goad him, I'm assuming the role of William Wallace (one of my beloved Scottish idols) and go pick a fight. Either way, I win.
Going to step off the podium, and get back to work. I might not be back on until next week sometime. Cuz I'm heading to Seattle tomorrow to see a few of my favorite BB friends.
TTFN,
Betsey
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
I've been circling around the same issues, for awhile now.
One of the things I've been pondering...
Has my husband purposely been vauge about his NOT cheating on me because he feels that as a 'real man' he should have been? And is shamed that he's not out conquering women?
One of the reasons I ponder this...
When we began dating, during our separation, he invited me back to his house.
I let slip that I had a fantasy that he was living in absolute filth. That the house was a God-awful mess. And that this idea soothed my wounded heart. (Wince...I know..bad DBing moment.)
In any case, he quickly retracted his invitation.
NOW I know that he was living in such filth.
When I asked him about it recently, he said that I reminded him how bad it really was and he didn't want me to see it.
Between us DBers...I think he didn't want to affirm my fantasy either. EVEN THOUGH IT WOULD BRING ME COMFORT.
I hope this is making sense. The point I'm trying to make is that he's known that him not cheating on me would be a huge comfort for me. But he didn't tell me. And the only reason I can imagine that he wouldn't tell me (until recently) was that he felt emasculated by the fact that he wasn't cheating on me.
Which if that's the case...is irrational.
Sigh.
I'm going to go see if I can get that book through my library.
Briget, so glad you dropped in. Try to make this a regular stop, o.k? You don't know it, but I am one of your biggest fans! I asked Betsey and Mer to go read your stuff because I just love your attitude. I find you very colorful, and I mean that in the nicest way possible! I decided a long time ago that (if such a thing existed) I would read a whole book about you, and be cheering you on the whole time.
Rachel??? Come on Betsey! What is THAT about? I don't even have good hair...
PIB, I wanted to add to your statement about not attempting Betsey's route unless you've been solidly DBing. Also, don't do it unless you are truly prepared for which way it could go. I believe in what Betsey is doing because she has a sense of peace over it. It is not an ultimatum to her H in the sense that she is not throwing it out there as a thinly disguised way of hoping to scare him into coming back. It is not manipulative- it's just honest and straightforward.
And, believe me, I KNOW all about manipulation! I used to be the queen of it, as a matter of fact.
Bets, I'll miss ya this weekend! Hopefully, people will pitch in and hold down the fort. I know I'm not interesting enough to do it on my own!!! Seattle crowd, be good to my DB Goddess!
PIB--The book is a hot item here in our library system. I finally had to buy it because the wait list was so long that I wouldn't get it until late June. It's a worthwhile read, even though for some, the references to scripture might seem hammering and frequent. I'm a religious person, so it didn't bug me, but it might others.
Lights--Darlin, I sent you an e-mail (actually 2). Hope you get them--and thanks for your offer.
Pam--You ARE Rachel! You're the most even keeled and grounded one of all 3 of us. Whenever Meredith or I go hog wild on our own tangents, you are the calm voice of reason. And you DO have the hair for being a real life Rachel.
Okay, I just read my cainercast. How spooky is this:
Don't put all your cards on the table. I offer you this advice, not because your hand is weak but because it is stronger than you think. Imagine that you have been dealt an ace which, as every gambler knows, can have a flexible value in certain games. Each time you look at it, you assume that it represents a problem. Really though, seen from another perspective, it is a most valuable asset. You can 'win' in a key area of struggle or debate, but only if you don't accidentally give away something that you ought to keep quietly to yourself for a while. Next week's eclipse creates an amazing window of opportunity in your personal horoscope.
Well, that's all I needed to read for myself today. And I AM a winner!
Back to the grind!
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
